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The Moon - 2.0

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mithridates

Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:36 am Post subject: The Moon - 2.0

Google is great. Thanks to them we're going to have the focus put back on the Moon, and this time it won't be government agencies doing the work:

http://www.economist.com/science/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9794908

Quote:

Eyes on the prize

Sep 13th 2007 | NEW YORK
From The Economist print edition
The lunar race hots up

FIFTY years ago next month, the Soviet Union stunned the world when it launched Sputnik. America responded with a lunar effort that culminated in 1969 with the successful manned Apollo landing. Three years ago, George Bush tried to recapture the magic by declaring that America will return to the moon. Now private efforts are adding impetus.

China and the European Union have plans for unmanned lunar missions. Japan is expected to launch a robotic lunar orbiter shortly. But Mr Bush says he wants a human settlement on the moon as a staging post for manned forays to Mars.

Peter Diamandis, the head of the X Prize Foundation, a charity that encourages the building of spaceships, thinks this top-down approach is as outdated as the cold war itself. Politicised government agencies and bureaucratic aerospace contractors are too slow, he insists, and manning lunar missions adds needless risk and complexity.

So Mr Diamandis's group plans to bypass governments altogether. As The Economist went to press on September 13th, the X Prize Foundation and Google were due to announce a new international competition to put an unmanned rover on the moon within five years. The internet giant is putting up $30m to sponsor the prize�with lunar videos to be featured on the firm's YouTube site.

The first non-governmental team to land a vehicle safely, drive it for 500 metres and beam back high-quality videos will win $20m, so long as the task is completed by 2012. (The jackpot falls to $15m if the rover does not reach the moon until 2013 or 2014.) There is a $5m prize for the second-place team, as well as bonuses for detecting water, travelling farther and surviving a lunar night.

Will this really spark a private-sector space race? One is already under way. Several dozen firms are busy developing cheap technologies for satellite launches, �rocket racing� games and space hotels. The same foundation helped spark this frenzy with its earlier $10m Ansari X Prize, which started a race to develop reusable vehicles for suborbital travel. Virgin Galactic, an arm of Sir Richard Branson's empire, is commercialising the winning technology from that prize and will soon be flying its first batch of paying customers.

Whether the new prize has the same catalytic effect remains to be seen. Larry Page, Google's co-founder, is convinced, and Mr Diamandis remains gung-ho. Those on the business end of space vehicles are a bit more cautious. Elon Musk, whose Space Exploration Technologies is developing rocket-launch technology, warns that it will not be easy. To oil the wheels, he is offering contestants cut-price launches. Watch that space.

They announced that they would be announcing a new prize a few days ago and I was hoping that it would involve the Moon. This is somewhat related to the other thread where we started discussing the role of private industry in spaceflight, and this is one area in which it can definitely play a role, since technologically it's well within the realm of possibility.

Here's the official site:

http://www.googlelunarxprize.org/

mithridates

Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 9:55 am Post subject:

Here's the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K4zosGUMBw

The Bobster

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 11:52 am Post subject:

they should make this as big as American football or WWF, let people declare themselves fans and root for one team or another, even find ways to contribute. Seriously. This is far more important than a lot of things people spend an inordinate amount of energy on. Legal question. The US chose not to claim the Moon as American territory, despite planting the American flag there - "We came in peace, for all mankind." What if, just suppose,some corporate business entity decides, once they go there, that they want to own it? Again, not joking, really wondering about this. (R.A. Heinlien wrote a juvenile sf novel I read as kid with this very premise, of course.)

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee

Joined: 25 May 2003

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:35 pm Post subject:

If the US government hadn't started up the space program would they have ever gotten this far?

cbclark4

Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:51 pm Post subject:

WIll this be a totally autonomous effort. I mean there are existing launch and mission control centers. Will contestants be allowed to use the existing facilities, for free? Is it just a vehicular race or full mission race?

mithridates

Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 7:36 pm Post subject:

cbclark4 wrote:

WIll this be a totally autonomous effort. I mean there are existing launch and mission control centers. Will contestants be allowed to use the existing facilities, for free?

