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topas
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
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 Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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| therooster wrote: |
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hate that women are still expected to pull a second shift when they get home from work, while their "partners" pat themselves on the back for washing the dishes once in a while. I also hate that women put up with it--if you want equal division of labour, don't settle for less.
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holy crap ...are you sane ????
Name one man....one single man you know who EXPECTS women to have to work two shifts !!! And even if you can do that...please show me how this is evidence that men in any significant number feel the same...what a crock of *beep* ... |
Actually, I can think of a couple guys that expect their partners to do the bulk of the housework AFTER getting home from their full-time jobs, though they would never say so out loud. And there is plenty of evidence out there that others feel the same way. You can find it in the library. Check some ASA publications. I remember reading a pretty recent article by Kevin McQuillen and Marilyn Belle about the division of labour in Canadian households a little while ago. It's shocking how little has changed since the 1970s for some people.
It's really great and everything that you and all the people you know are so enlightened. It seriously is. But clearly, you don't speak for everyone. And it's just plain offensive the way you belittle other people's experiences and act as if they're not important.
Also, I have to say it really pissed me off when you wrote
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| I'm sure we can all really get along fine , so why bother with feminism ??.....it's not like you have to deal with clitoridectamy or anything... |
There are plenty of women out there who have to deal with clitorectomy, including some women I know personally. So why do you think feminism shouldn't be relevant to me? And if you're such a swell and enlightened guy living in a world where things like clitorectomy happen, why isn't in relevant to you ? |
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jessie-b
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 8:46 pm Post subject: |
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Jeezus Krist on a crutch, I hope I'm mistaking your sarcasm for ignorance....so....who cleans in your house? You're saying that the men you know do the exact same amount of cleaning as the women do? I have yet to see it...without a struggle.
BTW, there were men who were supporters of the women's movement, just as there were white people who were supporters of the civil rights movement, but a majority of the momentum was carried by those who would most immediately benifit from changes. AND YES, there is STILL resistance to these movements...
are you being sarcastic when you say otherwise???? |
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DRAMA OVERKILL
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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 I don't really mean that. I just wanted to find a good inappropriate place to use it. |
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nateium
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Do we still need feminism? |
When thinking about poverty, starvation, overpopulation, environmental degradation, war, global warming, education etc.,
feminism doesn't seem to top the list of priorities for someone from a developed country to consider. It's better to focus on more pressing concerns first. |
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jessie-b
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:42 pm Post subject: |
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| nateium wrote: |
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| Do we still need feminism? |
When thinking about poverty, starvation, overpopulation, environmental degradation, war, global warming, education etc.,
feminism doesn't seem to top the list of priorities for someone from a developed country to consider. It's better to focus on more pressing concerns first. |
Except that most of the people living in poverty and starvation in the world are WOMEN and CHILDREN. Not to mention that overpopulation is also a birth control issue connected with feminism as well. Duh. |
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nateium
Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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| jessie-b wrote: |
| nateium wrote: |
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| Do we still need feminism? |
When thinking about poverty, starvation, overpopulation, environmental degradation, war, global warming, education etc.,
feminism doesn't seem to top the list of priorities for someone from a developed country to consider. It's better to focus on more pressing concerns first. |
Except that most of the people living in poverty and starvation in the world are WOMEN and CHILDREN. Not to mention that overpopulation is also a birth control issue connected with feminism as well. Duh. |
well get to it then.
That's the real issue worth being concerned about, not wage differences in developed countries. |
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therooster
Joined: 11 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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Actually I do have some strong feelings about clitodectomy....I wrote about it before
http://fingerandthumb.blogspot.com/2006/10/doomsday-devices-reconsidered.html
but really now...we're talking about the western world....please provide a list of names of western female friends of yours who recently had their clitoris ritualistically removed by one of the tribes elders ? Do I have to be held accountable for what the women of central africa do to their daughters ? Wow..I know you women are always blaming us for your problems but are western men also responsible for this now ?
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Jeezus Krist on a crutch, I hope I'm mistaking your sarcasm for ignorance....so....who cleans in your house? You're saying that the men you know do the exact same amount of cleaning as the women do? I have yet to see it...without a struggle.
