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chronicpride
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 2:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Wow! Well, if your story jives with Julice's version, the other teacher's and any other people that may have been privy to the situation (thus making it more than a one-sided testimonial, which all valid blacklists should have), then that's a pretty crappy deal. |
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Novalis
Joined: 19 Sep 2003
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| Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:19 pm Post subject: Clarification |
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Gord said:
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| The guy complaing about the "oh, she lied, not being paid for time worked" was so completely wrong in his statements that he went and deleted all his messages already. As such, why save it when even he has gone on to admit that it was a complete mistake to post? |
�A complete mistake�? Let�s stop the sensationalism, Gord. I never said that! I�m going to make one more statement about my experience with Julice, and after that I�m not going to post anything else about this, because I�m going to say everything in this post that I have to say about it, and quite frankly I have better things to do than sit here and argue back and forth over and over again with these two imbeciles. Again, if you don�t see it my way, you have the right to your opinion, and I don�t care if you agree with me or not enough to go twisting anybody�s arm over it. That�s why I deleted what I had previously written about Julice, because I was taking way too much heat for simply reporting my experience and expressing my opinion, and I just wanted it to stop, but I�m not going to back down to these jerks again. (You know who you are!) To anyone thinking about using Julice or believing my critics unfeeling rants (or is it propaganda?), consider this as a warning. Take it or leave it.
I�m going to post the questions and comments I had about the contract Julice sent me again, so people can see it and decide for themselves if they agree with the criticisms I made in it.
I took the following statements from the contract that Julice sent. I�m certainly not going to sign it, but I have some questions and comments about it.
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3. TEACHING HOURS
1)The number of regular teaching hours will be minimum 30 hours per week / 120 hours per month.(N.B; This is the actual number of teaching hours and class preparation time and break time are not included).
2)In the event that the actual number of teaching hours scheduled for any particular month is below hours, the Employee will be required to perform company-related work such as editing, creating dialogues, interviewing, etc to meet the guaranteed hour for that month or the following month.
3)Class will be held from Monday to Friday.
4)Occasionally if asked by the manager, the Employee agrees to take some training to make his class better.
5)Classes and teaching will be scheduled in accordance with the needs of Party A.
The Employee�s monthly teaching schedules will fall somewhere between 6:30am and 9:20pm, based upon the guaranteed hour per month.
The Employee is entitled to taking specified breaks during working hours for a meal and rest (the �Break�) at such time as shall be the schedule specified by the employer. In arranging the Employee�s monthly teaching schedule, the employer shall make every effort to arrange classes so that the break shall fall in the middle of the Employee�s working day. |
I think it�s noteworthy to point out that they didn�t mention what my exact schedule would be. The fifth clause is particularly interesting: �Classes and teaching will be scheduled in accordance with the needs of Party A�, i.e., the employer. Apparently, I don�t have a say in this.
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| 1) The employer agrees to support medical insurance. The employer pays fifty percent of medical insurance premiums for the employee and the other fifty percent should be paid by the employee. The employee�s insurance premium will be deducted from his/her monthly salary. Dental and pre-existing conditions (diseases) are not covered by the insurance. |
What percentage of my monthly salary would this deduction for medical insurance be? It's interesting that they didn't specify that in the contract!
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| 2)South Korean income taxes will be withheld automatically from the employee�s monthly salary. Income tax on the monthly salary runs at about 3.3%. |
Is it true what is stated about income taxes above?
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| 4)The employee is required by law to participate in the Korean pension plan. 4.5% will be deducted from the instructor�s salary and put into the pension plan. The employer will contribute 4.5% to the fund, for a total of 9%. This amount of money (9%) will be returned to the employee when the employee�s contract is finished and he/she leaves Korea. (It depends upon the official agreement between Korea and Party the employee�s country.) |
What�s going on here? This just doesn�t sound right. So they take out some percentage I�m not even sure of for medical insurance, 3.3% for income taxes, and 4.5% for a pension that I will never use? Do I really have a chance at all of receiving this money deducted for the national pension plan back when I leave Korea? If so, then how long would it take, and how much would the process cost me? What would it involve? Furthermore, if I stayed in Korea for another year and didn�t �leave Korea� as the contract says, then would I still be able to get this money back?
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12. REVISION, CANCELLATION AND TERMINATION OF THE CONTRACT
1)Both parties will abide by the contract and will refrain from revising,
canceling, or terminating the contract without mutual consent.
