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natural
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
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 Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:37 am Post subject: collection of monies for utility bills after I leave |
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Just recieved a contract from a school in Busan and part of the contract made me alarmed.
c. The cost of monthly service, utilities, and telephone charges for the accommodations will be paid by the teacher. For the first three sessions, the Employer will collect the deposit of 200,000 won each session, in order for the employer to pay off the bills of utilities and telephone charges, which the employer is to receive during the two sessions after the teacher has left.
is this normal practise in Korea?
will all schools have something similar?
200,000 won seems an awful lot
Last edited by natural on Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:57 am; edited 1 time in total |
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ChinaBoy
Joined: 17 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:52 am Post subject: |
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"money taking off you"?
you're going to be a teacher? |
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natural
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:58 am Post subject: |
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that better??
I was typing it at speed while multi tasking i didnt expect to be marked for my english on an internet forum, perhaps you have been teaching too long  |
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icicle
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Location: Gyeonggi do Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:04 am Post subject: |
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If you reread what you said in your email it is more than 200,000 won which is being withheld it is 200,000 for the first few sessions (I assume that means months)...
These days a deposit like that is not uncommon ... 300,000 won for the first 3 months is now a standard part of many of the public school contracts ... Total of 900,000 ... so a bit more than yours ... So in that sense I have just accepted that as part of the job I have ... and knowing that I won't do anything to cause my employer to have cause to keep it ... I know that I will get it back when I finish ...
But I do have concerns with one aspect of your deposit ... When it says that they will keep it to cover the utility bills in the months after you leave ... I gather from what I have read here that it is fairly standard to be able to request meters etc to be read so that you can pay any outstanding bills before you leave the country ... and not be forced to leave what is an amount of money more than any utility bills usually are in the country ... for several months .... Part of me doubts that you would ever see any of that again...
So yes deposits do exist here ... now even in public school contracts ... BUT I would never accept a deposit being used in this way in a contract ... To me it is a very big Red flag ... warning of danger.
Icicle |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:09 am Post subject: Re: collection of monies for utility bills after I leave |
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| natural wrote: |
Just recieved a contract from a school in Busan and part of the contract made me alarmed.
c. The cost of monthly service, utilities, and telephone charges for the accommodations will be paid by the teacher. For the first three sessions, the Employer will collect the deposit of 200,000 won each session, in order for the employer to pay off the bills of utilities and telephone charges, which the employer is to receive during the two sessions after the teacher has left.
is this normal practise in Korea?
will all schools have something similar?
200,000 won seems an awful lot |
You or your school can read the meter for your utilities, get an accurate, up-to-date reading, call the utility companies and get the cost of the outstanding bill. Pay that and get the rest returned BEFORE you leave work.
People who have contract clauses like you describe and have to wait until AFTER they leave will NEVER see any of the deposit back. Your employer is NOT going to go to the trouble to wire the money to you in your home country.
Get it returned (minus the value of the outstanding bills) before you leave or kiss it goodbye. |
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insam
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:11 am Post subject: |
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| my school (accredited, reputable top-notch international school) witheld 500,000 on the last paycheck to cover this. they then mailed it to me in the US a month or so later. typical stuff. they just don't want to be stuck with the bill if you screw something up. |
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insam
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:11 am Post subject: Re: collection of monies for utility bills after I leave |
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| ttompatz wrote: |
| natural wrote: |
Just recieved a contract from a school in Busan and part of the contract made me alarmed.
c. The cost of monthly service, utilities, and telephone charges for the accommodations will be paid by the teacher. For the first three sessions, the Employer will collect the deposit of 200,000 won each session, in order for the employer to pay off the bills of utilities and telephone charges, which the employer is to receive during the two sessions after the teacher has left.
is this normal practise in Korea?
will all schools have something similar?
200,000 won seems an awful lot |
You or your school can read the meter for your utilities, get an accurate, up-to-date reading, call the utility companies and get the cost of the outstanding bill. Pay that and get the rest returned BEFORE you leave work.
People who have contract clauses like you describe and have to wait until AFTER they leave will NEVER see any of the deposit back. Your employer is NOT going to go to the trouble to wire the money to you in your home country.
