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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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 Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 2:23 am Post subject: |
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| but it would be even better if Americans didn't spend so much time taking opposing views and blindly defending them, and instead tried to see the others point of view. There are a lot of "blind" Americans, wouldn't you agree? |
You did it again. Why is it Americans?
Why not substitute 'people in this world'? Would it not be a better if world if everyone tried a little harder to understand other points of view? Including....ahem...you.
I say that because
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| if Americans didn't spend so much time taking opposing views and blindly defending them |
1) you are lumping all 300,000,000 Americans into one group and insinuating that they all think the same and 2) that all of them are wrong and the 'other' point of view (yours???) is right. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 2:37 am Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
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| but it would be even better if Americans didn't spend so much time taking opposing views and blindly defending them, and instead tried to see the others point of view. There are a lot of "blind" Americans, wouldn't you agree? |
You did it again. Why is it Americans?
Why not substitute 'people in this world'? Would it not be a better if world if everyone tried a little harder to understand other points of view? Including....ahem...you.
I say that because
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| if Americans didn't spend so much time taking opposing views and blindly defending them |
1) you are lumping all 300,000,000 Americans into one group and insinuating that they all think the same and 2) that all of them are wrong and the 'other' point of view (yours???) is right. |
Your argument is juvenile. How could I possibly believe that 300,000,000 people could agree on anything. |
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Fresh Prince
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: The glorious nation of Korea
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 3:06 am Post subject: |
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There's a lot more to the story than can be read in a single news article.
The person attacked was released from the hospital however it doesn't explain that in the U.S. if you don't have health insurance, then you need to pay in cash for your treatment. It could be that he didn't have the money to pay for treatment.
The person attacked also went to a school ring ceremony but it doesn't say why he went and how long he stayed there. It could be that he showed up to get his class ring and left. In the U.S., class rings are highly prized possessions .
Whatever happened, most news articles do not really go into much depth. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 3:07 am Post subject: |
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Are you so blind that you cannot even understand what you have written? At this point I choose be generous and ask if it is your thinking that is at fault, or just your poor writing?
What I think is really going on is that you are uncomfortable being called on your 'crap'. You can sit on your bar stool back in Deer Fly, Ontario and stereotype till the loons drown and everyone just nods.
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| Despite your rhetoric, it might surprise you to know that I have always been a great supporter of the American people. |
This is the NotAmerican version of "Some of my best friends are Negroes." |
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Fresh Prince
Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Location: The glorious nation of Korea
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 3:16 am Post subject: |
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I did some quick looking into the story and found this:
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... next day, Aug. 31, the first students to arrive at school found nooses (some reports say three, some say two) hanging from the tree. Administrators immediately took them down, and the majority of students, who arrived after 7:15 a.m., never saw them. They later learned about the nooses from television and newspaper reports.
The school quickly found the three white students who had hung the nooses but concluded�and this is admittedly surprising�that they had no racial motivation for what the school called a �prank.� It should be underlined that the local police and the FBI also interviewed the boys and found no racial motive. The local US Attorney, Donald Washington, who is black, later looked into the nooses incident, and he, too, and found no grounds for action. The nooses were painted in the Jena High colors�black and gold�which does suggest a non-racial motive. Jena High School does not release details about student disciplinary matters, but word leaked out that the culprits were imitating something from a television program. |
http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2007/09/jena.php
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After lunch, black football star Mychal Bell walked up to a white student named Justin Barker and punched him to the ground from behind. Some eight to ten boys�all black�then started kicking him. Witness statements taken later used phrases like �stomped him badly,� �stepped on his face,� �knocked out cold on the ground,� and �slammed his head on the concrete beam.� According to court documents, Mr. Barker was probably unconscious before he hit the ground, where his attackers stomped his �lifeless� body. The Jena Times calls it �one of the most violent attacks in Jena High School�s history.�
When Assistant Principal Gawan Burgess got to the scene, he thought the boy was dead. He was bleeding from ears and nose and showed no sign of life. An ambulance took Mr. Barker to LaSalle General Hospital, where he was in the emergency room for about 2-1/2 hours and racked up a bill of $5,467. A brain scan showed no anomalies, and he was released. |
http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2007/09/jena.php
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| Much has been made later of the fact that that evening he attended the school�s annual class ring ceremony where, as a junior, he was to get a ring. �I waited 11 years to go to it,� he has since explained. �I wasn�t going to let that get in my way.� Mr. Barker had a swollen face and was in considerable pain. He left the ceremony early, as soon as he got his ring. He says he was blind in one eye for three weeks, and was still suffering from headaches six months after the beating. |
http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2007/09/jena.php
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| A student who testified at the trial said that just before Mr. Bell attacked Mr. Barker she heard a black say, �There�s that white mother f***er that was running his mouth.� It should be underlined that Mr. Barker was not one of the three whites disciplined for the noose affair, nor did he have anything to do with the fights at the Fair Barn or at Gotta Go. |
http://www.amren.com/mtnews/archives/2007/09/jena.php |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 3:50 am Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
Are you so blind that you cannot even understand what you have written? At this point I choose be generous and ask if it is your thinking that is at fault, or just your poor writing?
What I think is really going on is that you are uncomfortable being called on your 'crap'. You can sit on your bar stool back in Deer Fly, Ontario and stereotype till the loons drown and everyone just nods.
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| Despite your rhetoric, it might surprise you to know that I have always been a great supporter of the American people. |
This is the NotAmerican version of "Some of my best friends are Negroes." |
OK, professor.
