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server1a
Joined: 02 Jun 2007
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 Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 11:42 pm Post subject: Dongducheon Foreign Language High School (Straight Dope) |
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Ok, so I'm a newbie here but I feel the need to warn other about teaching here.
When I signed on with this school I was told that I could stay in an apartment, but when I arrived they told me that the apartment would be paid but I could expect 300,000 won per month in utilities and fees. Being fresh off the plane I relented and stayed in the dorm. The dorm is ok, but little privacy. Later I found out that the 300,000 won was a tactic they used to keep naive teachers on campus.
For the first six months things were ok regarding administration and contracts, never came up, but the usual things started to crop up.
Alienation, full blow treatment like a leper. You can expect to sit alone at lunch and be ignored, not informed about meetings and office parties, and basically you're the last to know. I have (more than I can count) shown up to classes that were cancled. Or worse, not shown up to classes that were changed at the last minute.
Also every opportunity to show you are not a real teacher is fully exploited. I was not given a laptop like all the other teachers, not given a key to the computer lab, and basically told in oh so many ways that foreign teachers cannot be trusted with any of the school's facilities. Through some manner of blind luck my dorm key also opens the computer lab, so I have been using it.
Presents. The parents buy a lot of stuff for the teachers here. There is nothing more embarrassing that sitting in an office of 7 teachers and watching 6 gift baskets being handed out. After X-mas there were some really elaborate gift baskets being handed out and it was really "nice" to have all the teachers fawning over them with each other. I asked if there were any more and they replied that there were none and that next time we would get some as well. I happened to see about 20 extra baskets sitting in the admin office that were then given to teachers with spouses. The next time there were gifts given out they made sure to give them out in the office so we couldn't see, but some teachers made the mistake of bringing them back to their offices.
There are also the office parties after work. We are not invited to them, unless there is some official or high ranking person they want to show off their white people to.
Ok, on to teaching. For the most part you are given free reign to teach how you want. But if a teacher is angry with you they will stuff a complaint box with fake complaints from the students and they use them as evidence. These witch hunts usually happen during inter-department power struggles and when one of the higher ups gets in trouble for some complaints from students about their scores or tests. They then use these fake complaints to shift blame to the english teachers. The opposite also happens when a native speaker achieves something with a class, the korean teachers will swoop in and stamp their names all over it.
Most of the interaction between native speakers and korean teachers is in the form of questions relating to grammar. They ask, we answer. We also proof read the exams before the students get them, and fix mistakes. What usually happens is they neglect to fix our corrections, the students notice, complain to their parents, and then their parents complain to the staff. The staff then fabricate fake complaints from the students relating to our teaching abilities, and we are left with the blame.
During a special field trip, the entire school, administration and all, were going to visit an english villiage. The foreign teachers were told that they were not going and had to stay in their offices the entire two days. So basically we had to sit and surf the net for two days while the rest of the school explored the english villiage.
Finally contract negotiations for the past six months have become a daily affair. We native english teachers talk with the admin, get nowhere, talk with the principal, get his oral consent, then hit a roadblock when the admin refuse to aknowledge the ok from the principal and the principal denies ever giving the ok. Rinse and repeat!
Basically we were all told that we would get full vacation time despite the contract wording, because there were no english camps or classes planned. We were told to make our plans and have a good time. A week before holidays (today) we were told that they made a "surprise" english camp, and that we had to cancle our plans. One teacher already had a ticket back home to the US and another had one back home to Japan. They are not going to cancle their tickets so they have probably already lost their bonuses.
Finally today there have been accusations that one of the native speakers is involved with another native speaker, totally untrue. What I assume they are tryign to do is use this as leverage to threaten the person, that they will be fired without a bonus or a plane ticket home.
Basically the entire school's stance is screw over the native speakers if they don't work like donkeys and do whatever they say. Verbal agreements mean nothing, and the contracts are worded so loosely that they can infere anything they want.
Stay away! This place is poison and it will only end up in tons of frustration, worry, and late/missing pay.
I will be happy to answer any questions that arise and Tin Tin will probable start a thread of his own. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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| It's such a pity because experienced native English teachers should be the pride and core of a FLHS. It looks like even at some of these places Koreans are doing their best to make sure they get the worst of available teachers and chase the good ones who know what's going on off to unis. |
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server1a
Joined: 02 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 12:00 am Post subject: |
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/\/\/\ The exact reason why I posted this is so that hopefully some fresh off the plane wayguk doesn't accept a job here and then has to go through a year of hell like I did and the other teachers here are.
We have the following.
3 Native English teachers
2 Native Chinese teachers
1 Native Japanese teacher
None of us are renewing our contracts. Hell the one guy came back from Iraq last march, started teaching here in Sept, and is now trying to rejoin his unit here in S. Korea. He's risking going back to Iraq instead of teaching again. So that's some indication of what you can expect. The school slogan should be. . .