2)The contract can be revised, terminated or canceled with mutual consent. Before both parties have reached an agreement, the contract should be strictly observed. |
About #2, if we�d be mutually revising or canceling the contract, then how could we be strictly observing it? I take it �strictly observing� means �following�, does it not, or am I misinterpreting this?
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3)The employer has the right to cancel the contract with a written notice to the employee under the following conditions;
(1)The employee does not fulfill the contract or does not fulfill contract obligations according to the terms stipulated, and fails to amend after the employer has pointed it out.
(2)According to the doctor�s diagnosis, the employee cannot resume normal work after a continued 1-week sick leave.
(3)If many of the employee�s students keep on complaining about class or if an unacceptable drop of number of student enrollment for the 3 consecutive months occurs because of the employer�s improper teaching skills. |
That third one is a nice little clause, isn�t it? They even have the gull to write into the contract that if I don�t keep the students happy they will fire me!! Forget teaching. Apparently, this employer thinks it�s more important for me to be a good entertainer that keeps the students happy! Who ever said that a good teacher had to be well liked by the students?
This is also a good example of how Korean language school manager�s bad English can make the terms of a contract unclear or ambiguous. �The� 3 consecutive months? Which 3 consecutive months? I suppose they mean any 3 consecutive months that I would be employed there.
It�s funny that Gord didn�t understand that last criticism. Gord, so you don�t know that �the� is a definite article? They said �the� 3 consecutive months, but they didn�t say which ones. "The" 3 consecutive months is different from "any" 3 consecutive months that I would be employed there. I hope it gets through to you this time, so I can get that English teacher of the year award shipped off to you in time for Thanksgiving.
Alright, just to clarify, I don�t have it out for Julice. It�s just that I wouldn�t recommend her. I have the right to my opinion. As Tiger Beer said, she just basically hooks you up with an employer who�s looking to hire. Well, if the job turns out to be bad, then she has to take some of the responsibility. If a car sales representative sells you a car, and the car turns out to be a lemon, then he/she could just blame the manufacturer or the previous owner or you. This, however, would not be the responsible thing to do. It�s the same principle with recruiters. Julice Ltd. is a business. It's main interest is making money. Julice herself tried to get me to work for another business, whose main interest is also making money. Personally, it bothers me to be seen more as a tool to be used so some people that are well-off (these language school owners and administrators) can stay that way and get even more money in their bank accounts, rather than as a teacher with the freedom to do what I want in the classroom. I�m not a sales representative, and I�m not a tool. I�m a teacher, and if that means that I wouldn�t be able to work for 99% of the employers in Korea, then I won�t work for them. If you�ve become numb to being exploited by the rich (like these language school owners, and yes, plenty of them are rich), or if you never had any principles to begin with, then that�s your problem. It's not my problem if you can be bought. To those of you who have been, you're just not my kind. Furthermore, the contract Julice sent me was dubious. I just posted my problems with it again in this post, and if you didn�t see them (again!), then that�s also your problem, not mine. Also, I got two different stories from Julice about what my exact schedule would be and a different one from one of the teachers at the school � That�s a total of three. Why is it so hard to tell someone what their work schedule will be? Surely, it can�t purely be just because of cultural differences! Is it so hard to be straightforward and thorough? Also, first she told me that I would have to make my decision by Monday of the next week. Then she said it would have to be by Friday of that week, then once I waited past Friday, she told me I needed to make my decision by Tuesday. So which of the three days was it? See where I�m going with this. Where�s the consistency? Let me add that when I asked for the e-mail address of the teacher who was leaving, she told me she didn�t think it was necessary for me to talk to more than the one teacher I had already e-mailed back and forth with. Obviously, she was just trying to put pressure on me to sign, so I couldn�t think things through.
I�d also like to add that it�s quite likely that some of the regular posters on Dave�s may very well be employed by the Korean government to attack anyone who complains about Korea. Would that be so unfathomable? Korea�s not far from a police state from what I�ve heard, and I believe it! How 'bout you?! |
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maxxx_power
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
Location: BWAHAHAHAHA! I'M FREE!!!!!!!
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| Posted: Tue Nov 11, 2003 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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Sounds like you're getting too paranoid. If you have those doubts about the job, don't take it. Contact another agency and wait until you get a contract you can accept.
Keep in mind that contracts here are not like contracts in America. Koreans put a lot of emphasis on relationships, and often see complaining or wanting things in writing as a sign of mistrust.
You're going to get screwed over frequently in Korea, there's things in this culture that would get you sued in America that are perfectly acceptable here. You'll see when you get here.
Good luck. |
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