Still don't see what "crap" it is you're referring to. Boy, some Americans sure are touchy when it comes to "America the Beautiful" being challenged. My God, your country has a song by the name, for god's sake. What you don't seem to understand is America opens itself to criticism because of its mythology. You don't seem to like the idea that Canadians (or other nationalities I presume) are putting those myths up and saying, well, maybe America ain't ALL beautiful, and here's where it isn't.
Sorry that Americans are grouped together. Maybe you should take that up with the Founding Fathers, who had the idea in the first place. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 6:56 am Post subject: |
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| What you don't seem to understand |
What YOU don't seem to understand is that I jump on the posters who stereotype the Koreans, too. I dislike stereotyping. It's lazy and sloppy thinking, as well as condescending and arrogant.
Try to stay on topic. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:06 am Post subject: |
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| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
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| What you don't seem to understand |
What YOU don't seem to understand is that I jump on the posters who stereotype the Koreans, too. I dislike stereotyping. It's lazy and sloppy thinking, as well as condescending and arrogant.
Try to stay on topic. |
Stay on topic? I started the topic! You challenged me about the thread title, and tried to make it about me launching a smear campaign against the U.S.
In this entire thread, you have been completely defensive about your "homeland" (god I hate the way that word is used since 9/11).
You seem quite touchy about Canadians being critical of Americans. You shouldn't be. Americans have shown with the Iraq invasion, the Patriot Act, and electing George Bush 1 1/2 times that you are not very good at critical thinking when left on your own. We are glad to offer our insights, free of charge. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:09 am Post subject: |
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Blaseblasphemer:
Speaking as a Canadian who routinely criticizes American polices, I advise you to desist with your current schtick. For your own sake. Your professed intentions to critique American "mythology" just sound pretentious, and you come off as a walking cliche.
Of course, if you enjoy sounding like a walking cliche... |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:14 am Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
Blaseblasphemer:
Speaking as a Canadian who routinely criticizes American polices, I advise you to desist with your current schtick. For your own sake. Your professed intentions to critique American "mythology" just sound pretentious, and you come off as a walking cliche.
Of course, if you enjoy sounding like a walking cliche... |
how is it a cliche to call Americans on their defensiveness? let ya-ta fight his own battles. sorry if the mythology comment was over your head. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:18 am Post subject: |
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| sorry if the mythology comment was over your head. |
Uh no, it was pretty much the opposite of "over my head". Whatever idiom that would be.
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| let ya-ta fight his own battles. |
I'm curious as to why you would think it is your place to tell me which side to take in an on-line debate. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:23 am Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
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| sorry if the mythology comment was over your head. |
Uh no, it was pretty much the opposite of "over my head". Whatever idiom that would be.
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| let ya-ta fight his own battles. |
I'm curious as to why you would think it is your place to tell me which side to take in an on-line debate. |
because you're adding nothing to the debate. You're an "armchair quarterback". That's an apt idiom for you. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:27 am Post subject: |
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| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| On the other hand wrote: |
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| sorry if the mythology comment was over your head. |
Uh no, it was pretty much the opposite of "over my head". Whatever idiom that would be.
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| let ya-ta fight his own battles. |
I'm curious as to why you would think it is your place to tell me which side to take in an on-line debate. |
because you're adding nothing to the debate. You're an "armchair quarterback". That's an apt idiom for you. |
Fair enough. Knock yourself out, dude... |
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just4u
Joined: 30 May 2007
Location: Georgia, USA
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:32 am Post subject: Re: "Jena 6": America the not-so-beautiful |
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| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
Just read about this story, after Jesse Jackson reportedly said that Barrack Obama is acting like a White man, based on his "lack" of response to this story. Shocking, seems like things may not be too different in the Deep South in 2007, as they were in 1957...
http://www.colorofchange.org/jena/ |
No, things aren't too different. A time warp analogy is a very good way of putting it, it certainly does feel that way at times. I live in this region and you have to walk very carefully here. People can't just "get mad" at each other like they do in Korea, there is a lot of racial tension and the wrong word or even the wrong look to someone who is bothering you could easily be misinterpreted as a racial thing if the person happens to be of a different race. (I'm talking about all races here-this is not just going in one direction.) Add that to elders who are easily offended if you don't kiss their arse (especially if they're rich-it's realllly hard if you've ever been a server) and you had better watch your ass, every day.
You all have it easy in Korea. After coming back here, I can't believe I ever complained about Korea. Taiwan, possibly (it's hard to make money there just like here) but Korea....pssshawww. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:41 am Post subject: |
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| You seem quite touchy |
You are right. I am quite touchy about negative stereotyping, which has been the topic of every exchange you and I have had, totally aside from any discussion of the events in Jena.
Odd that you should say I'm being defensive. I even posted some stats on lynchings. I'm well aware of and comfortable discussing the difficulties the US has had with race relations over the centuries. But that hasn't really been the topic I have been addressing with you.
It appears to me that if anyone is being defensive, it is you. With each post the tone seems to grow increasingly hysterical.
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| You shouldn't be. Americans have shown with the Iraq invasion, the Patriot Act, and electing George Bush 1 1/2 times that you are not very good at critical thinking when left on your own. |
I think I can safely say that this is the third time in this one thread that you have stereotyped Americans. I'm fairly sure, since you mention '1 1/2', that you know the Election of '00 was a dead heat. How can you then follow that with 'you [Americans] are not very good at critical thinking'?
I can't help but think that there is more going on in your head than a simple case of mis-speaking.
So by all means, continue to discuss Jena with other posters. I still want to address the issue of your 3 cases of stereotyping.
PS: Are you sure you are spelling your ID right?
Last edited by Ya-ta Boy on Mon Sep 24, 2007 7:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
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