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Lobster
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 2040
Location: Somewhere under the Sea
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 Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:05 am Post subject: |
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Sorry, but something bout this whole story just doesn't sound right. You wanted to make a point about a piddly amount of 5 rmb? The driver did? Bystanders called the police? You didn't ask the police what you should do to resolve the situation? They made no suggestions? Your school is ready to dismiss you for 5 rmb? You have an 11 p.m. curfew in your contract?
Here's a word to the wise. When someone pushes you here, fall to the ground and start writhing in apparent agony. Clutch your chest and gasp for air. Off to the hospital in an ambulance. Lawsuit time. Knock their teeth out? That's jail time or a nice hospital bill for you to pay.
Are people here drinkers? If so, what kind? You should know what kind of drunk you are: lustful, belligerent, happy or stupified. Know your buzz and compensate accordingly.
RED |
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jayjjasper
Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 344
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| Here's a word to the wise. When someone pushes you here, fall to the ground and start writhing in apparent agony. Clutch your chest and gasp for air. Off to the hospital in an ambulance. Lawsuit time. Knock their teeth out? That's jail time or a nice hospital bill for you to pay. |
Now I may not think that a physical confrontation is the right path (mainly due to the apparent insurmountable odds one may have to face) but surely tht would be better than fronting injury which would be one of the most cowardly things attempted in any extreme circumstance. |
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Lobster
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 2040
Location: Somewhere under the Sea
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| Posted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:53 am Post subject: |
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It's not an extreme situation. You're not on the front lines defending your country. You're not protecting your wife from some maniacal fiend. You're getting shoved around by some irate local. Sorry, but that exactly what a local would do. Make a big fuss and try to soak you for as much cash as possible. You seem to have some weird sense of what an "extreme situation" is or know the difference between cowardice and creative drama.
In this particular situation, think about what the outcome would have been if the OP had followed this tack instead of what he did or getting into a "brave" physical confrontation.
RED. |
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jayjjasper
Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 344
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:17 am Post subject: |
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| In this particular situation, think about what the outcome would have been if the OP had followed this tack instead of what he did or getting into a "brave" physical confrontation. |
I suppose if you read my post I did express an opinion that "pelting" the driver would bring about the likely unfortunate outcome.
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| Sorry, but that exactly what a local would do. Make a big fuss and try to soak you for as much cash as possible. You seem to have some weird sense of what an "extreme situation" is or know the difference between cowardice and creative drama. |
Red,creative drama in this case is a lie to extract cash much the same as a fake insurance claim which is justified by the assertion this is what a local would do which is not only a generalization but also false assumption based on predigest. Your experience may lend this kind of behavior due to your experience but to justify a lie as a defense is unnecessary and certainly doesn't say much for the character of those who practice "fraudulent behavior" as a method of getting the better of a situation. I find it strange that you would find my reaction to this kind of behavior "weird" as the universal understanding of standing up for yourself, which may not include violence, certainly doesn't advocate taking a fall. Not only that but the tactical advantage given to an irate driver upon your falling to the ground within boot distance should be noted, as Chinese tort lawyers are not known to chase taxis nor are the Chinese noted for their enthusiasm for getting involved as witness of events.
Just for the record, have you ever tried this advice that your handing out and have you been successful in staging an insurance fraud at the expense of a driver, who may not be insured for this kind of conflict and who is never likely to make good on any judgement (that is if after spending all your cash to take to judgment) would be suit proof due to lack of coin and besides are you really sure there is a legal instrument in place to actually collect future earnings. Sorry, but your advice is not only bad on so many levels and cowardly to boot, it is just plainly not well thought out and impractical not to mention seemly offered by someone who has never practiced this kind of tactical maneuver. |
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Lobster
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 2040
Location: Somewhere under the Sea
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:23 am Post subject: |
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Silly Jasper/Igor. It's not insurance fraud. There is no insurance involved. You wouldn't know a joke if it jumped up and bit you in the butt. 