Dongducheon FLHS: Slightly less friendly than Iraq. |
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Unposter
Joined: 04 Jun 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:51 am Post subject: |
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I loved the part about the gift baskets. If Fts only knew how many "extras" Korean school teachers get...
But, there has to be more to the story about the guy who wants to go back to Iraq. It can't be just this school that lead to such a decision.
You think your students are competitive? Just remember Korean teachers were winners of 12 + years of competition. They are good! |
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server1a
Joined: 02 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 2:31 am Post subject: |
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| Unposter wrote: |
I loved the part about the gift baskets. If Fts only knew how many "extras" Korean school teachers get...
But, there has to be more to the story about the guy who wants to go back to Iraq. It can't be just this school that lead to such a decision.
You think your students are competitive? Just remember Korean teachers were winners of 12 + years of competition. They are good! |
The guy isn't signing up for Iraq, he's just going back to the army. He's got a korean wife and figured working on one of the US bases here would be better than another school like DFL. There is a very slim chance he'd end up in the stink again.
And Korean teachers might be good, but here at DFL they're too busy stabbing us and each other in the back and fighting for power and influence to worry about teaching. |
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The_Conservative
Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 2:55 am Post subject: Re: Dongducheon Foreign Language High School (Straight Dope) |
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| server1a wrote: |
Ok, so I'm a newbie here but I feel the need to warn other about teaching here.
When I signed on with this school I was told that I could stay in an apartment, but when I arrived they told me that the apartment would be paid but I could expect 300,000 won per month in utilities and fees. Being fresh off the plane I relented and stayed in the dorm. The dorm is ok, but little privacy. Later I found out that the 300,000 won was a tactic they used to keep naive teachers on campus.
For the first six months things were ok regarding administration and contracts, never came up, but the usual things started to crop up.
Alienation, full blow treatment like a leper. You can expect to sit alone at lunch and be ignored, not informed about meetings and office parties, and basically you're the last to know. I have (more than I can count) shown up to classes that were cancled. Or worse, not shown up to classes that were changed at the last minute.
Alone? I thought you had other native speakers to sit with? And as being the last to know, that's par for the course pretty much everywhere
Also every opportunity to show you are not a real teacher is fully exploited. I was not given a laptop like all the other teachers, not given a key to the computer lab, and basically told in oh so many ways that foreign teachers cannot be trusted with any of the school's facilities. Through some manner of blind luck my dorm key also opens the computer lab, so I have been using it.
Again what about the other foreign teachers? How is that they had laptops and you didn't? Got to be more than simple xenophobia here
Presents. The parents buy a lot of stuff for the teachers here. There is nothing more embarrassing that sitting in an office of 7 teachers and watching 6 gift baskets being handed out. After X-mas there were some really elaborate gift baskets being handed out and it was really "nice" to have all the teachers fawning over them with each other. I asked if there were any more and they replied that there were none and that next time we would get some as well. I happened to see about 20 extra baskets sitting in the admin office that were then given to teachers with spouses. The next time there were gifts given out they made sure to give them out in the office so we couldn't see, but some teachers made the mistake of bringing them back to their offices.
7 teachers and 6 gift baskets. Sounds like you were the only one who didn't get one. Yeah that does suck, but again I don't see racism playing a factor.
There are also the office parties after work. We are not invited to them, unless there is some official or high ranking person they want to show off their white people to.
Dude you are soooo lucky. Trust me on this. After the first few times..those parties get old fast.
Ok, on to teaching. For the most part you are given free reign to teach how you want. But if a teacher is angry with you they will stuff a complaint box with fake complaints from the students and they use them as evidence. .
Okay, I'm just wondering how you know that they do this on a regular basis? I'm also wondering how you know that the students WEREN't the ones complaining?
Most of the interaction between native speakers and korean teachers is in the form of questions relating to grammar. They ask, we answer. We also proof read the exams before the students get them, and fix mistakes. What usually happens is they neglect to fix our corrections, the students notice, complain to their parents, and then their parents complain to the staff. The staff then fabricate fake complaints from the students relating to our teaching abilities, and we are left with the blame.
During a special field trip, the entire school, administration and all, were going to visit an english villiage. The foreign teachers were told that they were not going and had to stay in their offices the entire two days. So basically we had to sit and surf the net for two days while the rest of the school explored the english villiage.
Finally contract negotiations for the past six months have become a daily affair. We native english teachers talk with the admin, get nowhere, talk with the principal, get his oral consent, then hit a roadblock when the admin refuse to aknowledge the ok from the principal and the principal denies ever giving the ok. Rinse and repeat!
This is a private school and the adminstration goes against the principal? In Korea? Sorry that doesn't sound right. There has to be more to the story.
