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Mosley
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:35 am Post subject: Corporate Evil Has the U.S. Gov. by the Short Ones.... |
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Riiiight. That's why "socialist" Canada has a lower corporate tax rate than the U.S. Better to make the proles pay through the nose for their "free" health care.
Yep. The evil U.S. corporations are saddled w/the highest tax rate amongst the industrialized world, save for Japan. So much for conspiracy theories of how the American corporate world "pays no taxes".
http://finance.sympatico.msn.ca/taxes/insight/article.aspx?cp-documentid=5061116 |
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newteacher
Joined: 31 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:30 am Post subject: |
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| I think the real problem with American corporations is the distribution of their profits, not the amount of taxes they're paying. When you consider that the CEO's of most of the large corporations make more money in one day then the average employee makes in a year you have a problem. They're destroying the American middle class by slowly shifting most operations overseas, paying as little as they possibly can to the workers in the States, and keeping the majority of the profits for themselves. I've had enough of the CEO's making hundreds of millions of dollars a year when the average worker is making around 40-70k. It's disgusting. |
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ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:52 am Post subject: |
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I think profit wise....corporate America is doing a okay.
I think a very worrisome problem and may I say, insidious problem, is the relationship and closeness of corporate America and government. Government is now basically a training camp for corporate management and the revolving door keeps revolving.
This close relationship leads to billions of wasted dollars, without insight, given and put in the lap of corporations to waste. Everything from uncontested tendering, earmarking and more. This in itself is another revolving door -- what corporate America pays to government, it gets back.....
I've written a lot about it here and won't repeat myself. But there was even an article today once more outlining this. SAIC gets its mention, the biggest culprit/criminal and yes, its board is just a roster of former senior officials come home to roost.....
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/06/27/opinion/edkeefe.php
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Rent-a-spy
By Patrick Radden Keefe Published: June 27, 2007
Shortly after 9/11, Senator Bob Graham, the chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, called for "a symbiotic relationship between the intelligence community and the private sector." They say you should be careful what you wish for. |
DD |
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postfundie
Joined: 28 May 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 5:55 am Post subject: |
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This close relationship leads to billions of wasted dollars, without insight, given and put in the lap of corporations to waste. Everything from uncontested tendering, earmarking and more. This in itself is another revolving door -- what corporate America pays to government, it gets back.....
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You are referring to what's called the "Wallstreet-Treasury Complex" and it has its downsides to be sure. On the other hand if you don't get people moving between government and business you tend to get a lot of clueless government people who make idiot, uniformed rules for business to follow. Korea seems to have this problem especially when it comes to the securities market.
I guess DD since you have so much experience working in Corporate America (and since here the kids you help give you inside details into corporations) you are free to make such nice generalizations about all of 'Corporate America'... |
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ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:40 am Post subject: |
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| I guess DD since you have so much experience working in Corporate America (and since here the kids you help give you inside details into corporations) you are free to make such nice generalizations about all of 'Corporate America'... |
I've done my share of becoming aware..... I'm not a farmer from Idaho. I've traveled and as a person who has spent a good bit of time raising money for charity as part of my foundation, I've done A LOT of brown nosing with corporate management and even American corporate culture. So I am not blind.
Here is a good read on SAIC , from March. And no, I don't teach "kiddies" but no harm to my intelligence if I did. Quite being so morally straight jacketed. Or do you prefer you significant other either in the bedroom or the kitchen?