RED |
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RiverMystic
Joined: 13 Jan 2009
Posts: 1986
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 4:17 am Post subject: |
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I had a friend who was assaulted in public in Shangahi, when he had a minor traffic accident. The other driver got out of his car and started throwing punches. Moments later a dozen other Chinese guys joined in, kicking and punching my friend from behind. Luckily a cop stopped by and the guys backed off. Later the Chinese driver rocked up to the police station with smashed glasses and a ripped shirt to file a complaint. My friend had not touched his shirt or glasses.
The moral of the story? Tread carefully. Whatever story you have, the other guy's story is the one that will be believed nine times out of ten, no matter how fabricated their story may be. The Chinese are the victims, the foreigners are the aggressors. This is the Chinese story they are told a million times at school and see a million times on TV/media/internet. Let's call it "the dominant narrative."
And remember its the 80th celebration... er.. I mean commemoration... of the Japanese invasion. Not a good time to cross the locals. Let's see how many extra deaths they tack onto the grand total of war dead this time round. It goes up every few years. |
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Opiate
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 630
Location: Qingdao
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 8:50 am Post subject: |
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| jayjjasper wrote: |
| false assumption based on predigest. |
uh....based on what?
Predigest? Is that when a cow eats whatever it is a cow eats then vomits it back up to eat it again? That entire post sure reads like something that comes out of a cow. Just not from the end it eats with. |
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askiptochina
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 488
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 9:42 am Post subject: |
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| He only brought me about 100 meters and he didnt bring me where I wanted to go so I didnt pay him. |
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| She also said that if I don't go to the meeting I might be put on the Chinese Blacklist, which would prevent me from living in China. |
That's Chinese jedi mind tricks there. Some kind of reverse psychology crap. If you don't go, wouldn't your chances be higher to be put on a blacklist? If she is being smart, she is testing you. If you think you are guilty you will try to not go.
Here is what I would do. Take a photo of where you wanted to go. Anything in the photo like your apartment or well lit area would make a case for there to be at least confusion. Then take a photo where he dropped you off. If there are no bus stops, no crosswalks, etc... make a case that there was no reason or need to be there that night.
If they say you paid ZERO, and the total would have been less than 10 to your house, then you can argue that you had to take a second taxi and shouldn't be expected to pay 5 two times, which is more than the cost of the route you needed to take. That is why you didn't pay him. It was not that you were drunk, it was not that you were pissed.
What did you do after this incident? Walk home? What route did you have to take from the location of the incident to where you wanted to go (I am assuming home). Get a map out and draw a line with a black marker how far he drove. Draw a line with a red marker how much further you needed to go. Then, it's a rather easy formula to see how much you owe. Just make the guy look stupid. Don't worry about the money. Make them feel like idiots for calling you in.
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| In fact, do not even mention drinking at all. |
Right, if they bring it up say it was not alcohol but cigarette smoke they might have smelled because you were with Chinese friends who smoked. Boomerang that accusation onto a Chinese person. |
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urbanversion
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Posts: 426
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 10:48 am Post subject: |
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check
out party b's obligations: observe relevant laws and regulations,
respect ethics and customs. |
@ choudoufu: I pay no heed to 'rules' that say I can't have a girlfriend or friends stay over night in my campus flat, nor that I have to be back by 11 or so on and so on.
It is all bluster and has no basis in law and they know it. When you call them on the fact that Chinese teachers are shacked up and living together unmarried, their arguments fall apart.
And we all know young chinese NEVER stay out after 11 pm in net bars, discos and pubs don't we? 
As one poster said, reverse psychology... |
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dean_a_jones
Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 1151
Location: Wuhan, China
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:01 am Post subject: |
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| urbanversion wrote: |
I pay no heed to 'rules' that say I can't have a girlfriend or friends stay over night in my campus flat, nor that I have to be back by 11 or so on and so on.
It is all bluster and has no basis in law and they know it. When you call them on the fact that Chinese teachers are shacked up and living together unmarried, their arguments fall apart. |
Maybe, but the smart thing to do would be to stay away from that contract in the first place, or negotiate it out. I agree, its stupid to allow them to treat you like you are 15 years old.
