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moosehead
Joined: 05 May 2007
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 Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 6:09 pm Post subject: difficult boss but he's not korean |
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i'm new here to posting and very hesitant but will give it a shot...
have been in korea several years, am older than most teachers, know the ropes and have been told many times i'm a good teacher, even great.
usual problems with various misunderstandings here and there, some serious, typical to what others have experienced
mostly my time here has been spent in schools where i'm the only foreigner, not easy at all but have worked w/other foreigners at camps and part time hagwons, etc.
now i'm at a private elem school, several foreign teachers, our eng director is a westerner.
don't know what his problem is but he clearly doesn't like me, hasn't from the get-go, i think it's because i don't kiss his ass (never was good at that anywhere for anyone); he sometimes has even verbally abused me, lied in front of a korean higher-up, made weird accusations at me
have now decided to avoid him whenever i can but clearly that's not possible all the time, otherwise this is a good school, my students and i get along great, good rapport w/the mothers and most of the k staff, i feel this is all on my side. he seems to be isolating himself by targeting me even
no doubt some of this is also male chauvinism (i'm female); he also seems threatened by my writing skills (he sends out memos w/typos in them and then sends out new memos apologizing for the typos) (i'm a published author); i've offered to help him anyway i can but that only seems to bother him more
he's very disorganized and maybe even incompetent, not sure what he even does all day but doesn't seem able to get much done, we need certain things and he just doesn't accomplish much.
also he doesn't support the foreign teachers rather comes at us and tells us always how the koreans expect it to be, i sort of thought the point of a westerner being english director was also to have someone on our side - but he clearly seems interested in his own a__ first and foremost
also worth noting we are all new teachers, no one renewed from before, he's also new, so we are all starting off at the same point. i had contact w/previous teachers tho and still in touch w/one of them, mostly seems people didn't stay because of the disorganization, go figure, this is korea.
it's really a good school, pay is decent, benefits, etc.
i really want this to work out, am starting my master's online in the fall and want to concentrate on that, not worry about finding yet another job - which is real - i think this guy would fire me if he could find a reason - he hates me that much....
suggestions?
moosehead |
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Richard Krainium
Joined: 12 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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I feel for you. Nothing worse than a bad boss. Here's my suggestion.
Arrange a meeting and find out if he is unhappy with your work or if he has any problems with you. Tell him how you feel and that you would like his constructive criticism.
This may be difficult, but it's better than letting things get even more uncomfortable.
Good luck! |
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Roch
Joined: 24 Apr 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 8:54 pm Post subject: Re: difficult boss but he's not korean |
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| moosehead wrote: |
i'm new here to posting and very hesitant but will give it a shot...
have been in korea several years, am older than most teachers, know the ropes and have been told many times i'm a good teacher, even great.
usual problems with various misunderstandings here and there, some serious, typical to what others have experienced
mostly my time here has been spent in schools where i'm the only foreigner, not easy at all but have worked w/other foreigners at camps and part time hagwons, etc.
now i'm at a private elem school, several foreign teachers, our eng director is a westerner.
don't know what his problem is but he clearly doesn't like me, hasn't from the get-go, i think it's because i don't kiss his ass (never was good at that anywhere for anyone); he sometimes has even verbally abused me, lied in front of a korean higher-up, made weird accusations at me
have now decided to avoid him whenever i can but clearly that's not possible all the time, otherwise this is a good school, my students and i get along great, good rapport w/the mothers and most of the k staff, i feel this is all on my side. he seems to be isolating himself by targeting me even
no doubt some of this is also male chauvinism (i'm female); he also seems threatened by my writing skills (he sends out memos w/typos in them and then sends out new memos apologizing for the typos) (i'm a published author); i've offered to help him anyway i can but that only seems to bother him more
he's very disorganized and maybe even incompetent, not sure what he even does all day but doesn't seem able to get much done, we need certain things and he just doesn't accomplish much.
also he doesn't support the foreign teachers rather comes at us and tells us always how the koreans expect it to be, i sort of thought the point of a westerner being english director was also to have someone on our side - but he clearly seems interested in his own a__ first and foremost
also worth noting we are all new teachers, no one renewed from before, he's also new, so we are all starting off at the same point. i had contact w/previous teachers tho and still in touch w/one of them, mostly seems people didn't stay because of the disorganization, go figure, this is korea.
it's really a good school, pay is decent, benefits, etc.
i really want this to work out, am starting my master's online in the fall and want to concentrate on that, not worry about finding yet another job - which is real - i think this guy would fire me if he could find a reason - he hates me that much....
suggestions?
moosehead |
U.C.C.B./University of Cape Breton and Mount Saint Vincent University are still accepting applications for their Bachelor of Arts in Remedial English.
