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India Safety
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mnhnhyouh



Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Location: The Middle Kingdom

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most rickshaws dont have working meters. Just bargin before getting in.

h
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JZer



Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Most rickshaws dont have working meters. Just bargin before getting in.


I am no expert but I don't agree. I saw meters being used in Delhi when Indians were in the ricksaw. If you are in Delhi you can tell them you will look at a shop if they take you for free. A guy actually paid me to look at shops. He can me 50 percent of the money he received.
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JZer



Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Traffic accidents kill far more people statistically, than any other single cause, including terrorism.


Using a taxi in China is definitly more dangerous than trains in India. I will look for some satistics.
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JZer



Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.asianresearch.org/articles/2367.html

Quote:
BEIJING - The World Health Organization is calling on China to improve road safety, saying an estimated 680 people are killed each day on the country's highways. WHO officials say the problem is growing worse as the number of vehicles in China skyrockets.


680 people are killed a day due to traffic accidents in China.

Quote:
Brahmaputra Mail train bombing - 1997
Kurnool train crash - 2002
Rafiganj rail disaster - 2002
Godhra Train Burning - 27th Feb 2002
Jaunpur train bombing - 2005
Bombay Suburb Train Blasts - 7/11/2006
West India - 68 dead on way home to Pakistan 20th Feb 2007


How many people were killed in all of these bombings combined?
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mnhnhyouh



Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Location: The Middle Kingdom

PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I try to bargin hard, but also work on the cup of coffee rule. It it isnt worth as much as a cup of coffee in the west, then why get uptight about it.....

h
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the saint



Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Location: not there yet...

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 2:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JZer wrote:
Quote:
Most rickshaws dont have working meters. Just bargin before getting in.


I am no expert but I don't agree. I saw meters being used in Delhi when Indians were in the ricksaw. If you are in Delhi you can tell them you will look at a shop if they take you for free. A guy actually paid me to look at shops. He can me 50 percent of the money he received.

ummm yeah... no expert as you said Laughing
a year travelling in India and meters were non-existant... does that make me an expert Cool
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luvnpeas



Joined: 03 Aug 2006
Location: somewhere i have never travelled

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 3:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meters were defunct in most cities that I visited in 2001, except Bangalore.

Raw numbers are almost meaningless. India and China have triple the population of the USA, and note the USA is the largest of the developed countries. You have to look at per capita statistics.

The very creation of these issues creates a wrong impression. India is safer than most Wesetern countries. Would someobdy request special advice about safety while travelling in Sydney, Paris, or Chicago? Be careful about perpetuatiing ethnic/racial stereotypes.
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chris_J2



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.smartraveller.gov.au/zw-cgi/view/Advice/India

Summary

We advise you to exercise caution and monitor developments that might affect your safety in India because of the risk of terrorist activity by militant groups.
You should pay close attention to your personal security and monitor the media and other local information sources for information about possible new safety or security risks.
You should be particularly vigilant in the lead up to and on days of national significance such as Republic Day (26 January) and Independence Day (15 August), as militants have in the past used such occasions to mount attacks.
On 19 February 2007 explosions on the Samjhauta Express train travelling from Delhi to Lahore in Pakistan killed at least 67 and injured over 50 passengers. Increased security has been implemented on many trains and stations following the attack.
Following a series of explosions on the rail network in Mumbai on 11 July 2006 that killed over 200 people and alleged security threats at airports, alert levels were raised across India with additional security measures put in place at airports and railway stations. Additional security measures may cause delays for passengers.
Following press reports of a terrorist threat in Goa, there is an increased security presence in Goa, particularly in areas frequented by tourists and at the airport.
You should avoid protests and demonstrations throughout India as they may become violent.
We advise you not to travel to Jammu and Kashmir, except for travel to Ladakh via Manali, or travel to Leh by air, because of armed clashes and terrorist activities. The arrest, detention or execution of high profile militants could become catalysts for violence and civil disorder.
Explosions in Srinagar, the capital of Jammu and Kashmir, on 11 July 2006 killed at least five people and injured several others. A number of people were killed and at least 50 injured in a grenade attack on a mosque in Tahab village 40 km south of Srinagar on 10 November 2006.
We advise you to reconsider your need to travel to the north-eastern states of Asom (formerly Assam), Nagaland, Tripura and Manipur because of the risk of armed robbery, kidnapping, extortion and terrorism related incidents. If you do decide to travel to these areas, you should exercise extreme caution. In early January 2007 a series of bomb attacks in Asom resulted in many casualties.
Be a smart traveller. Before heading overseas:
organise comprehensive travel insurance and check what circumstances and activities are not covered by your policy, register your travel and contact details, so we can contact you in an emergency, subscribe to this travel advice to receive free email updates each time it's reissued."

Source: DFAT Australia. No doubt, Canadian, UK & US Governments warn their citizens, too. The rating for India was a 2, on a scale up to 5 (Do not travel).
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the saint



Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Location: not there yet...