Get it returned (minus the value of the outstanding bills) before you leave or kiss it goodbye. |
why the hell do you write stuff like this? ridiculous. |
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kimchi story
Joined: 23 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:41 am Post subject: Re: collection of monies for utility bills after I leave |
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deleted
Last edited by kimchi story on Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:44 am; edited 1 time in total |
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icicle
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Location: Gyeonggi do Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:07 am Post subject: Re: collection of monies for utility bills after I leave |
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| insam wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
| natural wrote: |
Just recieved a contract from a school in Busan and part of the contract made me alarmed.
c. The cost of monthly service, utilities, and telephone charges for the accommodations will be paid by the teacher. For the first three sessions, the Employer will collect the deposit of 200,000 won each session, in order for the employer to pay off the bills of utilities and telephone charges, which the employer is to receive during the two sessions after the teacher has left.
is this normal practise in Korea?
will all schools have something similar?
200,000 won seems an awful lot |
You or your school can read the meter for your utilities, get an accurate, up-to-date reading, call the utility companies and get the cost of the outstanding bill. Pay that and get the rest returned BEFORE you leave work.
People who have contract clauses like you describe and have to wait until AFTER they leave will NEVER see any of the deposit back. Your employer is NOT going to go to the trouble to wire the money to you in your home country.
Get it returned (minus the value of the outstanding bills) before you leave or kiss it goodbye. |
why the hell do you write stuff like this? ridiculous. |
Why "ridiculous" ... It is simply a statement of the reality of many of the people who have left Korea in that given situation and not got their money back .... And then not been in a position to easily pursue it legally from outside of the country ... It is nothing more than a warning to be careful ... and consider what ways there are to prevent such a problem from occuring.
Icicle |
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icicle
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Location: Gyeonggi do Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:13 am Post subject: |
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| insam wrote: |
| my school (accredited, reputable top-notch international school) witheld 500,000 on the last paycheck to cover this. they then mailed it to me in the US a month or so later. typical stuff. they just don't want to be stuck with the bill if you screw something up. |
The reality however is that not every school in Korea is an accredited, reputable, top-notch international school. What may be reasonable and safe in that situation ... or indeed I would say with a public school here ... is not necessarily going to be the case for everyone ... and there is also much that could be done from the schools perspective to account for the likely bills ... before the person leaves the country ... Like reading meters / checking accommodation for damage ... Why would anyone even want to wait until after the person responsible for paying for it has left the country to do that?
Icicle |
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Fresh Prince
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: The glorious nation of Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 8:25 am Post subject: Re: collection of monies for utility bills after I leave |
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| insam wrote: |
why the hell do you write stuff like this? ridiculous. |
Ttompatz is 100% correct. Why would the school not read the meter and call the phone company to see how much is owed before the contract ends? |
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kigolo1881
Joined: 30 Jul 2006
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 9:57 am Post subject: Re: collection of monies for utility bills after I leave |
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| insam wrote: |
| ttompatz wrote: |
| natural wrote: |
Just recieved a contract from a school in Busan and part of the contract made me alarmed.
c. The cost of monthly service, utilities, and telephone charges for the accommodations will be paid by the teacher. For the first three sessions, the Employer will collect the deposit of 200,000 won each session, in order for the employer to pay off the bills of utilities and telephone charges, which the employer is to receive during the two sessions after the teacher has left.
is this normal practise in Korea?
will all schools have something similar?
200,000 won seems an awful lot |
You or your school can read the meter for your utilities, get an accurate, up-to-date reading, call the utility companies and get the cost of the outstanding bill. Pay that and get the rest returned BEFORE you leave work.
People who have contract clauses like you describe and have to wait until AFTER they leave will NEVER see any of the deposit back. Your employer is NOT going to go to the trouble to wire the money to you in your home country.