Basically we were all told that we would get full vacation time despite the contract wording, because there were no english camps or classes planned. We were told to make our plans and have a good time. A week before holidays (today) we were told that they made a "surprise" english camp, and that we had to cancle our plans. One teacher already had a ticket back home to the US and another had one back home to Japan. They are not going to cancle their tickets so they have probably already lost their bonuses.
A 'surprise' English camp? Welcome to the world of Korean planning
Finally today there have been accusations that one of the native speakers is involved with another native speaker, totally untrue. What I assume they are tryign to do is use this as leverage to threaten the person, that they will be fired without a bonus or a plane ticket home.
Unless there is something in the contract regarding this, they can't do anything. And if there is something in the contract...why on earth would you sign a contract like that?
Basically the entire school's stance is screw over the native speakers if they don't work like donkeys and do whatever they say. Verbal agreements mean nothing, and the contracts are worded so loosely that they can infere anything they want.
Sorry, but then that is your fault for signing such a crappy contract, no? I'm assuming they didn't put a gun to your head before you set pen to paper
Stay away! This place is poison and it will only end up in tons of frustration, worry, and late/missing pay.
Thanks for the heads up anyway
I will be happy to answer any questions that arise and Tin Tin will probable start a thread of his own. |
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server1a
Joined: 02 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 3:08 am Post subject: |
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| /\/\/\ What was that? You just quoted the entire post. |
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Doutdes
Joined: 14 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 3:21 am Post subject: |
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| server1a wrote: |
| The guy isn't signing up for Iraq, he's just going back to the army. He's got a korean wife and figured working on one of the US bases here would be better than another school like DFL. There is a very slim chance he'd end up in the stink again. |
He's getting bad advice from someone if he's going to return to the army because of one bad school. There are other public and private schools in Dongducheon that are hiring. Most haven't chosen a candidate yet. If he wants some names, send me a pm or have him send me one. |
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server1a
Joined: 02 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 3:23 am Post subject: |
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| Doutdes wrote: |
| He's getting bad advice from someone if he's going to return to the army because of one bad school. There are other public and private schools in Dongducheon that are hiring. Most haven't chosen a candidate yet. If he wants some names, send me a pm or have him send me one. |
He's pretty connected here in Korea since he has a K wife. Basically DFL has taught him to hate teaching. |
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The_Conservative
Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 3:27 am Post subject: |
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| server1a wrote: |
| /\/\/\ What was that? You just quoted the entire post. |
Read it more carefully. The words in italics are mine. |
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server1a
Joined: 02 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:10 am Post subject: |
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| The_Conservative wrote: |
Read it more carefully. The words in italics are mine. |
When I say I or me I am also referring to all the other foreign teachers' experiences as well.
As for stuffing the complain boxes, they usually read something like this.
"We don't want to use the computers, or watch movies."
Something the students would never say since they have no access to the internet or television here at the school. And they only go home every other weekend.
As for the contract issues, we were assured that vacation time would be provided despite the wording of the contract. This came from the principal himself. It's a tactic they started using in the last six months. Principal says one thing, admin does another. That way the principal is free of blame. When we go back to the principal he promises the moon, (nothing in paper) and admin then refuses his promises. |
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TinTin
Joined: 21 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| It's such a pity because experienced native English teachers should be the pride and core of a FLHS. It looks like even at some of these places Koreans are doing their best to make sure they get the worst of available teachers and chase the good ones who know what's going on off to unis. |
I think thats the exact case. I teach at this school, and there is not one happy foreign face here and more horror stories than it is possible to list. Now I am faced with no real choice other than to quit and will be going to work in university.
I have been teaching in Korea for a couple of years now and I never had any problems like I have had at this place. The staff are activly hostile and vindictive towards foreign teachers. Everything server1a says is exactly on the nail, but there is in reality much much more that can be said about our experiences here.
If you want your Korean experience to turn into a miserable affair then feel free to come and work here. I would activly encourage Conservative to come and work here and experience just how wrong he really is. Then lets see what he has to say in around six months time. |
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The_Conservative
Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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| TinTin wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It's such a pity because experienced native English teachers should be the pride and core of a FLHS. It looks like even at some of these places Koreans are doing their best to make sure they get the worst of available teachers and chase the good ones who know what's going on off to unis. |
I think thats the exact case. I teach at this school, and there is not one happy foreign face here and more horror stories than it is possible to list. Now I am faced with no real choice other than to quit and will be going to work in university.
I have been teaching in Korea for a couple of years now and I never had any problems like I have had at this place. The staff are activly hostile and vindictive towards foreign teachers. Everything server1a says is exactly on the nail, but there is in reality much much more that can be said about our experiences here.
