Korean Job Discussion Forums

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This is a demonization of conspiracy theorists. You advocate they have a lot of power, which they simply don't, as the fringe members of society that they are. Conspiracy theorists simply misinterpret evidence and sometimes deliberately refuse to look at alternatives and rebuttals.

If one doesn't know much about physics, conspiracy theories such as 9/11 and Apollo 11 can sound very convincing ... but it's only a small minority of people who take them on and these individuals have a minimal influence on wider society. Look at 'Loose Change'. We've all seen 'Loose Change' but most ordinary people have never heard of it. To most - I dunno, 90% - the Apollo 11 guys did indeed walk on the moon and 9/11 was indeed perpetrated by Islamic terrorists.

It's also important not to demonize legitimate comment. I no longer believe in the 9/11 conspiracy or Apollo 11 conspiracy because I - unlike others with a fancy for conspiracy theories - am happy to look at the evidence opposing (completely refuting) those positions. However, the question "why did the undamaged parts of Twin Towers offer almost no resistance during collapse?" is a legitimate question. Can science answer? Yes it can. So fair enough. Can the Apollo 11 astronauts explain what appears to be evidence of trickery in the photos of them half way to the Moon? Yes, they can, because those conspirators were extremely selective in the bits they used. So fair enough. And like you said, there's no evidence whatsoever for manned missions to the Moon being genuine other than 800 pounds of Moon rock.

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[igotthisguitar]

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Dwight David Eisenhower is often cited by liberals as the man who warned us about the military-industrial complex when he was president. What he was actually saying on behalf of eastern finance capitalism at the time was that the deficit spending on massive military operations was undermining the stability of the dollar, and the ability of US imperialism to challenge its junior partners, i.e. the stability of the dollar, compared with the mark, franc, yen, and pound sterling was undermined by total dependence on military production.

So what did he do to counter these massive military interventions with huge forces? With Secretary of State John Foster Dulles he staged a terror operation, a putsch, in Iran which removed the government of Mossadegh, elected in 1952 and which had nationalized the oil, and they imposed the Shah of Iran. The Mossad and CIA set up a terror apparatus in the form of a torture operation in which hundreds of thousands disappeared and were tortured to death and held incommunicado in prisons for decades.

A similar thing happened in Guatemala in 1954 under Eisenhower/Dulles. They overthrew the Arbenz government with none other than E. Howard Hunt (of Watergate fame) at the helm of that operation. And guess where its headquarters were? 544 Camp Street in New Orleans, the same address which subsequently would be the headquarters of the Cuban Revolutionary Council, a dummy organization of the CIA, out of which the organizing of the Kennedy execution was prepared. It was that exact address, as established by New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison, of Lee Harvey Oswald's fake Fair Play for Cuba Committee, a one-person operation. As Oswald, the CIA operative, was being prepared as the patsy for the JFK assassination, he was being portrayed as a Fidel supporter.

Getting the picture yet of how capitalism works, the schemes, the plots? 9/11 was no conspiracy, it was simply business as usual for the rulers. It is not a question of management by conspiracy, but rather the ruling class has to operate in conspiratorial fashion. So, Eisenhower's opposition to the military-industrial complex was conjoined to counterrevolution on the cheap: terror squads, coup d'etats, assassinations, and putsches, the same formula the Kennedy brothers used in Laos with the Phoenix program of the Green Berets. Counterposing that to massive military intervention with hundreds of thousands of troops that a wing of pentagon favors but which jeopardizes the stability of the dollar, this debate is about the means of survival by way of maintaining the imperium. There is nothing out there for the rest of us.

This is a crisis of capitalism addicted to permanent war, a facade of public relations types bought and paid for, a millionaires' club that fronts for a concentrated structure of power. If we do not grasp this, or provide a strategy for struggle based upon the essential recognition of the nature of our society, we will but perpetuate its rule, and prevent ourselves from reaching out to our own constituency.

This has been condensed from 070918 Six Years After 9/11: Where Do We Go From Here? available for download from http://takingaimradio.com/shows/audio.html

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[jinju]

For me its rather obvious. The internet has allowed the anti social to gravitate to each other. Its sort of a paradox, but its true. A bunch of anti social losers, who in the real world would have trouble forming a sentence in the presence of a warm body are gravitating to each other. Strenght in numbers combined with anonymity? I suppose. As far as conspiracy theories go, theyve been around for ages. It allows certain dellusional rejects to feel like they have some power over those they were rejected by. Its like "you may think Im a lsoer and you humiliated me in highschool but look who is laughing now, I know something big you dont know and that makes me better". The internet just gives them a forum.

I used to like the X-Files, btw. I just didnt take it to be more than a story. FICTION.

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