| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
|
 Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:01 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Quote: |
| yeah, what other former premier and leader of a rival opposition party has everything to gain from this tragic crime against the Pakistani people? |
al-Qaeda has the most to gain. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
stevemcgarrett
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:48 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Bbum wrote:
| Quote: |
Well if she wasn't corrupt, her husband certainly was. Bhutto was far from a saint; I think that's what thepeel is trying to say.
It is too bad that only her and Nawaz Sharif were the only ones who could form significant political opposition in Pakistan. The country needs more capable, less corrupt political leadership.
How is it India has been a stable democracy during most of its independence while Pakistan has been a mess for most of its existence? 'Tis a shame. |
Her husband was corrupt and she was stuck between a rock and hard place in that regard. She was principled but could not break the back of unprincipled rule in her country in the end. And I wouldn't be so quick to laud the Indians as they have enough problems of their own. 'Stability' is not a word I would associate with South and Southeast Asia. But, yes, there has been a tradition of civility although Gandhi himself was slain by a Hindu radical. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Two children are about to be born; one in Pakistan; one in India. Which child has the best chance of having a good future? I don't think anyone would predict a better future for the Pakistani baby. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Has anyone mentioned that "official" reports are now saying it was the sun roof window handle that "killed" her?
No bullets, no shrapnel.
Yes, that's right:
She is said to have ducked down back into the "security" vehicle & Al-Quaeda's window latch killed her.
Any guesses as to what the NEXT explanation might be  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Czarjorge wrote: |
| thepeel wrote: |
| VanIslander wrote: |
Someone said her last word was "Allah"  now there's a word I've never heard her say despite countless CNN interviews.
She was a modern, secular woman whose religious faith didn't seem to define her the way that it does many traditional fundamentalists. |
Look, that she was killed is terrible. But let us not start being dishonest about it. She was a very religious person and was actually friendly towards the taliban when they came to power. She wasn't a religious nutter to the extent that many muslim leaders are, but she was religious and religion informed her government. She was also very corrupt (and the Swiss convicted her for it). Look beyond CNN. |
Wow, even against immense evidence your hatred of Islam clouds your reason beyond... well, reason. I have no idea where you get your news, assuming you don't just 'pass' the nonsense you write, but it can't be any worse than CNN. Who do you think killed her? Why do you think she was killed?
Whatever complicity Musharraf, or more specifically parts of Musharraf's government/intelligence service, may have had, the Islamist wanted her dead. She was a woman in power, and has fought them since the early 90's when she rose to prominence. Both reasons were good enough for a number of Islamist death threats over the years, regardless of the Pakistani tradition of killing your political rivals.
In the end both Musharraf's government and Islamists were likely involved in her murder. Her faith surely played a role in her political identity, as it clearly does in every politician. I would have thought denigrating the recently deceased was below even you, clearly I was wrong. |
Sorry, where was I wrong?
1) She was charged and conviced of corruption.
2) She was friendly to the Taliban
3) She was an obedient muslim.
? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
safee1980
Joined: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Daejeon, South Korea
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:16 pm Post subject: |
|
|
1. She was convicted of corruption. Yes!
2. She supported Taliban. Yes, but so did the USA.
3. She was an obedient muslim. No, incase you study Islam, you will find out why she was not an obedient muslim, but just an ordinary one (like most of muslims today). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
1) ..
2) So what?
3) Care to explain the difference? Obedient means that she is not secular, which was what was said about her a few posts back. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 10:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| She wasn't a religious nutter to the extent that many muslim leaders are, but she was religious and religion informed her government. |
Please explain how you know the level of her religious committment. You could be right, but I'd like to know how you know. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
stevemcgarrett
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 6:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
the peel/keane/EFL Trainer:
One of the prime reasons she has been a target of Islamic fundamentalists since her return to Pakistan is precisely her secular outlook. This has been confirmed by any number of news organizations, the Pakistani People's Party staffers, and former government officials.
So go play with your tiddlywinks and leave the grownup talk to us. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
karma police
Joined: 01 Sep 2007
Location: all roads lead to where you are...
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
the peel/keane/EFL Trainer:
One of the prime reasons she has been a target of Islamic fundamentalists since her return to Pakistan is precisely her secular outlook. This has been confirmed by any number of news organizations, the Pakistani People's Party staffers, and former government officials.
