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stevemcgarrett
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
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 Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:30 am Post subject: THOSE MAGNANIMOUS MUSLIMS & THEIR LYING MACHINES |
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This just off the AP wire:
Sudan pardons 'teddy bear' row teacher
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Sudanese President Omar al-Beshir on Monday pardoned a British woman teacher jailed for 15 days for insulting religion and she will be released in an hour, a presidential advisor told AFP.
"She was pardoned thanks to the mediation of Lord Ahmed and Baroness Warsi. She will be released in about an hour," Mahjoub Fadl Badri told AFP.
A Sudanese court on Thursday jailed Gillian Gibbons to 15 days in prison for insulting religion by naming a teddy bear after the Prophet Mohammed at the exclusive English school where she taught in Khartoum.
Two British Muslim peers, Lord Nazir Ahmed and Baroness Sayeeda Warsi, from the upper house of parliament, were on Monday meeting Beshir at the Republican Palace after flying to Khartoum in order to secure a pardon.
The arrest and jail sentence of the 54-year-old mother of two sparked outrage in Britain and a diplomatic crisis between London and Khartoum, further straining relations already frayed over nearly five years of war in Darfur. |
My understanding of the situation is that she plans to pack her things and leave Sudan regardless. Who can blame her?
This utterly unreasonable, ungrateful, and manipulative reaction, which had been supported by the theocracy in Khartoum and its lying machines of the state media, leads me to ask:
Would you gladly work in a Muslim country with similar draconian laws and backward thinking even if it paid very well?
As for myself, I would not ever consider going to teach in any society where I would have to watch my every move for fear of offending some religious zealot and landing myself in prison, or worse. Indeed, I wouldn't deign to even consider applying to teach in a country whose people weren't likely to welcome me and treat me as a guest (which is one of the reasons I'm leaving Korea).
I once had the chance to teach in Saudi Arabia for the equivalent of 6 million won a month plus wonderfully spacious, free housing and utilities, not to mention a generous relocation allowance, first-rate medical care, and air transport for both my spouse and me. I simply could not justify teaching in such an oppressive society where women are second class citizens, where Filipina guest workers are often physically and sexually abused without the hope of redress and where I would be strongly discouraged from mentioning (much less celebrating) my cultural heritage or societal preferences. This principled position also prevents me from seeking employment in Russia, Indonesia, Malaysia, Venezuela, Serbia, most of the swath of the Middle East, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Somalia, North Africa, Myanmar, Pakistan, Iran, Cuba and North Korea (not that I could teach in either of the latter two anyway)..
How about you? Where do you draw the line? Where in this world would you not teach and why? |
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Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:31 am Post subject: |
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As a parent, I can not be as reckless as I once was so places like the West Bank or Gaza are out, or anywhere where malaria or other desease is prevalent, and I also have to consider pollution. My kids have to be first consideration. Otherwise I would consider most places.
Whether or not I would work in country whose government/culture or what-have-you I disapproved of would depend on whether I felt I was propping up the system, or contributing meaningfully to individuals. So in the case of Saudi Arabia, I understand why you would choose not to work there. I am a woman however, so I would be teaching females, the very people who are disadvantaged in that society. Therefore I would feel that I was contributing to the betterment of females in that society and I wouldn't feel I was betraying my principles. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:55 am Post subject: |
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(which is one of the reasons I'm leaving Korea).
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This is a great Christmas present. Thank you, Santa, for giving me a present early this year.
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| This principled position |
allowed you to teach in China. Oh, the irony of it all. |
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Neil
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: Tokyo
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:56 am Post subject: |
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| This principled position also prevents me from seeking employment in Russia, Indonesia, Malaysia, Venezuela, Serbia, most of the swath of the Middle East, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Somalia, North Africa, Myanmar, Pakistan, Iran, Cuba and North Korea (not that I could teach in either of the latter two anyway).. |
Yeah, I probably wouldn't teach in those places, also another one you left out with a crappy human rights record......can't remember the name, begins with C I think, has an awful lot of people, really good food, think they have an olympics coming up. |
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Fishead soup
Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| I have already worked in The United Arab Emirates. It's no where near as bad as Saudi Arabia. Although most of the children there are spoiled and behave really badly around the Kafir. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:27 pm Post subject: Re: THOSE MAGNANIMOUS MUSLIMS & THEIR LYING MACHINES |
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| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
As for myself, I would not ever consider going to teach in any society where I would have to watch my every move for fear of offending some religious zealot and landing myself in prison, or worse. Indeed, I wouldn't deign to even consider applying to teach in a country whose people weren't likely to welcome me and treat me as a guest (which is one of the reasons I'm leaving Korea).
