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R. S. Refugee
Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Location: Shangra La, ROK
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The King of Kwangju
Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Location: New York City
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 Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 6:59 am Post subject: |
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Good article, although it doesn't fit the title of the post. The gist of the article is that we can't all agree.
After all the drumbeating on CNN last night, glad to read that I wasn't the only one with a sinking feeling. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 1:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Just another Brit-blaming-it-all-on-America articles. Pretty tiresome. |
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thebum
Joined: 09 Jan 2005
Location: North Korea
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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| i don't agree |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
| Just another Brit-blaming-it-all-on-America articles. Pretty tiresome. |
Don't feel you're being picked on exclusively Ya-ta. He spreads the blame out further than just America. He's got plenty to say about Britain's complicity - and that of certain European leaders, and the Australians too. |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:38 pm Post subject: |
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Here is another article of his that the rightwing press have been whinging about: http://news.independent.co.uk/world/fisk/article2114403.ece
In a nutshell he's suggesting that the Kangaroo court that hurridly tried and executed him for one of his lesser crimes was to make sure the full extent of his crimes, and our complicity in them, were not brought out for public inspection. I suspect there is something to that.
I was very disappointed that he wasn't tried at the Hague. So many of his victims will not get the satisfaction of seeing him tried for his crimes against them.
The whole thing has been a farce. There was regular political interferenece, the defence was not able to question the evidence properly, and was only given 2 weeks to appeal his sentence, and the whole thing appears to have been a circus. He's also come out of it looking rather better than he should have, while we look corrupt, hypocritical and somewhat lacking in our respect for due process, because of our involvement in it. |
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NAVFC
Joined: 10 May 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 10:55 am Post subject: |
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| Big_Bird wrote: |
Here is another article of his that the rightwing press have been whinging about: http://news.independent.co.uk/world/fisk/article2114403.ece
In a nutshell he's suggesting that the Kangaroo court that hurridly tried and executed him for one of his lesser crimes was to make sure the full extent of his crimes, and our complicity in them, were not brought out for public inspection. I suspect there is something to that.
I was very disappointed that he wasn't tried at the Hague. So many of his victims will not get the satisfaction of seeing him tried for his crimes against them.
The whole thing has been a farce. There was regular political interferenece, the defence was not able to question the evidence properly, and was only given 2 weeks to appeal his sentence, and the whole thing appears to have been a circus. He's also come out of it looking rather better than he should have, while we look corrupt, hypocritical and somewhat lacking in our respect for due process, because of our involvement in it. |
OH please. Every time someone spouts a conspiracy theory you lefties eat it all up without proof. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:18 am Post subject: |
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| Bigbird, the trials are not going to focus on the CIA's relationship with Saddam or Bush senior or Reagan. They did not make him kill the Shiites or the Kurds at Anfal. They would have to be on trial to be really mentioned and they won't be on trial. So, your theory is interesting, but it wouldn't hold up in a conventional court room. They would be dealing with Saddam's guilt not that of anyone else. |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Adventurer wrote: |
| Bigbird, the trials are not going to focus on the CIA's relationship with Saddam or Bush senior or Reagan. They did not make him kill the Shiites or the Kurds at Anfal. They would have to be on trial to be really mentioned and they won't be on trial. So, your theory is interesting, but it wouldn't hold up in a conventional court room. They would be dealing with Saddam's guilt not that of anyone else. |
While western complicity might (if Saddam's defence chose to make a deal of it) or might not come up in the actual trials themselves, certain elements of the media might focus on it during such a trial.
For example, if Saddam had been tried for the horrific gassing of Kurds, people might have started discussing how the Americans supplied the chemicals, and apparently continued supplying them knowing how they'd been used. Or they might have begun discussing how Britain set a precedent for gassing Arab civillians in Iraq way back in 1923 (first use of chemical warfare on civillian targets?) with the blessing of our national hero Churchill. To quote the great Winston: "I am strongly in favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes _ [to] spread a lively terror _" |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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Robert Fisk is not the only one putting forward that view:
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A kangaroo court has condemned, and an American puppet government has hanged, Saddam Hussein. And they hanged him not for his many crimes against humanity, but for the execution of 144 people in 1982, during a war, who were accused of plotting to kill him. Does this make sense? Is it a worse crime than the thousands that he killed in 1963 at the behest of the U.S. government? Is it worse than the thousands gassed while the U.S. stood by and covered for him?
Saddam Hussein was a tyrant and was brutal in a brutal world. But his crimes are also those of the United States that used and encouraged that brutality to further its own goals. With the death of Saddam the cases against him of far more grievous crimes will vanish from the docket, cases that the U.S. certainly does not want to see investigated and exposed to their full extent.
The tragedy of Saddam Hussein is not that he was hanged, but that he was made a scapegoat to protect others far more guilty than himself. There are people in the west at the highest levels of government who should have been standing on the scaffold beside him with nooses also about their necks. Justice has not been served, it has been denied.
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http://www.rabble.ca/news_full_story.shtml?x=55999
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