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Respect and ethics? Not with this recruiter.
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santalucia



Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Location: PoHang, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Hammer wrote:
Santalucia,

Reality Check

1. If you are so knowledgeable why are you only asking for 40K+ transport?
2. If you are so knowledgeable why aren't you setting up your own gigs?

Hammer


You missed the point. The point was not the cash negotiation. The point was testing the character of the person who wanted to do business with me (sorry, rip me off). As I thought, he first tried to bovine-excrament me, and then he when into a girly whine laced with insults.

I made no mention of my economic arrangements in Korea, Hammer. Not the purpose of this thread. But since you ask, the going rate is between 40K and 60K depending on the work, location, age of students, experience of the teacher and the type of course being taught. I would not pull in the same amount of money for teaching K-12 than I would teaching a course in Legal English.

I avoid recruiters, as I told this one, and deal directly with my clients whereever I can, and where it is legal under the laws of the countries where I work to do so. The trouble is that Korean schools and companies seem hell-bent on using them when they would have better luck advertising directly.
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The Hammer



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Ullungdo 37.5 N, 130.9 E, altitude : 223 m

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, thanks for that.

Next Reality Check Question:

3. What the hell are you doing in Pohang?
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The Hammer



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Ullungdo 37.5 N, 130.9 E, altitude : 223 m

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pkang0202 wrote:
The best recruiters in the world work for the US military. Its true. Military recruiters are amazing. They can sweet talk you like you wouldn't believe. They can make "infantry soldier" sound like a vacation in Maui.


25th Infantry Division, Hawaii



Now Hiring!
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santalucia



Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Location: PoHang, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:06 am    Post subject: I'm working as a "hostess" outside Camp Mucheok Reply with quote

Quote:

What the hell are you doing in Pohang?


I decided to jack in this teaching gig and become a camp follower for the US Marines. The money's better and I have to deal with less crap, (your average drunken sailor is much more of a gentleman than your average soju-pickeled ajeoshi and hey, my pimp takes his cut but not as much as your average ESL recruiter.


Last edited by santalucia on Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:12 am; edited 1 time in total
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Roch



Joined: 24 Apr 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CentralCali wrote:
I'm not sure about this. The recruiter's English skills seem to be a cut or two above the recruitee's. For another, Jeff was quite polite in response to Santalucia's rudeness. And Santalucia's tactic is to tell Jeff that he'll try to ruin Jeff's reputation and business? Brilliant move, "boss." In your vast experience of three years in country, have you never encountered the libel/slander laws of Korea?


You, Venus, Koamerican, Joebld, and the rest of your ilk take the prize for a lot of dings.

Peace.

Rochie
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Roch



Joined: 24 Apr 2003
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:13 am    Post subject: Re: A further reply Reply with quote

santalucia wrote:
Hi Again ,
Your emails still have that arrogance meaning ,
You still think that you know all and you are the only one who can decide and judge others.
Let put things clear ,i contacted you with a propositions , so you had just to take or to refuse it ,
But you just start judging me and my work ,

I don't owe you any apology , because i didn't do anything wrong ,
You were judging me and i replied, you said i am rude and i said you are insane ,

Com'on [Santalucia] ,be rational and admit that you went far with your emails,

All your emails full of insults an i am sorry that you are representing the foreigners image,
and abt your threats, that's another face of arrogance,i do not want to stand down at that level ,

All what i can say , i wish you a good luck with in Korean ,and i do not represent Koreans, i represent just myself .
Maybe i am wrong , maybe i am right ,


Thrully

_________________

The reason why I probe character and motivations is to find out what kind of person I will be doing business with.

Cali, you are entitled to your opinion but I was not rude. I merely insisted on the going rate. My emails were not full of insults. His were, and it got personal very quickly because of unprofessionalism and (I think) a general contempt for teachers. He tried to spin me a line and patronise me. He got burned. It's just business.

I get accused of being "insane", which, if you know Korean culture or language at all, is a major insult. What Jeff is objecting to is my insistance that he pays the market rate, which he terms of arrogance. I call it being firm and professional. He also doesn't realise that judging the business and character of any potential associates is part of my job.

And yes, all my time in Korea has taught me exactly how to deal with recruiters. Very very firmly. If their reputations need to suffer a little for them to start behaving honourably and professionally, so be it. I'm a teacher here 24/7. But its not just English I teach. Respect has nothing to do with your level of English.


