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askiptochina
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 488
Location: Beijing
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 Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2011 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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Are you yelling directly into their ears?
Perhaps all of these students behave the same because you've made them deaf. |
However the job needs to be met. One time I yelled from the front of the classroom and glared at the last row in the back.
What happened was I told them to be quiet and a student would turn facing me, then when I continued with the lesson he went back to talking to another guy. So, I yelled. It no longer happened in that class. He sat straight and faced me for the rest of the class. Maybe he didn't learn anything, but at least he was paying attention and not talking to his friend after that.
So your deaf comment is pointless. I am not making them deaf, please don't make this out to be what it isn't.
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Did you give her a biscuit?
Perhaps this girl fears you more than she respects you. |
Again? This was a class where I never raised my voice and it wasn't one of the bad classes. What do you get out of making absurd conclusions about this? Are you the one with a problem of students fearing you?
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| In the spirit of Thanksgiving, it may have been better to be thankful that she cogitated instead of regurgitated. |
And this means what? I really don't get your line of thinking. If something works you have to attack the person? Who are you?
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Why did you have to explain anything?
The source of your classroom angst may just be that you are insecure about letting your students do the intellectual heavy-lifting. |
Yea, you are right, let's remove the chalk and the math teachers don't need to explain math problems either on the board that I see students erase before I start my class.
I even see students teaching other students. Let's stop that too.
Ok, pick anything you can to attack. Don't try to have a sincere conversation with someone. If you can just insult and make quick comments to degrade a person, go for it. It's your life. I don't know what you get out of it, but you must be enjoying it.
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| You made post asking for advice, yet you refuse to change |
Making a general assessment to "change" is not really advice. Do you have something specific that I should do? It's easy to say "NO", and it's easy to say "Do something different."
What EXACTLY do you have in mind? Instead of saying "Don't do what you are doing", how about putting things in the positive? What should I do?
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| Everyone here has said yelling and "going ballistic" on students is not a going to solve the problem. |
I don't know about everyone, but those that have are not mentioning anything constructive to do instead. I am asking for advice as it relates to the bad classes, I am not asking you guys should I yell or not. Do you see the distinction? There is a big difference.
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| try learning from other peoples experiences. |
The drawing board is blank, you may paint on it at anytime. What are your experiences? Instead of saying "Don't do ____" how about you tell me what EXACTLY works for you?
Try it, give it a spin, see how it works. I am sorry I even posted here if it was going to be derailed by anti-yelling posts.
I was initially looking for help on a few bad classes.
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| Fact is, when the teacher gets angry and starts shouting, you are losing face whether you admit it or not and the students do lose respect for you. Enjoy the rest of your school year. |
I have been teaching for 8 years, and this has never happened. I have had individuals try to coerce me like this to do otherwise, but it has never amounted to a destruction of respect by the class. Some students actually have individual problems with their study. I see the same students misbehaving in other classes.
You are not even in my classes to make an appropriate assessment. Did you know that the students actually call on some of these disruptive students because they know that those students won't know the answer?
Did you know the other teachers will come into my class before it starts to make sure they are awake? Did you know that they often have these talks with bad students in the hallway?
What I am doing is 5-10 seconds and then we move on usually. For 85% of the time, it is rather successful, 10% of the time maybe I overdo it because the students already know they were misbehaving.
What I am asking YOU and others to comment on is the other 5%. Stop trying to convince me to change my ways to yours 100%. I have my system and you have yours. You can share your experiences without expecting me to completely sever my teaching style.
So, try it. Forget I mentioned yelling, this whole thing derailed my thread. Pretend I never said it. What would you do with the 5% of the problems of not paying attention and not taking notes?
Try something constructive to say this time. Otherwise, I'll just ignore the posts that try to "scold" me for "scolding". |
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Opiate
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 630
Location: Qingdao
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| Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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| askiptochina wrote: |
So, try it. Forget I mentioned yelling, this whole thing derailed my thread. Pretend I never said it. What would you do with the 5% of the problems of not paying attention and not taking notes?
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You were already given advice on the other 5% I believe. Thought it went something like....'ignore them'.
You'll not likely encounter such a large class where everybody is paying attention and taking notes. It would be nice but it's quite rare I'd imagine.
When I have students who do not listen or take notes I like to ask them questions. Sometimes I make them stand. When they can not answer I tell them to check their notes because the answer is there. Of course they do not have any notes. Then I ask another student the same question, a students who does listen. I like to contrast those who just take up space against those who put effort into the class. Is it always effective? Nope. Some people just truly don't give a shit. Ignore them if they are not disruptive.
I have noticed that many students are fairly clueless about note taking. Unless I write something on the board, or specifically say "HEY!!! IT'S A GOOD IDEA TO WRITE THIS DOWN" they mostly won't do it, even the smart ones.