http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2007/03/spyagency200703
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| And the revolving door never stops spinning. One of the biggest contracts ever for SAIC is in the works right now. It's for a Pentagon program called Future Combat Systems, which is described as "a complex plan to turn the U.S. Army into a lighter, more lethal, more mobile force" and also as "the most difficult integration program ever undertaken by the U.S. Department of Defense." The contract runs into the billions of dollars. The man who helped craft this program at the Pentagon was Lieutenant General Daniel R. Zanini. Zanini recently retired from the army, and he now has a new job. Can you guess where it might be? |
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| In Washington these companies go by the generic name "body shops"�they supply flesh-and-blood human beings to do the specialized work that government agencies no longer can. Often they do this work outside the public eye, and with little official oversight�even if it involves the most sensitive matters of national security. The Founding Fathers may have argued eloquently for a government of laws, not of men, but what we've got instead is a government of body shops. |
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postfundie
Joined: 28 May 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:59 am Post subject: |
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I've done my share of becoming aware..... I'm not a farmer from Idaho. I've traveled and as a person who has spent a good bit of time raising money for charity as part of my foundation, I've done A LOT of brown nosing with corporate management and even American corporate culture. So I am not blind.
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you totally avoid your generalizing about 'corporate culture'....funny how you cry like a baby if someone does the same about that blessed religion we all love and adore.
Also asking corporations for money is not the same as working for them..... |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 7:10 am Post subject: |
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Get rid of Bush's tax cuts
Raise the gas tax.
Put a tax on imported oil.
Enact a value added tax
End all cooperate taxes
Enact a capital gains tax cut.
This will discourage consumption , increase investment , increase tax revenue and improve productivity. |
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Mosley
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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Joo: We don't often disagree but...I gotta ask ya: Have you ever been to Canada? Do you realize what a burden the VAT(provincial AND federal) imposes on the average working schmuck? Someone with a modest income(say, 30K a yr.) is basically reduced to poverty what with income taxes, sales taxes, property taxes(assuming he even qualifies for a mortgage w/house prices these days), and a myriad of other involuntary payments to government.
If I were PM, I'd abolish the GST tomorrow. If I were a provincial premier, I'd abolish the PST tomorrow(if I were the Alberta premier there would be no need: no sales tax there). |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:22 am Post subject: |
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| Mosley wrote: |
Joo: We don't often disagree but...I gotta ask ya: Have you ever been to Canada? Do you realize what a burden the VAT(provincial AND federal) imposes on the average working schmuck? Someone with a modest income(say, 30K a yr.) is basically reduced to poverty what with income taxes, sales taxes, property taxes(assuming he even qualifies for a mortgage w/house prices these days), and a myriad of other involuntary payments to government.
If I were PM, I'd abolish the GST tomorrow. If I were a provincial premier, I'd abolish the PST tomorrow(if I were the Alberta premier there would be no need: no sales tax there). |
I have never been to Canada . I would hope that Business tax cuts would create lots of jobs , increase investment , fire up the economy and get people higher salaries . However I believe in pay as you go something would have to make up for the loss of tax revenue from businesses. |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:55 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
This will discourage consumption , increase investment , increase tax revenue and improve productivity. |
What good is investment if people aren't consuming? What good is increased productivity if people aren't consuming? |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 9:08 am Post subject: |
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| ddeubel wrote: |
| I think a very worrisome problem and may I say, insidious problem, is the relationship and closeness of corporate America and government. Government is now basically a training camp for corporate management and the revolving door keeps revolving. |
| Karl Marx wrote: |
| Each step in the development of the bourgeoisie was accompanied by a corresponding political advance in that class. An oppressed class under the sway of the feudal nobility, an armed and self-governing association of medieval commune: here independent urban republic (as in Italy and Germany); there taxable "third estate" of the monarchy (as in France); afterward, in the period of manufacturing proper, serving either the semi-feudal or the absolute monarchy as a counterpoise against the nobility, and, in fact, cornerstone of the great monarchies in general -- the bourgeoisie has at last, since the establishment of Modern Industry and of the world market, conquered for itself, in the modern representative state, exclusive political sway. The executive of the modern state is but a committee for managing the common affairs of the whole bourgeoisie. |
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ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:46 pm Post subject: |
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you totally avoid your generalizing about 'corporate culture'....funny how you cry like a baby if someone does the same about that blessed religion we all love and adore.