CaliCentral has some issues with Whitey.

Roch
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tzechuk



Joined: 20 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You have acted professionally, but...

You said you've been here a long time - is 3 years now counted as a long time? When you said you've been here a long time, I was expecting 10+ years. I thought I've been here for a long time after 7.5 years but just Monday, I had lunch with 4 other people - one has been here 15+, the other three 10+ years. I have a friend who came here since 1972 with Peace Corps. THOSE are what I call a long time... sorry to say, but 3 years really isn't all that long.
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santalucia



Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Location: PoHang, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 7:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, but a lot of that time was actually spent inside a Korean university community at the bottom of the Korean food chain, not a teacher. Some might regard that as an enternity. What I meant though, I've been here long enough. More from our friend.
______________________

Dear Jeff,

The full text of your emails have now been posted on Daves ESL cafe.

http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?p=1462218#1462218

Have a nice day,

Santalucia

_______________________


All what i can say is "*beep* yourself ",
You are a real mother fucker ,

who cares abt what you post or what you say ,
You will get my respond for your act soon,
hahahah
you are really a fired fucking bitch ,

Trully yours,

Jeff

_________________________________

Dear Jeff

Thank you for your email.

By all means keep writing, this is most entertaining. All you are doing is showing just how unprofessional you can be, proving me right with every word you type. Remember, respect is not about how good your English is, but how you use it.

Incidentally, the colloquial verb that you use here is generally written "to be a motherf*cker" and not "*to be a mother f*cker". To have sex with one's mother requires anatomical parts which, as a woman, I don't have. Motherf*cker is offensive, but comical in the way you use it since you cannot apply it to a woman. When we tell others to engage in masturbation as an insult, we would normal say "go [and] f*ck yourself." "To be a motherf*cker" and "Go f*ck yourself" are perferred ways to insult people in US English, along with "c*cksucker" and even just a plain "F*ck you!". You cannot call a woman a c*cksucker - this is considered comical or something of a compliment. In Britain we avoid the use of "c*cksucker" "m*therfucker" and always include the conjuction "and" in any insulting phrase begining with "go".

"B*tch" however, can be applied to both a man and a woman. It is infinitely more offensive if you apply it to a male. For example, a man - or indeed a woman - might use the phrase "bring it on b*tch, you don't scare me" in a conflict situation, indicating that they are not concerned with any threats, real or implied, that the man may be making. When someone calls a man "B*tch", the implication is that he is the receptive partner in a homosexual relationship.

I hope that this will help you insult foriegners in my language with greater accuracy and ease in the future. Myself, I try to avoid the use of curses in any language but my own, and even then, only with intelligence.

I'm willing to offer you a free online class to help you improve on your written and cross-cultural communication. I would remind you that all I have done is post your own written words to me publicly.

Warm regards

Santalucia
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CentralCali



Joined: 17 May 2007

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roch,

What on Earth are you talking about?
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cbclark4



Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is not offenseive: "You think you know everything?"

Where did you get your negotiation skills?
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shaunew



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Location: Calgary

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had the same problem with this guy. I wrote about him on here as well warning people not to use him. He sent me very rude text messages and emails as well. He would phone me in the middle of the night. This guy is very weird and should not do business with anyone. I think he should have a criminal record check. When I talked to him about a job we was working for English with Jenny. I wanted business English he said yes of course business English showed up to a kiddie hagwon.
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Ya-ta Boy



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the OP deserves some sympathy--s/he is going through life with few people skills, at least judging by what has been posted.
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regicide



Joined: 01 Sep 2006
Location: United States

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ya-ta Boy wrote:
I think the OP deserves some sympathy--s/he is going through life with few people skills, at least judging by what has been posted.



I think you need to get a life , Yata Boy
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diablo3



Joined: 11 Sep 2004

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Respect and ethics from recruiters? Only a handful

Well, the op is confident and she can ask for what she is entitled to. She can simply try another and move on quickly if she cannot deal with this particular recruiter.

Korean agents and schools normally don't answer serious questions. They simply want you to follow their sucker agenda.

If I lived in Korea that long myself, I would ask the same, even without 3 years teaching experience.
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soju pizza



Joined: 21 Feb 2007

PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They both seem like douchebags to me.
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