If you've been at this for 8 years I imagine there is more I could learn from you than you could learn from me. Good luck. |
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choudoufu
Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3325
Location: Mao-berry, PRC
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| Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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if you yell, you lose.
the kids are playing with you, it's all a game. they know that
regardless of the grade you give, they will pass. they're probably
making bets as to who can get teacher to turn red and yell the
loudest. you can't hit 'em, and in the end you can't fail 'em.
if the students don't care, you can't force them to. as long as they
aren't disruptive let it go, or you wind up disrupting the class.
tell them to leave. if they ignore you, ask the class monitor to
stand up. then tell the class monitor to remove the offending
student. then sit and wait. it'll all be over in a few seconds. |
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askiptochina
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 488
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Sometimes I make them stand. When they can not answer I tell them to check their notes because the answer is there. Of course they do not have any notes. Then I ask another student the same question, a students who does listen. I like to contrast those who just take up space against those who put effort into the class. Is it always effective? Nope. Some people just truly don't give a shit. Ignore them if they are not disruptive. |
Ah, finally, a rational mind on here. It's interesting you mentioned having them stand up. They don't already stand up? I guess that's something I have skipped thinking about because they are already standing when they speak.
How do you have them take notes? Are they writing what you say or do you have text on the board/screen that they copy?
My reason for them to take notes is not to memorize or work on writing skills, but more to keep track of data so they can speak. I have gone over making lists, word maps, and timelines. Like you said, many don't do it until told to. |
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askiptochina
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 488
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:06 am Post subject: |
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then tell the class monitor to remove the offending
student. then sit and wait. it'll all be over in a few seconds. |
Yea, I am still toying with that idea of using a student to be an authority figure. I am just not ready to make that person a target yet. Perhaps, if I randomly pick a student each time, then a new student would be the enforcer. If one person is always in charge, then the other students might end up resenting them. |
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choudoufu
Joined: 25 May 2010
Posts: 3325
Location: Mao-berry, PRC
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| Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 3:28 am Post subject: |
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| askiptochina wrote: |
| Quote: |
then tell the class monitor to remove the offending
student. then sit and wait. it'll all be over in a few seconds. |
Yea, I am still toying with that idea of using a student to be an authority figure. I am just not ready to make that person a target yet. Perhaps, if I randomly pick a student each time, then a new student would be the enforcer. If one person is always in charge, then the other students might end up resenting them. |
there already IS a student in charge. in most classes (at my
universities anyway) there is a class monitor who can handle
these problems. some use them to make copies or distribute
information. i let them play bad cop. if you don't know, then
when the time comes, in a stern (not loud) voice ask "who's
the class monitor?" just asking that is often enough to induce
proper behavior. |
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askiptochina
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 488
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 4:15 am Post subject: |
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| there already IS a student in charge |
I was never told this, nor do any of the classes seem to have a leader. Random students (possibly assigned for that week) will erase the board, open the computer area with a key, and help get the screen pulled down.
I'll ask though, thanks. |
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El Chupacabra
Joined: 22 Jul 2009
Posts: 378
Location: Kwangchow
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| Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 6:58 am Post subject: |
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| Obstinate Windbag Who Proudly Terrorizes Students wrote: |
I don't know about everyone, but those that have are not mentioning anything constructive to do instead. I am asking for advice as it relates to the bad classes, I am not asking you guys should I yell or not. Do you see the distinction? There is a big difference. |
WE HAVE BEEN GIVING YOU NOTHING BUT CONSTRUCTIVE ADVICE SINCE YOU STARTED THIS THREAD!!!!
BUT SINCE YOU HAVE ALREADY BLESSED YOURSELF, YOU HAVE BEEN IGNORING US AND WHINING THAT WE HAVE NOT BEEN CONSTRUCTIVE.
SO NOW I HAVE TO LOCK MY CAPS KEY AND YELL AT YOU!!
TALK LESS!
LISTEN MORE!
WATCH YOUR BACK!
And now that I've run out air, let me also suggest applying the first two in both the classroom and online forums. Please don't ask for advice if you really don't want it.
Kindly yours,
Nonconstructive Guy Who Can Handle Any Size Class You Throw At Me |
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askiptochina
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Posts: 488
Location: Beijing
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| Posted: Sat Nov 19, 2011 7:43 am Post subject: |
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El Chupacabra,
What did that accomplish? Before your post there were some good posts which didn't address yelling.
Why do you want to destroy threads? Your behavior here is worse than some of the students I yell at. I don't get paid to deal with billigerent posters, so have at it. Perhaps a moderator/admin on this forum will put you in your place or kick you out. |
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