I once had the chance to teach in Saudi Arabia for the equivalent of 6 million won a month plus wonderfully spacious, free housing and utilities, not to mention a generous relocation allowance, first-rate medical care, and air transport for both my spouse and me. I simply could not justify teaching in such an oppressive society where women are second class citizens, where Filipina guest workers are often physically and sexually abused without the hope of redress and where I would be strongly discouraged from mentioning (much less celebrating) my cultural heritage or societal preferences. This principled position also prevents me from seeking employment in Russia, Indonesia, Malaysia, Venezuela, Serbia, most of the swath of the Middle East, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Somalia, North Africa, Myanmar, Pakistan, Iran, Cuba and North Korea (not that I could teach in either of the latter two anyway).. |
Steve, I'd like to understand you here. So you left America and traveled halfway around the world to look for a place that is just like...America? |
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stevemcgarrett
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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bacasper wondered:
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| Steve, I'd like to understand you here. So you left America and traveled halfway around the world to look for a place that is just like...America? |
Of course not, and while I'm returning to the U.S. short term to teach at a major university there, I have longer range plans to teach in a particular Asian location to continue my research. As you should know, I lived and worked in several Asian countries over the past two decades, so I can hardly be said to be seeking a society that replicates American values. Nor am I in search of utopia or a place to hide as some on these boards want to believe. To the contrary, I have become increasingly alienated from contemporary American individualism that embraces a hedonistic "anything goes" mentality, the gun culture, the PC movement that attempts to obscure realities, the death of common sense and with it the rise of petty litigation, the embrace of ghetto vulgarism, the prevalence of a mentality of victimhood and entitlement (especially in certain minority communities), the political impasse borne of a two-party system, the trend toward acceptance of a fat and sendentary lifestyle among so many, the devolution of Hollywood cinema, and the jock mentality that pervades so many schools.
However, I refuse to work in any country where the government AND the vast majority of the citizenry continue to support a system of gender apartheid, where theocracy dictates all social conduct but by a double standard, where autocracy is privileged (e.g. Russia) even by the masses, or where I know I won't be allowed to present alternative ways of living or thinking.
fishead soup:
I'd be willing to consider one of the Gulf States, although for the reason you mentioned, I wouldn't go out of my way to do so.
Big Bird:
If I could teach Muslim women and feel that I had a chance to be an agent of change (i.e. help them to empower themselves regardless of the imposed curriculum), I might reconsider a place like Saudi Arabia. But are there such places in Saudi Arabia? (I know the Gulf States have them).
tata boy spouted:
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| allowed you to teach in China. Oh, the irony of it all. |
Feeble retort there but not surprising given the source. China has made considerable social progress in the past three decades. Real reform is occurring in the universities and while the state is still autocratic, women there occupy more positions of power (especially in education and business) than you will ever find in Korea or Japan. Moreover, the Chinese are open to most Western ideas even if they ultimately conform them to their own socio-cultural needs, (as well they should). If you'd spent any real time there, you'd know this. Then again, you might just be too obtuse or willful to notice even if you have.
I said I was leaving; I didn't say I WAS LEAVING THIS FORUM.
"Aw, Mom, another pair of socks for Christmas. Gee, gosh, darn." |
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runlikegump
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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As for myself, I would not ever consider going to teach in any society where I would have to watch my every move for fear of offending some religious zealot and landing myself in prison, or worse. Indeed, I wouldn't deign to even consider applying to teach in a country whose people weren't likely to welcome me and treat me as a guest (which is one of the reasons I'm leaving Korea).
I once had the chance to teach in Saudi Arabia for the equivalent of 6 million won a month plus wonderfully spacious, free housing and utilities, not to mention a generous relocation allowance, first-rate medical care, and air transport for both my spouse and me. I simply could not justify teaching in such an oppressive society where women are second class citizens, where Filipina guest workers are often physically and sexually abused without the hope of redress and where I would be strongly discouraged from mentioning (much less celebrating) my cultural heritage or societal preferences. This principled position also prevents me from seeking employment in Russia, Indonesia, Malaysia, Venezuela, Serbia, most of the swath of the Middle East, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Somalia, North Africa, Myanmar, Pakistan, Iran, Cuba and North Korea (not that I could teach in either of the latter two anyway).. |
Wow, what an incredibly amazing and principled human being you are. I've got some chums on the Nobel Committee - let me see if we can get you one of those peace prizes as soon as possible. Oh, but you will probably have to cut out all that ridiculous generalizing you do about everything different from that found in the nice insular land of Stevemcgarrettia.
Hands down the most self-important post of the year. And on these forums, that's quite a feat. |
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stevemcgarrett
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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Gump camp follower:
My purpose in delineating the American scene in my previous post was merely to clarify my views, which are so often misrepresented on this forum by detractors. I don't state these views in summary form unless I feel the situation warrants it.