Is it just a vehicular race or full mission race?

They have a bit of help and governments are allowed to fund up to 10% this time.

Here's some of it:

Quote:

*
SpaceX says it will offer each team an in-kind contribution that, in effect, represents a 10 percent reduction in the price of a Falcon rocket launch.
*
Universal Space Network will give the teams a 50 percent discount on its tracking, telemetry and control services, for data uplinks as well as downlinks.
*
The Allen Telescope Array, operated by the SETI Institute, will pass along 500 free megabytes of downlinked data from the lunar spacecraft - most likely including the required high-definition TV "mooncasts" sent back after landing and doing 500 meters of roving.

mithridates

Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 7:42 pm Post subject:

One group has already decided to join:

http://www.cmu.edu/homepage/global/2007/summer/to-the-moon.shtml

Quote:

Robotics Team Will Pursue $20M Prize

It was a challenge Carnegie Mellon roboticist Red Whittaker couldn't refuse: $20 million to the first team that lands and operates a robot on the moon by 2012. The challenge was announced today by the X Prize Foundation and Google. Whittaker is assembling a Carnegie Mellon team to compete.

"Planetary exploration is a dream we pursue and a technology we create," said Whittaker, the Fredkin Research Professor in Carnegie Mellon's Robotics Institute. "We have spent decades building and testing robotic technologies for just this purpose."

He added, "We are also veterans of competitive technology challenges. These are the things we do, so combining lunar rovers with a competitive race to the moon is a great opportunity."

Whittaker has been advocating the idea of landing a privately-financed robot on the moon for more than a decade, but recognizes it's a daunting task.

"This is one where every detail counts," he explained.

Jay Apt, a former astronaut who is now an associate research professor at Carnegie Mellon's Tepper School of Business and a Distinguished Service Professor in Engineering and Public Policy, said, "This is a tremendous opportunity to pioneer the endless frontier, and I am excited that Carnegie Mellon will be there."

Whittaker is director of Carnegie Mellon's Field Robotics Center, where the prototypes developed for field-testing planetary robotics technology on Earth include:

* Nomad, which searched for meteorites in Antarctica;
* Dante II, which retrieved gas samples from inside a volcano; and
* Scarab, produced for NASA to test robotic drilling with the goal of one day possibly probing for resources that could be mined on the moon.

Whittaker also leads Carnegie Mellon's Tartan Racing team, whose self-driving SUV "Boss" is a semifinalist competing for a spot in DARPA's Urban Challenge. Two vehicles developed by Whittaker's team placed second and third in the 2005 DARPA Grand Challenge across desert terrain.

About the race to the moon, Whittaker said, "It's inevitable that someone will find a way to win it. Regardless of who takes home the cash, this achievement will enrich us all."

The Bobster

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2007 12:52 pm Post subject:

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:

If the US government hadn't started up the space program would they have ever gotten this far?

I was barely alive at the time, but I'm pretty sure the Russians started off the whole thing with Sputnik. We lagged behind for several years, but we did reach make the touchdown and scored the goal first ... and no one else has yet stepped foot on the moon.

"... for all mankind."

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee

Joined: 25 May 2003

Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:08 pm Post subject:

The Bobster wrote:

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:

If the US government hadn't started up the space program would they have ever gotten this far?

Sorry If the US government hadn't started up the space program (for the US) would they have ever gotten this far?

The Bobster

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 8:53 am Post subject:

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:

Sorry If the US government hadn't started up the space program (for the US) would they have ever gotten this far?

This sentence is cryptic because of the imprecise reference of the word " they." Please amend that for clarity.