Also asking corporations for money is not the same as working for them..... |
Postfundie, once again I would ask that you post a "substantive" rebuttal, with some substance, an article, link, reference......or you will probably evolve into that shadow of mind, BJWD who can now only shout "douchebag".
But I will address this. On some level, we all are generalizing but there are facts behind my assertion and read the article I posted for a start. Further, I don't think all corporate culture is in the pocket of govt. Just many monoliths. This is fertilized by the lobby which despite all the rhetoric, has had nobody come to Washington to excise/remove.
I think American corporate culture should do what it does best -- innovate, create, risk and trade, deal.....it shouldn't try for soft corporate money and influence. Govt should always be the guardian of the public interest and unfortunately in America this isn't always the case.
Gopher -- Would it be reasonable to say that Marx said some things that are true and anyone saying that isn't necessarily a Marxist? Think the difference between theory and action......Marxism is unreasonable because it doesn't jive with human nature, not because of its analysis of "history".........But of course, you are all for labeling anyone who engages ideas openly, as an agent of "leftism" and "moral decay". Ask your own shadow, McGarette, he'd agree. Right?
DD |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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| ddeubel wrote: |
| Would it be reasonable to say that Marx said some things that are true and anyone saying that isn't necessarily a Marxist? |
Yes. Marxian analysis, like everything else, has pros and cons, and it not absolutely flawed anymore than it represents absolute truth. And I did not show that you parrot Marx in this case merely to attempt to discredit your view on this simply because it parrots Marx. Marx's analysis fails because, the man was consumed with a priori purpose and he consequently produces propaganda as much as science, as E.H. Carr recognized long ago...
| E.H. Carr wrote: |
| Marx, when he wrote Capital, was inspired by the purpose of destroying the capitalist system just as the investigator of the causes of cancer is inspired by the purpose of eradicating cancer. But the facts about capitalism are not, like the facts about cancer, independent of the attitude of people towards it. Marx's analysis was intended to alter, and did in fact alter, that attitude. In the process of analysing the facts, Marx altered them. To attempt to distinguish between Marx the scientist and Marx the propagandist is idle hair-splitting... |
E.H. Carr, Twenty Years' Crisis, 4.
While I thank Marx for bringing such issues to our attention, and agree that we must indeed look at political economy in foreign relations, I must disagree with his analysis on many points. For one, I would point to corruption within the system while he asserts that the system is corrupt, irredeemable, and must be violently overthrown. And, of course, the facts do not support his claims in cases like American involvement in the Guatemalan Revolution 1954. |
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postfundie
Joined: 28 May 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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| But I will address this. On some level, we all are generalizing but there are facts behind my assertion and read the article I posted for a start. Further, I don't think all corporate culture is in the pocket of govt. Just many monoliths. This is fertilized by the lobby which despite all the rhetoric, has had nobody come to Washington to excise/remove |
Is it ok then if I generalize then about Islam?? I mean there are facts behind my assertations and I've bothered to take time to read the Koran. I most certainly do not think that all Muslims are bad but I do feel that Muhammed is a pissss poor example in many ways and that people who declare that he is for ALL mankind and that he is above criticism present a problem.... |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:24 am Post subject: |
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| newteacher wrote: |
| I think the real problem with American corporations is the distribution of their profits, not the amount of taxes they're paying. When you consider that the CEO's of most of the large corporations make more money in one day then the average employee makes in a year you have a problem. They're destroying the American middle class by slowly shifting most operations overseas, paying as little as they possibly can to the workers in the States, and keeping the majority of the profits for themselves. I've had enough of the CEO's making hundreds of millions of dollars a year when the average worker is making around 40-70k. It's disgusting. |
That's when workers need to get some gumption and learn how to bargain collectively. The UAW figured it out. "We want a share of that wealth. If you don't give it to us, find yourself 20,000 new employees." |
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