Now back to your regularly scheduled programming--er--snide commentary. |
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bacasper
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
...while I'm returning to the U.S. short term to teach at a major university there, I have longer range plans to teach in a particular Asian location to continue my research. As you should know, I lived and worked in several Asian countries over the past two decades, so I can hardly be said to be seeking a society that replicates American values. Nor am I in search of utopia or a place to hide as some on these boards want to believe. To the contrary, I have become increasingly alienated from contemporary American individualism that embraces a hedonistic "anything goes" mentality, the gun culture, the PC movement that attempts to obscure realities, the death of common sense and with it the rise of petty litigation, the embrace of ghetto vulgarism, the prevalence of a mentality of victimhood and entitlement (especially in certain minority communities), the political impasse borne of a two-party system, the trend toward acceptance of a fat and sendentary lifestyle among so many, the devolution of Hollywood cinema, and the jock mentality that pervades so many schools.
However, I refuse to work in any country where the government AND the vast majority of the citizenry continue to support a system of gender apartheid, where theocracy dictates all social conduct but by a double standard, where autocracy is privileged (e.g. Russia) even by the masses, or where I know I won't be allowed to present alternative ways of living or thinking. |
That's a pretty tall order. You're not calling it a utopia but whatever it is, I hope you'll let us know if you ever find it. |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
| Ya-Ta wrote: |
| allowed you to teach in China. Oh, the irony of it all. |
Feeble retort there but not surprising given the source. China has made considerable social progress in the past three decades. |
I guess as long as you don't consider gendercide a step backwards. But hey, you've got yours. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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huffdaddy, you beat me to it.
McGarrett's 21st Century Thesaurus: 'principled position'
synonym: self-serving, egocentric, egoistic, egoistical, egomaniacal, egotistic, egotistical, self-absorbed, self-centered, self-involved, selfish, self-seeking. |
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endo
Joined: 14 Mar 2004
Location: Seoul...my home
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 12:51 am Post subject: Re: THOSE MAGNANIMOUS MUSLIMS & THEIR LYING MACHINES |
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| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
This principled position also prevents me from seeking employment in Russia, Indonesia, Malaysia, Venezuela, Serbia, most of the swath of the Middle East, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Somalia, North Africa, Myanmar, Pakistan, Iran, Cuba and North Korea (not that I could teach in either of the latter two anyway)..
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Yet you choose to work in China? |
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twg
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Location: Getting some fresh air...
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:22 am Post subject: Re: THOSE MAGNANIMOUS MUSLIMS & THEIR LYING MACHINES |
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| endo wrote: |
| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
This principled position also prevents me from seeking employment in Russia, Indonesia, Malaysia, Venezuela, Serbia, most of the swath of the Middle East, Zimbabwe, Sudan, Somalia, North Africa, Myanmar, Pakistan, Iran, Cuba and North Korea (not that I could teach in either of the latter two anyway)..
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Yet you choose to work in China? |
No no. You don't get it!
Someone from China was willing to have sex with him. Thus "Chinese evil" had become "Chinese misunderstood" |
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Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
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| Posted: Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:17 am Post subject: |
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I just love it when China and Muslims get discussed in the same thread. Gives me an excuse to post this yet again. 
Islamic supremacists at war with the world are threatening to send humanity into a hell we cannot imagine. The stage has been set. Western progressive countries have stopped growing and poverty-ridden societies are spreading rapidly. The only large militarily strong and economically growing society in the world today is the People�s Republic of China.
Stupidity, thy name is jihad
Self-centered jihadists seem to not realize that defeating the United States, most likely by bankrupting its economy or with a smuggled nuclear device, would be the worst thing they could possibly do to themselves. Without a United States to protect them, the jihadists would be fully exposed. A militant, totalitarian China would be the only superpower left in the world. It is inconceivable that China wouldn�t take great advantage of this position. For starters, poorly defended, oil-rich Arab countries would be easy prey for oil-hungry China. Small-time terror-funding sheiks wouldn�t even know what hit them...
...Jihadists have no hope against China
Red China is the hegemonic gorilla that even suicidal Muslims fear, if only subconsciously, because of its power and equal unconcern for individual lives. China has the will to wipe every non-Han Chinese person off the globe, and Muslims are unwittingly acting as the catalyst. Muslims have no hope against Chinese manufacturing. Muslims cannot walk around freely in Beijing as they do in London . They cannot manipulate principals of human rights or freedom of the press, because those don�t exist in China. Without a West to defend them, Muslims will have met not only their Waterloo with China, but their Auschwitz. |
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