Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Eazy_E]

I don't mean to be inflammatory or insulting with this post. Before you read further, just note that I really like my job and that the children are partly what makes it worthwhile.

But.... I have heard from people who taught in China as well as Korea that the kids here are particularly difficult to control. Keeping in mind that all young children are rowdy and misbehave to a certain extent, is it possible that Korean children are "worse" than most? I know from my own experience that they usually won't just behave for the sake of behaving: you need a regime of rewards and punishments to keep them in line. I've seen everything from these kids, from attempts to bite me, earsplitting shrieks, hitting, plus the garden variety control issues: "sit down, sit down, get out your books, sit down, come back, give that back" (my quotes).

Has anyone here taught in another Asian country or back home and found the Korean kids to be harder to keep under control than others? I'd like some thoughts on this.

[Mr. Pink]

I think kids are the same everywhere. They are all like Robin Williams on coke.

[adventureman]

[Joe Thanks]

Korean kids don't respect foreign authority for the most part, but they are products of their families and society.

It is not impossible to win them over, depending on how spoiled they are and how much support you get from the DOS or your boss.

If there is established discipline then the kids will fall into a line of manageability. From there it's how you learn the ropes and ply what you know to control, communicate, educate and get points across. You have to win a majority over. The Korean dynamic is a group dynamic and if the group likes you the ones causing trouble are ostracized to an extent and end up conforming or being shown for the trouble that they cause and will get zinged by a professional DOS or boss.

Korean people work hard, fight hard, play hard, party hard and die hard. So, the kids will be more extravert around foreigners.

At least they are lively (till middle school and then you get a lot of zombies and depressed kids and that's a whole other ball game, and understandably so).

In Taiwan, the kids are generally restrained but lethargic. Many who could afford buxiban were spoiled and so mollycoddled that if the teacher didn't have a smile on for .5 seconds the mothers would insinuate that there is a problem with the teacher - even though maybe the teacher was teaching a sound and couldn't smile while pronouncing the "R" sound. - That kind of crap.

Some of the kids in Taiwan were also motivated by bribery. I blame the foreign teachers who held influence on this - probably well meaning folks who created a Frankenstein monster. The reward system was all rewards with no earning. Lot of games had to be played. The problem with that is the add thing where after a day they hate the game and want more. Try that for 300 days.

In Korea I found that the kids well understood the "work hard and earn" ethic. If they understand there's a game (forget about it being an educational game - I found SK kids refreshing in that the fact something was a game alone was a perk. In Taiwan, my experience was that if it was a game it had o be their game and anything that had lessons involved was met with groans - not always, but a lot. In public schools it was different and the kids loved educational games because I guess they viewed it still being about playing a game - like SK kids, but the Sk kids I am talking about are all hogwon kids).

In Taiwan it was hard to bond with the kids. Once break was on hey didn't want to do much with teacher. Teachers playing with students was viewed as weird. A cultural thing, for sure.

in SK - I could go shoot hoops with some students and it was like they loved it. If I had time to kill and sat next to little Jae-won or Hae-joo and asked them about their joondachi or manga they were pretty keen to share.


I liked my Taiwanese students but they were rather restrained. When we'd do something fun they'd have fun but I felt like I was working.. I loved my SK students because they had gusto. When we did something fun it didn't feel like work but it felt like fun.

This ties into the cutlure, really. Koreans are passionate people - the closest I've come to in NE Asia to matchign Italians, except SK passion cuts two distinct paths. One is melodramatic and dangerous (the jingoism) and one is impressive and life-affirming (the partying and gung ho game spirit).

Just some thoughts that I think relate to your post.


Cheers,

Joe

[howie2424]

Interesting thread. I've often thought about the question as I spend alot of time teaching kindi. I'd be really interested in hearing from anyone who has taught both Korean and North American kindi and can make a legitimate comparison. Anybody out there?

[anae]

Generally I believe kids are kids everywhere. There are always kids who don't see adults as authority figures (or adults new to them) and don't want to change over from their agenda to your agenda. However, after teaching kindergarten in both Korea and Canada, I would say that teaching in Korea easier. In my experience, Korean children seem to come more prepared to be in school. There seem to be more expectations that parents pass onto kids in Korea about school and how to behave there. I also ran into fewer extreme behavior issues. In five years in Korea, I only met two emotionally disturbed children. Both of them had parents that pushed them in formal learning situations before the age of three, and this led to violent outbursts in the classroom.