R |
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CasperTheFriendlyGhost
Joined: 28 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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Unless there are contractual violations, I'd just lay low, finish your year, and move on. It doesn't really sound that bad.
Stop with trying to help the guy, he clearly isn't a guy who wants help. He wants to be the boss. Let him be the boss. |
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Richard Krainium
Joined: 12 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 9:45 pm Post subject: Re: difficult boss but he's not korean |
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double post
Last edited by Richard Krainium on Sat May 12, 2007 9:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Richard Krainium
Joined: 12 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 9:45 pm Post subject: Re: difficult boss but he's not korean |
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| Roch wrote: |
| moosehead wrote: |
i'm new here to posting and very hesitant but will give it a shot...
have been in korea several years, am older than most teachers, know the ropes and have been told many times i'm a good teacher, even great.
usual problems with various misunderstandings here and there, some serious, typical to what others have experienced
mostly my time here has been spent in schools where i'm the only foreigner, not easy at all but have worked w/other foreigners at camps and part time hagwons, etc.
now i'm at a private elem school, several foreign teachers, our eng director is a westerner.
don't know what his problem is but he clearly doesn't like me, hasn't from the get-go, i think it's because i don't kiss his ass (never was good at that anywhere for anyone); he sometimes has even verbally abused me, lied in front of a korean higher-up, made weird accusations at me
have now decided to avoid him whenever i can but clearly that's not possible all the time, otherwise this is a good school, my students and i get along great, good rapport w/the mothers and most of the k staff, i feel this is all on my side. he seems to be isolating himself by targeting me even
no doubt some of this is also male chauvinism (i'm female); he also seems threatened by my writing skills (he sends out memos w/typos in them and then sends out new memos apologizing for the typos) (i'm a published author); i've offered to help him anyway i can but that only seems to bother him more
he's very disorganized and maybe even incompetent, not sure what he even does all day but doesn't seem able to get much done, we need certain things and he just doesn't accomplish much.
also he doesn't support the foreign teachers rather comes at us and tells us always how the koreans expect it to be, i sort of thought the point of a westerner being english director was also to have someone on our side - but he clearly seems interested in his own a__ first and foremost
also worth noting we are all new teachers, no one renewed from before, he's also new, so we are all starting off at the same point. i had contact w/previous teachers tho and still in touch w/one of them, mostly seems people didn't stay because of the disorganization, go figure, this is korea.
it's really a good school, pay is decent, benefits, etc.
i really want this to work out, am starting my master's online in the fall and want to concentrate on that, not worry about finding yet another job - which is real - i think this guy would fire me if he could find a reason - he hates me that much....
suggestions?
moosehead |
U.C.C.B./University of Cape Breton and Mount Saint Vincent University are still accepting applications for their Bachelor of Arts in Remedial English.
R |
Roch-The OP has a legitimate question and is asking for advice. I don't see anything wrong with her question or her writing.
Maybe you had too much Cass Red this morning?
Last edited by Richard Krainium on Sun May 13, 2007 5:42 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Fresh Prince
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: The glorious nation of Korea
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| Posted: Sat May 12, 2007 10:36 pm Post subject: Re: difficult boss but he's not korean |
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| moosehead wrote: |
it's really a good school, pay is decent, benefits, etc.
i really want this to work out, am starting my master's online in the fall and want to concentrate on that, not worry about finding yet another job - which is real - i think this guy would fire me if he could find a reason - he hates me that much....
suggestions?
moosehead |
The Korean culture is very different from the West. They think differently and expect different behaviors from their employees. Your boss is trying to abide by the way Koreans do things, since he is in Korea and works for Korean bosses.
In Korea the boss is never questioned, even if they are incompetent. When the employees are told to do something by their boss, they do it without questions and complaints. Even if it is ridiculous and doesn't make sense. Korean employees tend to stay at work until their boss leaves, even if there is no work to be done. It's a sign of their respect and loyalty to their boss.
