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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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 Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:01 pm Post subject: Forced office drinking parties illegal: high court |
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http://joongangdaily.joins.com/
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Forced office drinking parties illegal: high court
May 07, 2007
A 29-year-old former female employee of a software game developer won a lawsuit against her boss, who forced her to go out drinking after work. The Seoul High Court ruled yesterday that the 38-year-old boss should pay the woman 30 million won ($32,342) in compensation.
On the first day she joined the company in April 2004, she was forced to drink at a welcome party with her coworkers. She repeatedly turned down the alcohol, and her boss said she could ask a male coworker to drink for her, but she had to kiss the man in return. She said she had no choice but to drink three shots of soju.
That was only the beginning of a series of coerced drinking parties. According to the plaintiff, she had to attend at least two drinking parties a week after work hours. She and her coworkers often had to drink until 4 a.m.
After two months, she quit and filed the lawsuit. She won the initial trial, and the court ruled that she should receive 7 million won in compensation. She appealed, and won yesterday with the court increasing the judgment.
�Forcing a person to drink above his or her limit is infringing on personal rights,� the court ruled. �If he or she suffered emotional distress, then it is an illegal act.�
The court also said employees have the right to their own time after work hours, but her boss violated her rights by forcing her to stay at the drinking parties.
The court issued a press release to promote the ruling. �Forced drinking after work or preventing employees from going home by forcing them to attend such a gathering can be illegal,� the court said.
She also filed a separate sexual harassment suit against her boss for touching her inappropriately and making insulting remarks. Her boss was fined 2 million won in 2005 and fired from the company. |
Now this is pretty interesting. I've known for a long time that ot every Korean enjoys these things. And I've been seeing the resntment build up.
Good to see someone standing up for themselves. |
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ChuckECheese
Joined: 20 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:23 pm Post subject: |
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Isn't drinking with female coworker and groping part of Korean culture?
What's gotten into those Korean judges?   |
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Kyrei
Joined: 22 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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| While it does add one more law to the books, which is annoying, it is a good precedent to have set in courts and I applaud the decision. After working hours no one should be forced to do anything by the company. |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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| She destroyed him:) Got him fired, now this fine LOL...maybe he will jump from a bridge? |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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| I heard that these "office parties" are not as popular as they once were. This court case definitely helps to stop the practice of forced attendance/drinking. I think this court case is definitely a good step for women. |
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Kyrei
Joined: 22 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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| pkang0202 wrote: |
| I think this court case is definitely a good step for women. |
I think it is a good step for anyone. The whole heirarchical system of abuse that is ritualised in companies/society here needs to come to a grinding halt. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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A friend works for the UN and came to Korea a few months ago for a conference on bird flu. A couple months previous to this the Seoul mayor made a big pledge about cutting poktangju out of the work tradition. No more. Etc. And who did she find herself drinking poktangju with after the bird flu conference? The mayor...
Sadly my friend works for a city department led by a guy who still insists on everyone going for poktangju a couple times a week. Sheesh. One day she just cut out early and suffered some background anger from her seniors for a few days after.
I think a lot of Korean males, not just females, wouldn't mind these days going home to their families after work. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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I definately see a division in this. Some people just don't se a problem with excessive drinking.
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp?aid=2875167
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County honors 3 for drinking heavily
May 04, 2007
GOESAN, North Chungcheong ― The local economy needed a boost, so the Goesan county government decided to reward three people who are already doing their part, one drink at a time.
Three government employees were awarded a three-day trip to Jeju Island and a plaque on Tuesday for drinking heavily in local bars for more than 20 years.
�The local economy is suffering because restaurants and bars have few customers at night,� said a government official who declined to be named. �These employees are devoting themselves to boosting the local economy by drinking after work.�
The only problem? One of them had his driver�s license cancelled for drunk driving in 2005.
�I drank with local residents to discuss a local cultural event and was caught driving home because I thought the taxi fare would be too expensive,� said the employee, who refused to be named. �I did not know I would receive an award for drinking and have been doing some self-reflection.�
The award winners were chosen based on recommendations from co-workers, local restaurants and bars. They were acclaimed for drinking with co-workers or local residents at bars for more than 20 years. Goesan county employees called the award the �Drinking Culture Prize.�
Lim Gak-soo, the county head, said in an interview, �I decided to create the award to motivate employees who have been working really hard since I took office in July of last year.� |
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aldershot
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I think a lot of Korean males... wouldn't mind these days going home to their families after work. |
no. nope. IMO the "family" is the biggest resentment for korean males. [generalization]they hate their families[/generalization]. hence the drinking. and me-in clubs. and room salons. and double barber polls. the drinking and whoring is an excuse to not go home to their families. |
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Kyrei
Joined: 22 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 6:10 pm Post subject: |
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I'm with mindmetoo on this on. Lots of younger, newly married men are heavily pressured to get their asses back home and help with the baby and other mundane household chores. It is a reflection on the growing status of women here, which is by no means equal, but getting better.