Nevertheless, I am guessing you would be a bit miffed if they decided their obligations to you in the contract 'had no basis in law' and they decided they would pay some of them 'no heed'. Just seems smarter to have a good contract rather than a badass attitude.
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| And we all know young chinese NEVER stay out after 11 pm in net bars, discos and pubs don't we? |
When mine do, they are stuck out for the night (or rent a room) which is not something I particularly fancy having to do. If it's a campus rule, then don't live on campus.
These pitfalls are so easy to avoid if you bother setting your terms before you sign yourself up for a year. |
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Lobster
Joined: 20 Jun 2006
Posts: 2040
Location: Somewhere under the Sea
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| Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:02 am Post subject: |
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| I pay no heed to 'rules' that say I can't have a girlfriend or friends stay over night in my campus flat, nor that I have to be back by 11 or so on and so on. |
Then either tell them that before you start working for them and get it out of your contract, or move off campus and get your own place. Don't tell them you agree to it to get the job and then break their rules. You can't have it both ways. The lights are starting to come on.
RED |
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jayjjasper
Joined: 27 Aug 2011
Posts: 344
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| Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 10:38 am Post subject: |
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Opiate
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| Predigest? Is that when a cow eats whatever it is a cow eats then vomits it back up to eat it again? That entire post sure reads like something that comes out of a cow. Just not from the end it eats with. |
Opiate while your humor is matched by the depth of your reply, let me thank you for pointing out my mistake and the brilliant way in which you commented on your lack of support. It is comforting to know that there are those who go to great lengths to present a cohesive statement that not only disagrees but offers a counter point. The cow "analogy" was right up your grain chute as farm witticisms seems to be your forte ..
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Quote:
I pay no heed to 'rules' that say I can't have a girlfriend or friends stay over night in my campus flat, nor that I have to be back by 11 or so on and so on. |
While I may not agree with the pounce on the driver scenario, there is a certain logic to this as it IS easier to get forgiveness than permission in china and renegotiation of contract obligations are ongoing and why should cohabitation and visitation issues be any different than say, hours of classroom attendance or office hours suddenly mentioned without an inked in obligation. Of course a good clear contract would be the best order of the day, however, when is that ever available and offered without inadvertent changes not often favoring the employee. I often break the rules and in lieu of discovery offer an alternative to the written requirements that would swing the pendulum my way. |
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urbanversion
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Posts: 426
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| Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 2:42 pm Post subject: re: rules |
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| or move off campus and get your own place. Don't tell them you agree to it to get the job and then break their rules. You can't have it both ways. |
Why must everything be a production. I won't rent off campus because that is over 1,000 a month wasted...those rules have no basis in law. They are just doing it to exercise their authority, and prevent foreigners sleeping with chinese girls.
One school I worked at had no issue with it, and the FAO knew that all the FTS had girlfriends staying over...and there was no problem with it.
If they won't change the contract, I don't see that as the FT's fault, but their own pigheadedness.
I just went ahead and did what I wanted either way. They back down, or I move on... |
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roadwalker
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Posts: 1750
Location: Ch
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| Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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When does signing a contract have no basis in law?
I'd hate to be put into the position of arguing that the contract that I signed was an illegal contract. Better to negotiate out offending clauses, or quietly ignore them, but under no illusions that they may bring it up later. An unliked, loud, obnoxious teacher will find the contracts enforced to the letter. A popular teacher who can get along with staff will more likely be given slack. |
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dean_a_jones
Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 1151
Location: Wuhan, China
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| Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2011 11:16 pm Post subject: Re: re: rules |
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| urbanversion wrote: |
Why must everything be a production. I won't rent off campus because that is over 1,000 a month wasted...those rules have no basis in law. They are just doing it to exercise their authority, and prevent foreigners sleeping with chinese girls...If they won't change the contract, I don't see that as the FT's fault, but their own pigheadedness.
I just went ahead and did what I wanted either way. They back down, or I move on... |
So I take it you will pretty much sign any old contract assuming the pay and hours are OK and then just proceed to do whatever you like, assuming that your carefree attitude and indifference to agreements means they will fix their ways or you will move on?
It's no wonder why some schools treat FTs like children and think we are unreliable and untrustworthy... |
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