When foreigners treat their bosses like they would back home, it creates problems. Your foreign boss needs you to treat him like the Koreans treat their bosses, at least in public where his superiors are watching his performance. That means doing exactly what he says without questioning him, and without showing non-verbal signs (body language, sighs, rolling eyes, etc.) that you disagree with him. This is the Korean way.
My suggestion: Study up on Korean culture and how employees treat their bosses. If you want to be back in the West where everyone is an equal then go back, if you want to work in Korea were there is a rigid hierarchy of superiorty regardless of ability, then you will need to adapt.
In Korea, people are not equal. Yes, you have a lot more experience and know-how then your boss, but you are not the boss for a reason. Your boss needs you to just do your job to the best ability that you can, not to do your job and his job.
Since everyone is new at this school, your boss is going to be working hard to please his superiors, his Korean bosses. When he tells you that the Koreans want things done a certain way, it's because they are the real bosses and they want those things to happen. It doesn't matter if they are bad ideas. If he can't do what his superiors want, they will fire him. |
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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 12:11 am Post subject: |
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no doubt some of this is also male chauvinism (i'm female); he also seems threatened by my writing skills (he sends out memos w/typos in them and then sends out new memos apologizing for the typos) (i'm a published author); i've offered to help him anyway i can but that only seems to bother him more
he's very disorganized and maybe even incompetent, not sure what he even does all day but doesn't seem able to get much done, we need certain things and he just doesn't accomplish much.
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It has nothing to do with gender. He'd treat a man just as poorly. Just because a person has a job title don't mean a person is qualified to do that job. It's a personality issue because he's threatened by your superior resume and skills. He's hung up on titles/authority. How 1950's bossman of him. He's not the kind of person who is willing to have a cooperative workplace.
My advice? Think like a 1950's employee. Do NOT announce your change of heart- just do it. Don't offer to help him. Do ONLY what is required of you. Do not share ideas with him. Stop covering for him. Do not correct his mistakes. Let him stew in his own juices. Do this as coldly as possible. Don't get angry- just be smart about it. If his incompetence causes things to grind to a halt- then, so be it. He's an adult, so let him take responsibility for his own BS.
If he eventually realizes your value as an employee and as a person, then things can start to improve. If not, then you should have no problem finding a new job.
Let him be exposed as a fraud. |
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ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 12:24 am Post subject: |
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U.C.C.B./University of Cape Breton and Mount Saint Vincent University are still accepting applications for their Bachelor of Arts in Remedial English.
R |
And I'm sure they also have openings in their "how to be an arse" 101 course...
OP,
Keep on, keeping on. Concentrate on what you do best, the students. This is where the gold is. Let all else slip slide away.....
DD |
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moosehead
Joined: 05 May 2007
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 1:17 am Post subject: |
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| He's not the kind of person who is willing to have a cooperative workplace. |
it does seem to be this way - which is sort of odd i think -
| Quote: |
| Do NOT announce your change of heart- just do it. Don't offer to help him. Do ONLY what is required of you. Do not share ideas with him. Stop covering for him. Do not correct his mistakes. Let him stew in his own juices. Do this as coldly as possible. Don't get angry- just be smart about it. If his incompetence causes things to grind to a halt- then, so be it. He's an adult, so let him take responsibility for his own BS. |
yeah, i've already started this last week - is just sort of isolating i think; maybe because i've always been the only foreigner i'm used to being asked advice on programs, books, etc.,
i don't think my offer of help was too much or heavy handed - especially when he'd remarked about how much there was to do
i do agree he's trying to do things 'korean style' which is absurd - he's not korean and neither am i - and considering this is about running an english dept that wants to mimic a western curriculum....
yeah, he definitely thinks i'm supposed to go forward no questions ever sorry it just doesn't work that way.
and both our contracts are more than a year, don't want to say more maybe he reads this forum...
thanks for all your comments.
moosehead
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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 3:46 am Post subject: |
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It's also outdated business BS from the west. Most workplaces now try to be more cooperative- in a good way. This is especially true of workplaces like yours- with many who have advanced educations and skill levels. A manager can't just swagger around that kind of office barking orders. It doesn't work and it's counterproductive, and redundant, too..  |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 4:32 pm Post subject: Re: difficult boss but he's not korean |
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| Roch wrote: |
| moosehead wrote: |
i'm new here to posting and very hesitant but will give it a shot...