If you want your Korean experience to turn into a miserable affair then feel free to come and work here. I would activly encourage Conservative to come and work here and experience just how wrong he really is. Then lets see what he has to say in around six months time. |
"wrong" about what exactly? Did I say this was a good school? Did I say that the poster was lying? I merely asked some questions as the OP stated "I will be happy to answer any questions that arise.."
I took the OP at his/her word. There is no need to be defensive especially since the OP basically invited us to ask questions. [/i] |
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hubba bubba
Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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That story, in a nutshell, is Korea.
Granted, it's a bit more extreme than the average situation. But that's how I've come to view Korea. |
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mrsquirrel
Joined: 13 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:32 pm Post subject: Re: Dongducheon Foreign Language High School (Straight Dope) |
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| server1a wrote: |
Ok, so I'm a newbie here but I feel the need to warn other about teaching here.
When I signed on with this school I was told that I could stay in an apartment, but when I arrived they told me that the apartment would be paid but I could expect 300,000 won per month in utilities and fees. Being fresh off the plane I relented and stayed in the dorm. The dorm is ok, but little privacy. Later I found out that the 300,000 won was a tactic they used to keep naive teachers on campus.
For the first six months things were ok regarding administration and contracts, never came up, but the usual things started to crop up.
Alienation, full blow treatment like a leper. You can expect to sit alone at lunch and be ignored, not informed about meetings and office parties, and basically you're the last to know. I have (more than I can count) shown up to classes that were cancled. Or worse, not shown up to classes that were changed at the last minute.
Also every opportunity to show you are not a real teacher is fully exploited. I was not given a laptop like all the other teachers, not given a key to the computer lab, and basically told in oh so many ways that foreign teachers cannot be trusted with any of the school's facilities. Through some manner of blind luck my dorm key also opens the computer lab, so I have been using it.
Presents. The parents buy a lot of stuff for the teachers here. There is nothing more embarrassing that sitting in an office of 7 teachers and watching 6 gift baskets being handed out. After X-mas there were some really elaborate gift baskets being handed out and it was really "nice" to have all the teachers fawning over them with each other. I asked if there were any more and they replied that there were none and that next time we would get some as well. I happened to see about 20 extra baskets sitting in the admin office that were then given to teachers with spouses. The next time there were gifts given out they made sure to give them out in the office so we couldn't see, but some teachers made the mistake of bringing them back to their offices.
There are also the office parties after work. We are not invited to them, unless there is some official or high ranking person they want to show off their white people to.
Ok, on to teaching. For the most part you are given free reign to teach how you want. But if a teacher is angry with you they will stuff a complaint box with fake complaints from the students and they use them as evidence. These witch hunts usually happen during inter-department power struggles and when one of the higher ups gets in trouble for some complaints from students about their scores or tests. They then use these fake complaints to shift blame to the english teachers. The opposite also happens when a native speaker achieves something with a class, the korean teachers will swoop in and stamp their names all over it.
Most of the interaction between native speakers and korean teachers is in the form of questions relating to grammar. They ask, we answer. We also proof read the exams before the students get them, and fix mistakes. What usually happens is they neglect to fix our corrections, the students notice, complain to their parents, and then their parents complain to the staff. The staff then fabricate fake complaints from the students relating to our teaching abilities, and we are left with the blame.
During a special field trip, the entire school, administration and all, were going to visit an english villiage. The foreign teachers were told that they were not going and had to stay in their offices the entire two days. So basically we had to sit and surf the net for two days while the rest of the school explored the english villiage.
Finally contract negotiations for the past six months have become a daily affair. We native english teachers talk with the admin, get nowhere, talk with the principal, get his oral consent, then hit a roadblock when the admin refuse to aknowledge the ok from the principal and the principal denies ever giving the ok. Rinse and repeat!
Basically we were all told that we would get full vacation time despite the contract wording, because there were no english camps or classes planned. We were told to make our plans and have a good time. A week before holidays (today) we were told that they made a "surprise" english camp, and that we had to cancle our plans. One teacher already had a ticket back home to the US and another had one back home to Japan. They are not going to cancle their tickets so they have probably already lost their bonuses.
Finally today there have been accusations that one of the native speakers is involved with another native speaker, totally untrue. What I assume they are tryign to do is use this as leverage to threaten the person, that they will be fired without a bonus or a plane ticket home.
Basically the entire school's stance is screw over the native speakers if they don't work like donkeys and do whatever they say. Verbal agreements mean nothing, and the contracts are worded so loosely that they can infere anything they want.
Stay away! This place is poison and it will only end up in tons of frustration, worry, and late/missing pay.
I will be happy to answer any questions that arise and Tin Tin will probable start a thread of his own. |
Really irks me when people quote the whole thing.
However your story sounds a lot like every other tale of woe. Buy beware. |
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