Korean Job Discussion Forums

[mack4289]

Well, it's at least complicated. I've been seeing these commercials on the Discovery Channel for "The Complete", a series of specials on Nelson Mandela, Muhammad Ali and Fidel Castro. It struck me that Castro was out of place in that group so I wanted to find out if there was any connection between Mandela and Castro. Well, actually, they gave a speech together in Cuba, where Mandela praised Castro. Also, Castro isn't the only shady character Mandela likes.

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/suncommentary/la-op-kirchick29jul29,1,2198675.story?coll=la-headlines-suncomment

"Why would the ANC, which came to power with such worldwide respect and goodwill, be willing to squander its moral authority so easily? A large part of the explanation rests with Mandela himself. Although he is regarded as perhaps the most inspirational figure in the world, the fact is that throughout his life, Mandela has praised an unseemly crew of dictators -- including Fidel Castro ("Long live Comrade Fidel Castro!" he said in 1991), Moammar Kadafi (whom he visited in 1997 in defiance of American objections) and Yasser Arafat ("a comrade in arms") -- for their support of the ANC while it was in exile."


He also had some extreme things to say about the US war in Iraq:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/01/30/sprj.irq.mandela/index.html

""one power with a president who has no foresight, who cannot think properly, is now wanting to plunge the world into a holocaust."

Speaking at the International Women's Forum, Mandela said "if there is a country that has committed unspeakable atrocities in the world, it is the United States of America."

Mandela said U.S. President George W. Bush covets the oil in Iraq "because Iraq produces 64 percent of the oil in the world. What Bush wants is to get hold of that oil." In fact Iraq contributes to only 5 percent of world oil exports.

... They do not care. Is it because the secretary-general of the United Nations is now a black man?" said Mandela, referring to Kofi Annan, who is from Ghana."

Mandela obviously did incredible things and deserves the praise he has received, but does that mean he gets a free pass when he sounds like an idiot? Critcizing the Iraq War was something we needed a lot more of, but why discredit yourself by playing the race card and saying Bush wanted a holocaust?

More disturbing stuff about Mandela, although it's from an obviously biased source.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID={FA7C5FD5-75BE-4B02-A993-0208A2DECF6E}

"It�s disgusting to see people apologize for doing nothing wrong, especially to wrongdoers.

On July 14, Miami-Dade County mayor Alex Penelas spoke at the NAACP�s national convention in Miami Beach and apologized for protests of Nelson Mandela during his June 1990 visit to Miami. Why did these protests occur?

Maybe it had something to do with the former South African president�s affection for mass murderers.

Sentenced to life imprisonment in June 1964 for armed resistance to the apartheid regime, Mandela was released in February 1990. In May he visited Libyan tyrant Muammar Qadhafi and received the �International Qadhafi Prize for Human Rights,� an award with the moral logic of an �Heinrich Himmler Prize for Religious Tolerance.� Mandela�s remarks included:

We consider ourselves to be comrades in arms to the Palestinian Arabs in their struggle for the liberation of Palestine. There is not a single citizen in South Africa who is not ready to stand by his Palestinian brothers in their legitimate fight against the Zionist racists.�

Mandela returned to Libya in 1997 and called Qadhafi �my dear brother leader,� decorating him with South Africa�s highest honor, the Order of Good Hope. He called Yasser Arafat his �comrade in arms� in 1990 and in 1999 laid a wreath at the Ayatollah Khomeini�s tomb, saying, �[W]e are indebted to the Islamic Revolution.� When Iran�s theocrats charged 13 Iranian Jews with spying for �the Zionist regime� in 2000, Mandela called the sham proceedings �fair and just.�

One more. Here's Mandela on the convicted Lockerbie bomber's imprisonment conditions.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Lockerbie/Story/0,2763,740130,00.html

"Former South African president Nelson Mandela today called for a fresh appeal in the case of the Lockerbie bomber Abdel Baset al-Megrahi, and asked that the prisoner be transferred to serve out his sentence nearer his native Libya.