have been in korea several years, am older than most teachers, know the ropes and have been told many times i'm a good teacher, even great.
usual problems with various misunderstandings here and there, some serious, typical to what others have experienced
mostly my time here has been spent in schools where i'm the only foreigner, not easy at all but have worked w/other foreigners at camps and part time hagwons, etc.
now i'm at a private elem school, several foreign teachers, our eng director is a westerner.
don't know what his problem is but he clearly doesn't like me, hasn't from the get-go, i think it's because i don't kiss his ass (never was good at that anywhere for anyone); he sometimes has even verbally abused me, lied in front of a korean higher-up, made weird accusations at me
have now decided to avoid him whenever i can but clearly that's not possible all the time, otherwise this is a good school, my students and i get along great, good rapport w/the mothers and most of the k staff, i feel this is all on my side. he seems to be isolating himself by targeting me even
no doubt some of this is also male chauvinism (i'm female); he also seems threatened by my writing skills (he sends out memos w/typos in them and then sends out new memos apologizing for the typos) (i'm a published author); i've offered to help him anyway i can but that only seems to bother him more
he's very disorganized and maybe even incompetent, not sure what he even does all day but doesn't seem able to get much done, we need certain things and he just doesn't accomplish much.
also he doesn't support the foreign teachers rather comes at us and tells us always how the koreans expect it to be, i sort of thought the point of a westerner being english director was also to have someone on our side - but he clearly seems interested in his own a__ first and foremost
also worth noting we are all new teachers, no one renewed from before, he's also new, so we are all starting off at the same point. i had contact w/previous teachers tho and still in touch w/one of them, mostly seems people didn't stay because of the disorganization, go figure, this is korea.
it's really a good school, pay is decent, benefits, etc.
i really want this to work out, am starting my master's online in the fall and want to concentrate on that, not worry about finding yet another job - which is real - i think this guy would fire me if he could find a reason - he hates me that much....
suggestions?
moosehead |
U.C.C.B./University of Cape Breton and Mount Saint Vincent University are still accepting applications for their Bachelor of Arts in Remedial English.
R |
Thanks for saving me from having to dish out the proverbial slap up-side the head myself. BTW, you forgot University College of the Caribou (I'm not making that name up).
Really though, OP, what's most important when you have personal conflicts with someone at a school is that you still back each other up when it comes to the teaching part and don't do anything to undermine each other. It could be a bit of jealousy on his part, too. If he sees you backing him up in front of the KTs and students perhaps he'll be more ready to reciprocate. |
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poet13
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Location: Just over there....throwing lemons.
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 8:18 pm Post subject: |
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I don't see anything wrong with the OPs writing style. It obviously wasn't intended to be a technical piece. It was conversational and colloquial. Given that Daves threads are often a colloquim, I'd say the style fits right in.
OP. Into what you wrote, I read a person who is defensive and paranoid. I imagine someone who doesn't really know what he is doing, got the position he has by luck, knows he's not qualified to have it, and is afraid that if the K-handlers realize as much, he will lose that position to another current employee who IS more qualified. I imagine that the more he alienates the rest of the staff, the more difficult it will be to be reduced to their rank, that of 'merely' an Egnlish teacher or instructor.
The lies to management about you IS serious. If you catch him in one again, I would ABSOLUTELY call him on it, right then and there. Not in an angry way. Just state that it wasn't true and ask him to support what he said with facts. Be prepared with your own. Call him out successfully once and you should never have to do it again.
Being mean is childs play. Ignore it.
He gets defensive when you offer to help? Don't offer.
I don't think I would let him affect me one way or another.
Just be a professional. It doesn't matter how much of a jackass he is. If you lower yourself even once and the k-teachers/mngmnt sees it, the nin their eyes, you are the same. |
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cbclark4
Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 8:26 pm Post subject: Re: difficult boss but he's not korean |
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| Roch wrote: |
U.C.C.B./University of Cape Breton and Mount Saint Vincent University are still accepting applications for their Bachelor of Arts in Remedial English.
R |
The Grammar Gestapo strike again.
http://forums.grammargestapo.com
cbc |
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desperation
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Location: Those who know, won't say and those who say, don't know. Welcome to Dave's !
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2007 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Its all your fault, clearly. |
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