Wanted to be an astronaut when I was a kid. Gave up when I noticed aatronauts are usually military folk, and I didn't have the temperment to salute people just because someone else thinks I should - just ain't my style, I guess. Glad there are aother people who like to do that ... one more of my many failures of character, I guess.

It's been more than 3 decdes since a human walked on lunar dust. I blame NASA, because they decided to change the goal from human exploration to making a bus that goes to low-orbit and no more. I was hoping for a long time to be one of the first residents of a retirement comunity on Mars, but these govt people are letting me down ... feel like I should sue someone over this, but I'm not sure who.

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee

Joined: 25 May 2003

Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 9:22 am Post subject:

The Bobster wrote:

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:

Sorry If the US government hadn't started up the space program (for the US) would they have ever gotten this far?

I think NASA focuses too much on sending humans into space.

I would rather they focus on unmanned missions.

Leslie Cheswyck

Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile

Posted: Sat Sep 15, 2007 6:50 pm Post subject:

Sorry, guys, I can't resist. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIkHLO93lCA

Rteacher

Joined: 23 May 2005
Location: Western MA, USA

Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:52 am Post subject:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdMvQTNLaUE&NR=1

Ilsanman

Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Bucheon, Korea

Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:59 am Post subject:

What does the World Wildlife Fund have to do with this?

The Bobster wrote:

they should make this as big as American football or WWF, let people declare themselves fans and root for one team or another, even find ways to contribute. Seriously. This is far more important than a lot of things people spend an inordinate amount of energy on.

Legal question. The US chose not to claim the Moon as American territory, despite planting the American flag there - "We came in peace, for all mankind."

What if, just suppose,some corporate business entity decides, once they go there, that they want to own it? Again, not joking, really wondering about this. (R.A. Heinlien wrote a juvenile sf novel I read as kid with this very premise, of course.)

cbclark4

Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan

Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 2:23 am Post subject:

The Bobster wrote:

Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote:

If the US government hadn't started up the space program would they have ever gotten this far?

We were a step behind until Apollo maybe even made some gains during Gemini, here is the timeline:

