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Is Sleep Overrated?
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:14 pm    Post subject: Is Sleep Overrated? Reply with quote

We see so many Korean kids staying up very late and studying. They seem to do well in school despite having little school. Contrast that with all that talk in North America about how kids need to sleep or they won't do well in school. I can't figure out how the kids do it in Korea? I suppose if you really want to function on just 5 hours of sleep consistently it is not big deal possibly? I don't sleep a lot myself, but I feel I could use some more shut eye....
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RACETRAITOR



Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suspect it kills certain aptitudes among them, such as creativity or spontaneity. Lack of sleep probably doesn't have any effect on rote learning or memorisation.
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kiwigirl :O)



Joined: 05 Jan 2006
Location: Bundang

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the kids here dont know any other way to be....
western kids have a lot of sleep because thats how their parents brought them up to be....

i do wonder how quickly asian kids get burnt out though....it seems they study all the time (and seem to get the results they want) but they do need time to de stress and relax and be a kid (i wonder if they are having a childhood)

like even summer and winter holidays they still go to hagwon or do intensive camps to make up for the spare time where they would usually go to school....
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RACETRAITOR



Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kiwigirl :O) wrote:
the kids here dont know any other way to be....
western kids have a lot of sleep because thats how their parents brought them up to be....

i do wonder how quickly asian kids get burnt out though....it seems they study all the time (and seem to get the results they want) but they do need time to de stress and relax and be a kid (i wonder if they are having a childhood)

like even summer and winter holidays they still go to hagwon or do intensive camps to make up for the spare time where they would usually go to school....


They burn out a lot and they burn out badly.

But anyway, what can you learn by relaxing and being a kid that you can't learn by doing TOEIC questions over and over again?
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Rock



Joined: 25 Feb 2005

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No way, or yes way, SLEEP IS ABSOLUTELY ONE HUNDRED PERCENT ESSENTIAL!

How old are you? Not to pry, but YOU'LL FIND THAT AS YOU GET OLDER, YOUR MIND, AND BODY, AREN'T AS VERSATILE! Horrible mistakes occur-quit proven, from a scientific standpoint-when people lack sleep.

But to get to your point: THE YOUNG MAY SUFFER IRREPARABLE DAMAGE, as Japan has long since found out, and Korea. AND THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS MAKING UP FOR SLEEP.

Why do you think Vietnan Vets had what's called PTSD, or whatever it's called?

Recognized illness, some flip out, myself included.
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Rock



Joined: 25 Feb 2005

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kiwigirl :O) wrote:
the kids here dont know any other way to be....
western kids have a lot of sleep because thats how their parents brought them up to be....

i do wonder how quickly asian kids get burnt out though....it seems they study all the time (and seem to get the results they want) but they do need time to de stress and relax and be a kid (i wonder if they are having a childhood)

like even summer and winter holidays they still go to hagwon or do intensive camps to make up for the spare time where they would usually go to school....


A lot of this is social. Ask some adults you teach, whether or not productivity at the jobplace, is all it looks like. You'll be surprised.

Americans actually work the hardest.
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excitinghead



Joined: 18 Jul 2005

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What words first come to mind when thinking of Koreans? Hot tempered, passionate, stressed, inconsiderate, bbali-bbali...I'm pretty much the same on 5 hours sleep.

I seriously think that Korea could and would be a wonderful place if everyone just got a good night's sleep for once. Koreans simply have no idea how huge an impact this has on their society.

But ike Kiwigirl said, they don't know anything else, and even some of my 13-year old students only get 4-5 hours of sleep a night. It takes a lot of convincing from me that it would be considered child abuse in NZ. And then it gets worse and worse until after the University entrance exam, when finally they have a few brief years before work to have hobbies, do their own thing, and have fun, all the while still living at home until they're married...that's why so many 20-something Koreans are so childish.

Sleeping habit-wise, men have their military service on top of that to help reinforce surviving on insufficient sleep.

Ever wondered why Korea has one of the highest male smoking rates in the world, and vending machines selling crappy but cheap instant coffee on every corner?
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

excitinghead wrote:
What words first come to mind when thinking of Koreans? Hot tempered, passionate, stressed, inconsiderate, bbali-bbali...I'm pretty much the same on 5 hours sleep.

I seriously think that Korea could and would be a wonderful place if everyone just got a good night's sleep for once. Koreans simply have no idea how huge an impact this has on their society.

But ike Kiwigirl said, they don't know anything else, and even some of my 13-year old students only get 4-5 hours of sleep a night. It takes a lot of convincing from me that it would be considered child abuse in NZ. And then it gets worse and worse until after the University entrance exam, when finally they have a few brief years before work to have hobbies, do their own thing, and have fun, all the while still living at home until they're married...that's why so many 20-something Koreans are so childish.

Sleeping habit-wise, men have their military service on top of that to help reinforce surviving on insufficient sleep.

Ever wondered why Korea has one of the highest male smoking rates in the world, and vending machines selling crappy but cheap instant coffee on every corner?


Yes, but the kids don't drink so much coffee as far as I know. Look in North America kids who don't sleep much perform poorly. One major difference is kids in Korea tend to wake up and sleep more or less around the same time since they occasionally go to school on Saturdays, too.
Whereas North American kids tend to sleep in a lot (they can) and this creates a feeling of jet lag for those who stay up late during the week and then sleep in a lot. Some people believe you can function well enough on 5 hours of sleep and some people in Korea make it to some of the best universities and get good marks despite having little sleep. I find that amazing. I am not sure what people are saying in North America applies to Korean kids who have a different life-style.
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RACETRAITOR wrote:
kiwigirl :O) wrote:
the kids here dont know any other way to be....
western kids have a lot of sleep because thats how their parents brought them up to be....

i do wonder how quickly asian kids get burnt out though....it seems they study all the time (and seem to get the results they want) but they do need time to de stress and relax and be a kid (i wonder if they are having a childhood)

like even summer and winter holidays they still go to hagwon or do intensive camps to make up for the spare time where they would usually go to school....