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

luvnpeas wrote:
India is safer than most Wesetern countries.

now who's overgeneralising... Rolling Eyes

Look, for mugging, yes India is safer... for typhoid... it isn't. nuffsaid

if you're not used to travelling in a country like India and you live in a place like New York, you'll need advice. It's not better or worse, it's just different.
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JZer



Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
We advise you to exercise caution and monitor developments that might affect your safety in India because of the risk of terrorist activity by militant groups.


I wonder if any government would be brave enough to publish this advice about the US.

We advise you to exercise caution and monitor developments that might affect your safety in the United States because of the risk of terrorist activity by foreign groups. Furthermore one should exercise caution when they are in large cities such as New York, Chicago and Los Angles due to the high number of homocides.
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JZer



Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
ummm yeah... no expert as you said Laughing
a year travelling in India and meters were non-existant... does that make me an expert Cool


In Delhi I think that most auto-ricksaws have meters and I saw them being used when Indians were in the ricksaw. I cannot comment on other cities. I was not in those cities long enough to observe. I only used an autoricksaw twice in Varanassi. I walked around most of the city.
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JZer



Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2007 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the saint, did you travel India for one year non-stop or over a period of time? I am asking because I am interested in traveling India for 6-12 months.
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luvnpeas



Joined: 03 Aug 2006
Location: somewhere i have never travelled

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2007 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the saint wrote:
luvnpeas wrote:
India is safer than most Wesetern countries.

now who's overgeneralising... Rolling Eyes


If you have a point, make it. Is it overgeneralizing to say Londan is safer than Baghdad? No, because the claim is easily backed up by numbers. The claim that India is safer than most Western countries is also backed up by numbers, and those numbers were given.

Quote:
Look, for mugging, yes India is safer... for typhoid... it isn't. nuffsaid


Tyhpoid isn't the topic. The discussion has been about crime, and those were clearly the comments I addressed. Did you think I gave statistics about rates of murder, robbery, and assault to make a point about typhoid?

Quote:
It's not better or worse, it's just different.


That is precisely not the picture being presented here. The attitudes here border on bigotry: applying standards to other cultures and ethnicities not applied to one�s own. Here's how a conversation with Chris-j2 and a tourist would go if the standards were applied equally.

Tourist: Hi. I am thinking of travelling in Australia. Any tips, especially about safety?

Chris:
Australian mass murder cuts off women�s breasts
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Dupas

Australian serial killer keeps trophies from victims
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonard_Fraser

Backpacking? Watch out for serial killers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Milat

And so on. I won�t bother googling 15-year-old train accidents as Chris did.
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chris_J2



Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: From Brisbane, Au.

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

USA is rated at 1, on a scale of 1-5. This compares with India on level 2. Meaning that in an assessment by the Australian Government, the USA is safer than India.

http://www.smartraveller.gov.au/zw-cgi/view/Advice/United_States_of_America

Quote:
I won�t bother googling 15-year-old train accidents as Chris did


Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't 20th Feb 2007 like just this week? Tell the relatives of the 68 who died how safe India is. And it's got nothing to do with racism. luvnpeas has a serious chip on their shoulder.

And it's bizarre that you link to old homicides & serial killings in Australia, when the topic was terrorism on Indian Trains. There has never been a terrorist attack on a train in Australia, or the USA, as far as I know.
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luvnpeas



Joined: 03 Aug 2006
Location: somewhere i have never travelled

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris_J2 wrote:
USA is rated at 1, on a scale of 1-5. This compares with India on level 2. Meaning that in an assessment by the Australian Government, the USA is safer than India.


Repeating your citation doesn't make it more authoritative. The evidence is that your "authority" is misinformed: The US has a higher murder rate, higher robbery rate, higher assault rate, higher overall crime rate than India--by a large margin. Facts.

Quote:
Quote:
I won�t bother googling 15-year-old train accidents as Chris did


Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't 20th Feb 2007 like just this week?


You cited an event from 1997, as well as others that are five years old. Read your own posts.

Quote:
Tell the relatives of the 68 who died how safe India is. And it's got nothing to do with racism. luvnpeas has a serious chip on their shoulder.


Then explain what it does "got to do with." You don't apply your standards and attitudes equally. Tell the relatives of the Utah mall-shooting that the US is safe. Tell the victims of Australia's serial killers how safe Australia is. If you like that snappy "tell it" rhetoric, apply it equally.

Quote:
And it's bizarre that you link to old homicides & serial killings in Australia, when the topic was terrorism on Indian Trains.


The topic was not terrorism until you decided to focus on that to the exclusion of all else. In your case, the "topic" was presenting a distorted, scaremongering picture of a country by listing violent accounts without context. Guess what: it's possible to do that with any country.

Most people were talking about petty theft. The more general topic is safety from crime.
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