Space race history timeline

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
October 4, 1957 - Sputnik 1, the first man-made object to orbit the Earth, is launched by the U.S.S.R., and remains in orbit until January 4, 1958.
November 3, 1957 - Sputnik 2, carrying the dog Laika for 7 days in orbit, is launched by the U.S.S.R., and remains in orbit until April 13, 1958.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
January 31, 1958 - Explorer 1, the first U.S. satellite in orbit, lifts off at Cape Canaveral using a modified ABMA-JPL Jupiter-C rocket. It carries a scientific experiment of James A. Van Allen, and discovers the Earth's radiation belt.
March 5, 1958 - Explorer 2 is launched by a Jupiter-C rocket, and fails to reach orbit.
March 17, 1958 - Vanguard 1 satellite is launched into orbit, and continues to transmit for 3 years.
May 15, 1958 - Sputnik 3 is launched by the U.S.S.R.
October 1, 1958 - N.A.S.A. is founded, taking over existing National Advisory Committee on Aeronautics.
October 11, 1958 - Pioneer 1, U.S. - IGY space probe, launched to a height of 70,700 miles.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
January 2, 1959 - Luna 1, first man-made satellite to orbit the sun, is launched by the U.S.S.R.
March 3, 1959 - Pioneer 4, fourth U.S.-IGY space probe was launched by a Juno II rocket, and achieved an earth-moon trajectory, passing within 37,000 miles of the moon. It then fell into a solar orbit, becoming the first U.S. sun orbiter.
September 12, 1959 - Luna 2 is launched, impacting on the moon on September 13 carrying a copy of the Soviet coat of arms, and becoming the first man-made object to hit the moon.
October 4, 1959 - Luna 3 translunar satellite is launched, orbiting the moon and photographing 70 percent of the far side of the moon.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
April 1, 1960 - Tiros 1, the first successful weather satellite, is launched by the U.S.
August 18, 1960 - Discoverer XIV launches the first U.S. camera-equipped Corona spy satellite.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
April 12, 1961 - Vostok 1 is launched by the U.S.S.R., carrying Cosmonaut Yuri A. Gargarin, the first man in space. He orbits the Earth once.
May 5, 1961 - Mercury Freedom 7 carries Alan B. Shepard,Jr., the first U.S. Astronaut into space, in a suborbital flight.
August 6, 1961 - Vostok 2 is launched by the U.S.S.R., carrying Cosmonaut Gherman Titov, the first day-long Soviet space flight.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
February 20, 1962 - Mercury Friendship 7 lifts off with John H. Glenn, Jr., the first American in orbit, and orbits the Earth three times.
May 24, 1962 - Mercury Aurora 7 is launched with M. Scott Carpenter, making three orbits.
July 10, 1962 - Telstar 1, U.S. satellite, beams the first live transatlantic telecast.
December 14, 1962 - U.S. Mariner 2, the first successful planetary spacecraft, flies past Venus, and enters a solar orbit.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
June 16, 1963 - Vostok 6 carries Soviet Cosmonaut Valentia Tereshkova, the first woman in space and orbits the Earth 48 times.
June, 1963 - Martin Schmidt interprets the behavior of 3C 273 - the first known quasar.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
July 31, 1964 - U.S. Ranger 7 relays the first close-range photographs of the Moon.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
March 18, 1965 - The first space walk is made from Soviet Voskhod 2 by Cosmonaut Alexei A. Leonov. Duration is 12 minutes.
March 23, 1965 - First manned flight of the Gemini program, Gemini 3 carrying Virgil I. Grissom and John W. Young. Made three orbits around the earth.
March 24, 1965 - Ranger 9 transmits high-quality images of the moon, many of which were shown live in the first television spectacular about the moon.
June 3, 1965 - Edward White II makes the first U.S. space walk from Gemini 4. Duration is 22 minutes.
July 14, 1965 - U.S. Mariner 4 returns the first close-range images about Mars.
November 16, 1965 - Soviet Venus 3 is launched, becoming the first craft to impact Venus on March 1, 1966.
December 4, 1965 - Gemini 7 is launched carrying Frank Borman and James A. Lovell, Jr., making 206 orbits around Earth and proving a trip to the Moon possible.
December 15, 1965 - American astronauts Walter Schirra, Jr. and Thomas Stafford in Gemini 6 make the first space rendezvous with Gemini 7.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
February 3, 1966 - Soviet Luna 9 is the first spacecraft to soft-land on the moon.
March 1, 1966 - Soviet Venera 3 impacts on Venus, the first spacecraft to reach another planet. It fails to return data.
March, 1966 - Soviet Luna 10 is the first spacecraft to orbit the moon.
June 2, 1966 - Surveyor 1 is the first U.S. spacecraft to soft-land on the Moon.
August 14, 1966 - U.S. Lunar Orbiter 1 enters moon orbit, and takes the first picture of the Earth from the distance of the moon.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