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If left to me I'd hardly ever clean...I'm a pig ..a pig I tell you !! I can let the junk and litter pile up upon itself until it's a veritable swamp and still I remain highly unmotivated to do anything about it . Lucky for the sake of my personal hygene I've always been able to afford a maid ....or always had a girlfriend (not that I could always afford them) who was willing to clean up rather than die the slow toxic death I'd rather endure than do it......that's her perrogative.....
But you know just cause I like to have satelite tv for the extra sport and the odd beer...doesn't mean I forsee her apathy and lack of willingness in helping me pay and obtain them as oppression...I like beer and sport......she likes cleanliness....go for it honey...
silly example as I dont even like sport much......but I do love cooking....love it !! I tried to convince my girlfriend to let me do all the cooking , but after she was victim to my rather unique experiments in taste ...she releaved me of this responsibility ...For now Jamie Olivier can rest east , the bastard....but my time will come...
Come now girls...be honest...you don't really think you are opressed do you ???
tell the truth....if you can.... |
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therooster
Joined: 11 May 2007
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| Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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well get to it then.
That's the real issue worth being concerned about, not wage differences in developed countries. |
Well said...there must be a million issues more important and crucial to align yourself with , than the ficticious oppression of women in western socities.....stop wasting your lives and do something important ...if you can escape the rampant narcicism and princess complex you all suffer for long enough to realise ...."wow...it's not all about me!!" |
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jessie-b
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 12:11 am Post subject: |
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| therooster wrote: |
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well get to it then.
That's the real issue worth being concerned about, not wage differences in developed countries. |
Well said...there must be a million issues more important and crucial to align yourself with , than the ficticious oppression of women in western socities.....stop wasting your lives and do something important ...if you can escape the rampant narcicism and princess complex you all suffer for long enough to realise ...."wow...it's not all about me!!" |
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topas
Joined: 25 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 12:16 am Post subject: |
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| therooster wrote: |
Actually I do have some strong feelings about clitodectomy....I wrote about it before
http://fingerandthumb.blogspot.com/2006/10/doomsday-devices-reconsidered.html
but really now...we're talking about the western world....please provide a list of names of western female friends of yours who recently had their clitoris ritualistically removed by one of the tribes elders ? Do I have to be held accountable for what the women of central africa do to their daughters ? Wow..I know you women are always blaming us for your problems but are western men also responsible for this now ?
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Who said all my friends are white "western" women? |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:46 am Post subject: |
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yes. The men need something to feel persecuted by  |
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therooster
Joined: 11 May 2007
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 3:25 am Post subject: |
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Yup . You all know I'm right . You can't really sit there and tell me you are oppressed with a straight face can you ?
Who's your daddy ? |
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MarionG
Joined: 14 Sep 2006
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:00 am Post subject: |
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In answer to the rooster's request to name one single man:
Robert M.Nye, James J Heinemann, George L. Ekins, Marv Block, Jim Edwards, William R. Warner, James Neal Almirall, Robert Hargreaves, Seamus George, Bill Genereux, Ralph Elbers, Joe Jenks, Bob Wills, Jim Wills and Joe Wills (brothers) Berkeley Idler, Bob Aldus, Jason Nelson, Dan Samuels, Borden Gates, Jim Cott, Bill French, Porter Phillips, Tyler Anderson, J. H. van Burgen
shall I think about it some more and come up with others? |
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in_seoul_2003
Joined: 24 Nov 2003
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:15 am Post subject: |
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| whether or not one still believes in calling him/herself a feminist, you still have to contend with which feminist variation to call yourself. so a simple 'feminism' is no longer even an issue. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2007 6:07 am Post subject: |
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| Underwaterbob wrote: |
Why are all the interviewees current popular music stars?
Ask the women who are making less money for the same work as men, those stuck behind glass ceilings and those being regularily abused and even mutilated by men in the name of certain laws against infractions that the men are committing freely if they still need feminism.
I didn't read the article BTW, just your quotation. |
Women kill men every day and get away with it. There are many "syndromes" or "defences" available to women, that are not available for men. I firmly believe in Canada, women have more power than men in terms of the laws. I'm speaking in terms of economic, criminal, and social power. Men are treated like second-class citizens by the courts. |
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