Get it returned (minus the value of the outstanding bills) before you leave or kiss it goodbye. |
why the hell do you write stuff like this? ridiculous. |
Ridiculous you say? THIS IS KOREA !!!! *high kick to the chest*
(homage to "300-The Movie)  |
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insam
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:41 am Post subject: |
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the reason i say it is because of the presumptions. i didn't see any information regarding what kind of school the op is referring to. it could very well be an accredited school; it could be a professorship at pusan national university; it could be a nasty and unethical institute.
besides, my personal experience directly refutes the assumptions posted here
"e.g. People who have contract clauses like you describe and have to wait until AFTER they leave will NEVER see any of the deposit back. Your employer is NOT going to go to the trouble to wire the money to you in your home country."
never, really? i got my 500,000 (and if i didn't i wouldn't have stressed over it).
my problem is not with cautionary statements, it is with blanket statements and assumptions that are simply false. my experience (and probably every other teacher at my former school) directly refutes the assertion made here. will some people get screwed? sure. that is the risk with working internationally.
the same risk is taken millions of times per day when companies engage in international trade (will they receive the product if they pay up front? will they receive payment if they ship the product before receiving payment?). this is part of international life. i agree that you should be cautious. if you are particularly curious perhaps you could ask for an explanation from the accountants etc. however, if you are stressed about the possibility of 600,000 over the course of a year, i believe international work may not be the best decision for you. there is always risk. accept the risk, trust your employer, and live a happy life. if they screw you, they screw you; if they don't, they don't. no one can predict it. if you get screwed you can pursue one of the ubiquitous legalistic paths incessantly posted here.
my statements were not to tell the OP that it is normal practice in korea; i was simply suggesting that it is not completely out of the ordinary in korea. the best way to approach work in korea is to view everything generally and don't get caught up in details. if you save 600,000 less over the course of a year it's not the end of the world. also, if you are cooperative with some of the strangeness (particularly with bizarre accounting practices) you might even benefit from it in unexpected ways. |
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ttompatz
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Location: Kwangju, South Korea
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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| insam wrote: |
the reason i say it is because of the presumptions. i didn't see any information regarding what kind of school the op is referring to. it could very well be an accredited school; it could be a professorship at pusan national university; it could be a nasty and unethical institute.
besides, my personal experience directly refutes the assumptions posted here
"e.g. People who have contract clauses like you describe and have to wait until AFTER they leave will NEVER see any of the deposit back. Your employer is NOT going to go to the trouble to wire the money to you in your home country."
never, really? i got my 500,000 (and if i didn't i wouldn't have stressed over it).
my problem is not with cautionary statements, it is with blanket statements and assumptions that are simply false. my experience (and probably every other teacher at my former school) directly refutes the assertion made here. will some people get screwed? sure. that is the risk with working internationally.
the same risk is taken millions of times per day when companies engage in international trade (will they receive the product if they pay up front? will they receive payment if they ship the product before receiving payment?). this is part of international life. i agree that you should be cautious. if you are particularly curious perhaps you could ask for an explanation from the accountants etc. however, if you are stressed about the possibility of 600,000 over the course of a year, i believe international work may not be the best decision for you. there is always risk. accept the risk, trust your employer, and live a happy life. if they screw you, they screw you; if they don't, they don't. no one can predict it. if you get screwed you can pursue one of the ubiquitous legalistic paths incessantly posted here.
my statements were not to tell the OP that it is normal practice in korea; i was simply suggesting that it is not completely out of the ordinary in korea. the best way to approach work in korea is to view everything generally and don't get caught up in details. if you save 600,000 less over the course of a year it's not the end of the world. also, if you are cooperative with some of the strangeness (particularly with bizarre accounting practices) you might even benefit from it in unexpected ways. |
Come back to reality here dude.
Even my public school (and every hakwon I worked at) took the time (10 minutes) to read the meters, call the utility companies and get a value for me to pay BEFORE I left.
When I was working as an advocate for foreign workers I had a file folder with literally hundreds upon hundreds of compaints from ex-teachers who were cheated out of their deposits by the method described by the OP.
My advice stands. Read the meters, call the utility companies and pay the bills BEFORE you leave. Get the remainder of your balance returned or you will lose it.
Your described personal experience is by far the exception to delayed payment returns and I for one am truely amazed at your good fortune.
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insam
Joined: 17 May 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2007 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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| point taken. |
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