In Canada, as a sub I usually find at least one "coded" (everything from ADD to Fetal-Alcohol-Syndrome to oppositional-defiant) child in most classrooms. One kid in kindy was so disturbed that he was asked to stay home when the teacher was absent, because that kind of change in the routine would set him off to the point it would be dangerous for the other children to be in the room with him.

[crazylemongirl]

I'm with anae.

The kids in korea are slightly better, but they have their problems too.

CLG

[tomato]

In my own country, I've taught ghetto kids and I've taught suburban kids. I would say Korean kids are about halfway between the two . . . except that kids in my country don't dongchim.

[Zed]

Joe, interesting and insightful post especially since I am considering a move to Taiwan.

What is 'buxiban'?

[Zed]

[some waygug-in]

Not having taught kids in Canada, except for guitar lessons, I can't really compare, but I think that the kids I taught in Mexico were just as bad as the kids here. In some ways they were worse, and in some ways they were better. The biggest difference though was the fact that Spanish is a hell of a lot closer to English than Korean, so usually I could get them to understand something related to what I was talking about.

The teens were a lot more eager to sing in Mexico, which was nice. Here, it's like pulling teeth. Even the younger kids here, a lot of them won't sing a song properly to save their own life, they just shout some Korean crap to the same tune or just ignore me altogether and read a comic book.

There is something about being a foreign teacher here. Did you ever notice how differently the students act with Korean teacher compared to a wayguk? There is no comparison. The students just assume that foreign teacher = free for all. I've yet to see a Korean teacher being "ddong chimmed".

I have to say though, there were good and bad students in Mexico just like here. The bad ones were awful, the good ones were great fun.

cheers

PS: One thing I forgot to mention. I found the school management was a lot easier to deal with in Mexico, it wasn't just that I spoke Spanish either. They actually listened to what I had to say and tried to help make things work. ( at least the places where I worked)

It sure was no problem if I wanted to kick students out of the classroom in Mexico. The director understood that sometimes it is necessary. In Korea, at least where I worked, that is a "no no"

Here, it's more like, "You are a bad teacher. A parent complained. You are a bad teacher. A student complained. You are a bad teacher. No one complained, but you let the students out 30 seconds before the buzzer! You are a bad teacher. You didn't straighten up the chairs after class! You are a bad teacher. You actually expect to stay home sick! You are a bad teacher. You actually want to have the textbook!!!!!!! You are a bad teacher. You play too many games. No more games in class!!!!!!!!!! followed next week by...........
You are a bad teacher. Your classes are too boring.

[adventureman]

..

[ratslash]

i've said it before and i'll say it again - i feel sorry for korea in ten to fifteen years when these kids grow up and take positions of authority. i have never met such spoilt children in all my life. some of the kids need a right royal spanking!

this is because, i think, korea has gone from having a whole batch of kids per family to having one or two. therefore, the one or two get spoiled rotten, not only by the parents but of course the doting grandparents. the (grand) parents never say no. if they try to the kid starts crying and eventually gets what they want. if i started crying in england coz i didn't get what i wanted i'd be given something to cry about.

a little off topic all the above, but it leads me to a neat point that someone else mentioned. no respect for authority. who, in a child's life, are the authority figures? mum or dad. now, if the kids don't respect the authority of their parents, evidenced above in the 'never say no', are they going to respect some waygook in a hagwon? of course not. hence, the kids are a nightmare to control coz they don't respect you. and, if the waygook does try to discpline jonnie kim then he runs crying to mummy, she pulls the kid from the school, waygook gets sacked. what you'd expect to happen, is that the parent would perhaps listen to why the child was disciplined and take action accordingly. but no, they can't have little johnnie upset now can they?!?

[Eazy_E]

Thanks for the replies to this thread. I think that one thing about Korean children that I find extremely annoying is that it takes so much effort just to shut them up. Granted, they can't always understand what I say. But even with my older classes, I tell the kids not to talk when I'm talking. They shut up for a few seconds, then talk away as though I hadn't objected in the first place. Sometimes this includes throwing things, eating, playing games, miscellaneous fooling around...

I don't remember kids doing that in Canada... when the teacher expected the students to listen they generally shut up. They usually only needed one warning if at all.

Just my little gripe for the day.

[Ody]