So go play with your tiddlywinks and leave the grownup talk to us. |
and you have poorly paraphrased and shamelessly plagiarized them all -not to mention boring us all in the process- with your inflated, self-righteous, shoddy prose and unsupported, grandiose assumptions, mr. self-delusional legend in your own mind...
as if you know...anything about...what you recklessly...preach.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
VanIslander
Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 9:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| safee1980 wrote: |
| 3. She was an obedient muslim. No, incase you study Islam, you will find out why she was not an obedient muslim, but just an ordinary one (like most of muslims today). |
Yeah, she was as Muslim as John McCain is Christian. No need to doubt their faith but their political careers wasn't built on espousing the name of God (Allah/Jesus).
She was secular not atheist. Only a rabid fundamentalist refuses to accept there being a difference. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Vicissitude
Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Location: Chef School
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 10:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| igotthisguitar wrote: |
Has anyone mentioned that "official" reports are now saying it was the sun roof window handle that "killed" her?
No bullets, no shrapnel.
Yes, that's right:
She is said to have ducked down back into the "security" vehicle & Al-Quaeda's window latch killed her.
Any guesses as to what the NEXT explanation might be |
Yeah, how do you duck down AND get killed by a sun roof window handle? I'm calling bunk on that explanation.
Her husband was the one who refused to allow for more forensic evidence studies on her body. He wanted her buried right away. Why? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 11:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
| the peel/keane/EFL Trainer |
Interesting association, McGarrett. I hope you are wrong but it certainly reads plausible. If it is true, this is the most mentally-unstable and genuinely disturbed person I have encountered anywhere. I distinctly recall "BJWD" attacking BLT. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 11:10 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Vicissitude wrote: |
| igotthisguitar wrote: |
Has anyone mentioned that "official" reports are now saying it was the sun roof window handle that "killed" her?
No bullets, no shrapnel.
Yes, that's right:
She is said to have ducked down back into the "security" vehicle & Al-Quaeda's window latch killed her.
Any guesses as to what the NEXT explanation might be |
Yeah, how do you duck down AND get killed by a sun roof window handle?
I'm calling bunk on that explanation.
Her husband was the one who refused to allow for more forensic evidence studies on her body. He wanted her buried right away.
Why? |
i see somebody is paying attention 
Asking all the key "pressing" questions 
A Bhutto Successor?
Time.com - Sat Dec 29, 4:55 PM ET
Two days after Benazir Bhutto's assassination, TIME learns that the former prime minister's
19-year-old son is likely to take her place as head of the Pakistan People's Party 
MORE ...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/abhuttosuccessor;_ylt=As_YFzp2c6x3xuwRY3MPU1oDW7oF |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
|
| Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2007 12:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
Nonsense, Igotthisguitar.
| Quote: |
The Interior Ministry also said Bhutto had neither been shot nor hit by shrapnel, but had been killed when the force of the explosion smashed her head against a lever on the sunroof of her vehicle.
Authorities initially said she died from bullet wounds to the head and neck; a surgeon who treated her said she died from the impact of shrapnel on her skull.
Cheema said there would be two inquiries into Bhutto's death � one by a high court judge and another by security forces. The government said it doesn't need international help to handle the investigation.
"This is not an ordinary criminal matter in which we require assistance of the international community. I think we are capable of handling it," Cheema said.
Bhutto's Pakistan Peoples Party dismissed the government account that Mehsud was behind the killing, saying there was no hard evidence and President Pervez Musharraf's embattled administration was trying to divert attention from its failure to protect Bhutto.
It also denounced as "dangerous nonsense" the government's claim that she died when she hit her head on the sunroof.
Sherry Rehman, a spokeswoman for the PPP, said Bhutto had a large bullet wound that went through her head.
Cheema said the government's account was based on "nothing but the facts" and that Bhutto's party is free to exhume her body to check... |
Let the opposition exhume Bhutto's body and conduct their own autopsy. Until then, you have nothing to report but wild rumor and allegation. "Dangerous nonsense," indeed. The way people are spinning this reminds me of Castro's rejection -- from Havana -- that Salvador Allende had suicided on 11 Sept. 73 -- in Santiago. Did not allow for him to have died a leftist hero's death, you see. So CIA must have assassinated him. And that myth persists today, in spite of Allende's apparently talking about his suicide, his farewell address (which reads like a suicide note), the eye-witness accts, and the autopsy to the contrary.
In this case, Bhutto was assassinated -- just not necessarily in a way that might prove most useful for her supporters.
In any case, let the mythmaking begin, apparently.
NPR Reports |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