Mr Mandela met with al-Megrahi for more than an hour at Glasgow's Barlinnie prison, where he is serving a life sentence for murder. Megrahi was convicted last year of smuggling a bomb aboard Pan Am Flight 103, which exploded over Lockerbie on December 21 1988. The bombing killed 270 people.

Mr Mandela today called for Scottish authorities to consider Megrahi serving his term in a Muslim country closer to his family.
"Megrahi is all alone," Mr Mandela told a packed press conference in the prison's visitors' room. "He has nobody he can talk to. It is a psychological persecution that a man must stay for the length of his long sentence all alone."

Mr Mandela added: "It would be fair if he were transferred to a Muslim country - and there are Muslim countries which are trusted by the west. It will make it easier for his family to visit him if he is in a place like the kingdom of Morocco, Tunisia or Egypt."

Mr Mandela also hopes to meet the prime minister, Tony Blair, and the US president, George Bush, to discuss the case.

Mr Mandela, who spent more than 20 years as a prisoner of South Africa's apartheid regime, said Megrahi was being "harassed" by other inmates at Barlinnie.

"He says he is being treated well by the officials but when he takes exercise he has been harassed by a number of prisoners. He cannot identify them because they shout at him from their cells through the windows and sometimes it is difficult even for the officials to know from which quarter the shouting occurs," he said."

[wo buxihuan hanguoren]

Probably just senile these days as he is mad old, poor little fella has hired Afrikaners to take care of him, oh, the irony!

[bejarano-korea]

is nelson mandela kind of a crackpot?


No.


Why would he be?


Nelson Mandela is probably the ONLY politician who is loved by the people. He comes to the UK and people black and white mob him wherever he goes.

You are showing an ignorance of South African history if you don't know why Nelson Mandela has a special relationship with Fidel Castro.

But I'm here to educate you about it so you tell me why Nelson Mandela is a crackpot?

[bejarano-korea]

[mack4289]

[happeningthang]

I don't know where you're getting this from.

Of your articles the only one that lays out any meaningful argument is the LATimes piece, and that one is talking more about the current South African regime, not Mandela.

Mandela brokered the deal that saw the Lockerbie bombers surrendered to Scottish authorities, so it's not that surprising that there's evidence of mutual schmoozing between him and Gadaffi.

As for Castro, what does he really do to the world but stay on his island and lord over Cuba?

And there have been strong rebukes against Mugabe by Mandela.

http://www.namibian.com.na/Netstories/2000/May/Africa/007A98DA73.html

http://www.aegis.com/news/afp/2000/AF000997.html


Talking to South Africans, they tell me Mandela had a hand in a massacre at some point, and that's something worth talking about.

[mack4289]

I don't deny that Mandela has taken some courageous stands against Mugabe and Mbeki's ridiculous stance on AIDS (among other courageous stands he's taken). But his support for Castro (maybe he's not important enough to deserve the criticism he gets, but he's definitely not worthy of the praise Mandela gives him), Arafat (who used foreign aid as a personal bank account and contributed a great deal to his people's destitution), and Gaddafi (who I don't know much about but seems to have set his country up for the same kind of dead-end socialism that Castro created in Cuba) at least creates a much more complicated picture of Mandela than we're used to getting. It doesn't fit with the wisdom and maturity he shows on a lot of other issues.

[thepeel]

[thepeel]

[Mosley]

And lest we forget the proxy wars Castro fought in Africa.

There's nothing new or surprising in the OP. Should we be so surprised? After all, the ANC was founded with a good dose of Marxism-Leninism included in its platform.

[nautilus]

[LUCRETIA]

"Jungle bunnies"?

Are you serious?

[Tony_Balony]

Mandella was not interested or not useful in the post colonial meltdown. Even now for Sudan he's AWOL.

[igotthisguitar]

Crackpot? i dunno ...

Is it true that Mandella is a 33rd degree Freemason?
He's clearly a commie.

For his part Castro is a 100% Jesuit