April 23, 1967 - Soviet Soyuz 1 is launched, carrying Vladimir M. Komarov. On April 24 it crashed, killing Komarov, the first spaceflight fatality.
October 18, 1967 - Venera 4 sends a descent capsule into the Venusian atmosphere, returning data about its composition.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
September 15, 1968 - Soviet Zond 5 is launched, the first spacecraft to orbit the Moon and return.
October 11, 1968 - Apollo 7 is the first manned Apollo mission with Walter M. Schirra, Jr., Donn F. Eisele, and Walter Cunningham. It orbited the earth once.
December 21, 1968 - Apollo 8 is launched with Frank Borman, James A. Lovell, Jr. and William A. Anders, the first Apollo to use the Saturn V rocket, and the first manned spacecraft to orbit the Moon, making 10 orbits on its 6-day mission.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
January, 1969 - Soyuz 4 & 5 perform the first Soviet spaceship docking, transferring Cosmonauts between vehicles.
July 20, 1969 - Neil Armstrong and Edwin Aldrin, Jr. make the first manned soft landing on the Moon, and the first moonwalk, using Apollo 11.
July 31, 1969 - Mariner 6 returns high-resolution images of the Martian surface, concentrating on the equatorial region.
August 5, 1969 - Mariner 7 returns high-resolution images of the Martian surface, concentrating on the southern hemisphere.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
April 11, 1970 - Apollo 13 is launched, suffering an explosion in its SM oxygen tanks. Its Moon landing is aborted, and the crew, James A. Lovell, Jr., John L. Swigert, Jr. and Fred W. Haise, Jr., return safely.
September 12, 1970 - Soviet Luna 16 is launched, conducting the first successful return of lunar soil samples by an automatic spacecraft.
November 17, 1970 - Luna 17 lands on the moon, with the first automatic robot, Lunokhod 1. Driven by a five-man team on earth, traveled over surface for 11 days.
December 15, 1970 - Soviet Venera 7 is the first probe to soft-land on Venus, transmitting for 23 minutes.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
January 31, 1971 - Apollo 14 moon mission is launched by the U.S. with the legendary Alan Shepard, along with Stuart Roosa and Edgar Mitchell on board. They land in the planned Apollo 13 site, the Fra Mauro highlands, which they explore with the help of a two-wheeled cart that permits the transport of a significantly greater quantity of lunar material than previous missions. Shepard becomes the first man to hit a golf ball on the moon.
April 19, 1971 - Salyut 1 space station is launched by the U.S.S.R. It remains in orbit until May 28, 1973.
May 30, 1971 - The United States launches Mariner 9, which becomes the first spacecraft to survey Mars from orbit.
June 6, 1971 - Soyuz 11 carried Cosmonauts G.T. Dobrovolsky, V.N. Volkov, and V.I. Patsayev to Salyut 1, the first manned occupancy of an orbital station. However, on June 29, the Cosmonauts died upon Soyuz 11's reentry.
July 30, 1971 - Apollo 15 astronauts David Scott and James Irwin drive the first moon rover. The next year, Apollo 17 astronaut Harrison Schmitt drives a similar rover.
November 13, 1971 - American Mariner 9 (launched May 30, 1971) is the first spacecraft to orbit another planet, Mars. Over the next year, it maps 100 percent of the Martian surface.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
March 2, 1972 - Pioneer 10 is launched on an Atlas/Centaur/TE364-4 towards Jupiter by the U.S., designed to familiarize alien life with humans. It returns the first close-up images of Jupiter in 1973.
July 15, 1972 - Pioneer 10 becomes the first man-made object to travel through the asteroid belt.
December, 1972 - Scientists designate Cignus X-1 as the first probable black hole.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
April 5, 1973 - Pioneer 11 is launched on an Atlas/Centaur/TE364-4, flying past Jupiter in 1974, and Saturn in 1979, where it discovers new rings.
May 14, 1973 - Skylab Workshop is launched by the U.S., and maintained by three crews.
May 25, 1973 - First crew to Skylab, Skylab 2, are launched, repairing damage incurred to Skylab during its launch.
November 3, 1973 - American Mariner 10 is launched, on the first dual-planet mission. Over the next year, it returned photographs of Venus and Mercury.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
May 17, 1974 - NASA launches the first Synchronous Meteorological Satellite, SMS-1.
June 24, 1974 - Soviet Salyut 3, their first military space station, is launched. It remains in orbit until January 1975.
December 26, 1974 - Soviet Salyut 4, civilian space station, is launched. It remains in orbit until February 2, 1977.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
July, 1975 - American Apollo (1 Cool

and Soviet Soyuz 19 dock, the first international spacecraft rendezvous.

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/data-archive/space-travel-timeline.php

Another site of interest:

http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/lunar/apollo.html

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