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JeJuJitsu
Joined: 11 Sep 2005
Location: McDonald's
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 Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 3:24 am Post subject: |
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| Junior wrote: |
This illustrates a big part of the problem: westerners who have done most to cause climate change are simultaneously the ones still the most protected from its effects. its still not real to much of the first world yet: they can't quite believe it. |
Natural population control. It's a win-win. |
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gypsyfish
Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Junior wrote: |
Its so obvious you haven't studied this, or even followed relevant news reports for at least the past 5 years.
Convincing you of climate change would take too much effort now....
I'll just let time and reality wake you up.
This illustrates a big part of the problem: westerners who have done most to cause climate change are simultaneously the ones still the most protected from its effects. its still not real to much of the first world yet: they can't quite believe it. |
There's not much convincing going on anywhere about this subject. Global warming is about as contentious as the abortion 'debate' in the USA. You're either with me or against me, pro or con, turn or burn (pun intended). Ellen Goodman compares the human role in global warming deniers to Holocaust deniers. There's a lot of condescension on the other side of the debate, too.
I think there's a lot of hubris thinking that man has that much effect. Certainly, man wastes a lot and mucks up things, but I doubt we are changing the climate. I am willing to listen to arguments from the other opinion without automatically dismissing them, but I don't want to listen to ad hominem comments.
There is global warming happening now, but it's a cycle that is clear to historians and scientists. How do we explain the Roman Warming from 200 BC to 600 AD? What about the Medieval Warming from 900 to 1300? Clearly this can't be attributed to industralisation, so what was man doing to cause these periods of warming?
Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, and Triton are experiencing warming trends and volatile weather patterns. How has man f'ed up their climates?
Man causes many problems, I'm just not convinced that we're contributing that much to global warming. |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| gypsyfish wrote: |
| Certainly, man wastes a lot and mucks up things, but I doubt we are changing the climate. |
How about pumping 60 billion tonnes of Co2 per year into the atmosphere that would otherwise not be there?
-or destroying/significantly altering every natural ecosystem by about 95% in the last century? For example forest cover, coral reef, swampland, ancient woodland, heath/moorland has all vanished by about 90% from what it formerly was, to be replaced with concrete. Human settlement is visible from space.
Are you saying none of that has had any effect?
I view it as living in a house where you have taken out the air conditioning, plumbing, removed the roof and every other operating system, because humans have lost touch with the natural world and the way things work. |
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SPINOZA
Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Location: $eoul
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| Posted: Sat Apr 14, 2007 6:55 pm Post subject: |
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| gypsyfish wrote: |
| Junior wrote: |
Its so obvious you haven't studied this, or even followed relevant news reports for at least the past 5 years.
Convincing you of climate change would take too much effort now....
I'll just let time and reality wake you up.
This illustrates a big part of the problem: westerners who have done most to cause climate change are simultaneously the ones still the most protected from its effects. its still not real to much of the first world yet: they can't quite believe it. |
Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, and Triton are experiencing warming trends and volatile weather patterns. How has man f'ed up their climates?
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Interesting you didn't mention Venus, which, despite being twice Mercury's distance from the Sun, is the hottest planet in the Solar System with a surface temperature of over 400c thanks to a thick atmosphere of 96% Carbon Dioxide. Since most (but not all) scientists attribute GW to mainly burning fossil fuels and the world's climate system is very complex and not wholly understood, we'll just have to wait (until 2030) and see, since the damage our pollution today is causing will not become apparent till about then. The penny is bound to drop with even the dimmest of observers. |
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