They burn out a lot and they burn out badly.

But anyway, what can you learn by relaxing and being a kid that you can't learn by doing TOEIC questions over and over again?


These kids do better than Western kids in school despite Western kids getting more sleep. I know I would have gone nuts if I had to sleep only 5 hours a day consistently, but if it was what I was used to and I didn't sleep in during the weekend then maybe my body's internal clock would handle it fine. I just marvel at how these kids can perform while staying up late consistently.
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Demophobe



Joined: 17 May 2004

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rock wrote:
some flip out, myself included.


As do I. It didn't used to be so, but now, not being the spring chicken, I need at least 6 hours, best at 7.
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that guy



Joined: 29 Feb 2004
Location: long gone

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is sleep overrated?

Not for me.

I love snuggling down in bed and falling asleep to a movie. My Sunday is perfect when I wake up, drowsily put on coffee, and try to make sense of the morning's e-mails. I even like those nights that I wake to the random buzz of a mosquito near my head and spend a half an hour chasing the little bugger.

I could never give up the feeling I have when I wake up and try to figure out that bizarre dream I had, carrying strange images in my head for the day. I could never live without the wonder I get from dreams.
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sojourner1



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Location: Where meggi swim and 2 wheeled tractors go sput put chug alugg pug pug

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

These kids can handle it, but they just hate going to school, because they want to have more personal time to pursue hobbies and play games.

Back when I was in high school I used to sleep only 4 or 5 hours a night, felt good, worked hard, and did well. I stayed up late playing Nintendo and listening to music. My schedule was get up at 6:30 AM and go to school from 8:30AM to 3:00PM and then rush home to the MTV and then play games or music from 8:00PM to 1:00 or 2:00AM. In the summers, I worked doing hard labor and then going to a lake or river to cast my fishing pole to catch bass and catfish. I felt very strong and awesome as a kid despite not getting much sleep. I had a lot of freedom as a kid as long as I did my work. I was free to run around, do what I want, and stay up late since my parents knew I was very responsible in staying out of trouble, not complaining, being where I was supposed to be to do my work. Heck, I started walking places by myself when I was 5 and stayed up until 12 or 1 at night.

In my 20's, I used to only sleep 3 to 4 hours a night during my army days due to such high amount of work hours, great social life, and often partying into the wee hours with out any problem.

When you are young, you can burn the candle at both ends and not feel a thing, but when you start getting into your 30's, you begin to get tired or burned out and ache a lot more while wishing you were off to go back to bed during the afternoons. I just still can't help myself from staying up too late on the computer reading about it all.
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khyber



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Compunction Junction

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

too much sleep is detrimental; 6-8hrs is ideal for adults.

In my early 20s it was 3-4 hrs before my construction job. I didn't feel as good as i should but certainly felt somet things.
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excitinghead



Joined: 18 Jul 2005

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, my quote function has died on me.

Yes, but the kids don't drink so much coffee as far as I know. Look in North America kids who don't sleep much perform poorly. One major difference is kids in Korea tend to wake up and sleep more or less around the same time since they occasionally go to school on Saturdays, too.

Whereas North American kids tend to sleep in a lot (they can) and this creates a feeling of jet lag for those who stay up late during the week and then sleep in a lot. Some people believe you can function well enough on 5 hours of sleep and some people in Korea make it to some of the best universities and get good marks despite having little sleep. I find that amazing. I am not sure what people are saying in North America applies to Korean kids who have a different life-style


Dude, humans are humans in America or Korea. Kids, or to be more precise teenagers, manage better on so little sleep because they're young. And it's not like they have any choice in the matter, their teachers hitting them if they fall asleep in class and their parents not letting them sleep at home until their homework is done.

But just like some friends back home who claim they only need 4-5 hours sleep a night but never seem to count all the afternoon dozes and the 20 min catnaps, most teenagers here grab any 5 minutes they can get, several times a day. For well-rested me, it can take half an hour for me to fall asleep, but these guys are out like a light in less than a minute.

These kids do better than Western kids in school despite Western kids getting more sleep.

Yes, Korean kids outperfom Westeners on maths and science tests...so would you if from 13-18 all you learnt at school was how to pass the 수능시험, or Univeristy entrance exam. But you end up with generations of Korean 20-somethings who have learned English for 8 years but can't speak it to save their lives, and can't think for themselves because all they've learned is facts to regurgitate in the test. That would all be okay if Universities compensated for it, but which university you go to is crucial for success here, doesn't matter what you learn, and so they're all one big holiday after high school. And they sure need the rest.

Considering that half the threads here are about the crappiness of the Korean education system, you can't base an argument for Koreans' not needing so much sleep on Korea's supposed educational prowess.
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Tiberious aka Sparkles



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Location: I'm one cool cat!

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 4:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rock wrote:
No way, or yes way, SLEEP IS ABSOLUTELY ONE HUNDRED PERCENT ESSENTIAL!

How old are you? Not to pry, but YOU'LL FIND THAT AS YOU GET OLDER, YOUR MIND, AND BODY, AREN'T AS VERSATILE! Horrible mistakes occur-quit proven, from a scientific standpoint-when people lack sleep.

But to get to your point: THE YOUNG MAY SUFFER IRREPARABLE DAMAGE, as Japan has long since found out, and Korea. AND THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS MAKING UP FOR SLEEP.

Why do you think Vietnan Vets had what's called PTSD, or whatever it's called?

Recognized illness, some flip out, myself included.


You need some sleep.
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