Sure going out and drinking (etc. wink wink) with coworkers is fun and all that, but being culturally forced to do it has IMHO quite often been negatively looked at by new participants here, expecially the newlyweds. After a few years these young people become older, jaded alcoholics, and as the spousal (pychological/physical) abuse grows, the argument that they are doing it to avoid going home rings truer. Then as they age even more, they make their juniors go through it for no other reason than because they had to. 'Tis a vicious cycle. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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| This is a good decision. I think it is very abusive to make a worker drink when that person doesn't drink. Some people are also allergic to alcohol or don't drink for religious reasons. It is a form of discrimation. I do drink, but I wouldn't want to work for a boss who wants me to drink every single weekend. Granted, there are some months where I do that on my own, but who wants to do that with co-workers rather than friends, and it has nothing to do with productivity. Korean bosses should focus on the bottom-line, making sure they respect their workers, and having an efficient set up and not focusing way too much on Confucianism and employ more Korean Americans who come to Korea to contribute. |
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JongnoGuru
Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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| ChuckECheese wrote: |
Isn't drinking with female coworker and groping part of Korean culture?
What's gotten into those Korean judges? |
RRRRIGHT! This crazy ruling is a shot across the bow of Korean culture, both office & drinking culture. How the hell else are companies to "bind" their employees without these forced-drinking sessions?! How else are employees to get sufficiently blitzed to tell their tyrannical superiors to go fark themselves? See, it all evens out, it's all part of the great Yin/Yang-y harmony of Korea. Yeah, didn't think about that, did you? Stupid judges!
And of course it would be a woman filing this suit, would it not? No man would emasculate himself by publicly announcing he can't hold his own in a poktanju contest. This is the all-too-predictable outcome when you start letting women invade the business world, which is traditionally our turf.
I demand those judges be defrocked! No, it's not defrocked, is it... I demand they be disrobed! Jeez, that can't be right, can it? Disrobed?  Anyway, I want them... stripped of their authoritay! Yeah, that works. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| aldershot wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I think a lot of Korean males... wouldn't mind these days going home to their families after work. |
no. nope. IMO the "family" is the biggest resentment for korean males. [generalization]they hate their families[/generalization]. hence the drinking. and me-in clubs. and room salons. and double barber polls. the drinking and whoring is an excuse to not go home to their families. |
Now I had your basic 1950s TV dad. No pipe, mind you. But taciturn, provider type. I think when my hamster died he managed to put his hand on my shoulder. I don't regret my father in any way, mind you. He is a brilliant scientist and gave me a lot of intellectual stimulation. How many 12 year olds got to play every sunday with a computer in 1978?
That said, maybe it's a study in contrast. What looks poor to you might look rich to me, type of thing. But when I walk through a park or a store, I see loads and loads of very nurturing fathers. |
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K-duide
Joined: 31 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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| aldershot wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I think a lot of Korean males... wouldn't mind these days going home to their families after work. |
no. nope. IMO the "family" is the biggest resentment for korean males. [generalization]they hate their families[/generalization]. hence the drinking. and me-in clubs. and room salons. and double barber polls. the drinking and whoring is an excuse to not go home to their families. |
Whoa there...as an average married Korean "Salaryman", I find your comments stereotyping Korean males as anti-family + alcoholic womanizers a bit cynical and overblown. What would you think if we Koreans thought that all ESLers(males) are here only to shag Korean girls and were good for nought' but flipping burgers from back wherever burg they sprang out of?
That said, I feel that this ruling is a great first for Korean society as a whole. We Koreans are waking up to the fact that drinking and male bonding has been taken too far, and is now acting as an impediment to further development. More and more I see Koreans at my company(especially the younger managers) refusing to go out with their seniors for more meaningless "bonding"..talking about the same topics(work, real estate speculation, politics etc) over and over again. It's a good sign. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sun May 06, 2007 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| K-duide wrote: |
| aldershot wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I think a lot of Korean males... wouldn't mind these days going home to their families after work. |
no. nope. IMO the "family" is the biggest resentment for korean males. [generalization]they hate their families[/generalization]. hence the drinking. and me-in clubs. and room salons. and double barber polls. the drinking and whoring is an excuse to not go home to their families. |
Whoa there...as an average married Korean "Salaryman", I find your comments stereotyping Korean males as anti-family + alcoholic womanizers a bit cynical and overblown. What would you think if we Koreans thought that all ESLers(males) are here only to shag Korean girls and were good for nought' but flipping burgers from back wherever burg they sprang out of?
That said, I feel that this ruling is a great first for Korean society as a whole. We Koreans are waking up to the fact that drinking and male bonding has been taken too far, and is now acting as an impediment to further development. More and more I see Koreans at my company(especially the younger managers) refusing to go out with their seniors for more meaningless "bonding"..talking about the same topics(work, real estate speculation, politics etc) over and over again. It's a good sign. |
Agrteed, let's try to chill a little on some of the generalizations. |
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