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Mother Teresa: corrupt, ignorant and unhelpful?
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Billy Pilgrim

Joined: 08 Sep 2004

Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:12 pm Post subject:

My irony detector goes into overdrive every time itaewonguy posts in this thread.

itaewonguy

Joined: 25 Mar 2003

Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:15 pm Post subject:

Billy Pilgrim wrote:

My irony detector goes into overdrive every time itaewonguy posts in this thread.

wow arent you cool Rolling Eyes

! is that the best you could come with it!?!

thats it be a good cult follower and protect your fellow cult brothers!!

Billy Pilgrim

Joined: 08 Sep 2004

Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:23 pm Post subject:

itaewonguy wrote:

Billy Pilgrim wrote:

My irony detector goes into overdrive every time itaewonguy posts in this thread.

wow arent you cool Rolling Eyes

! is that the best you could come with it!?!

thats it be a good cult follower and protect your fellow cult brothers!!

Dude, it's very simply because every single thing you accuse mindmetoo of doing, you do yourself 100 times over. And so, if what he is doing is bad, what does that say about you. It simply boggles the mind that you could spin this out over 20+ pages, accusing others of the exact same things you do yourself. It's pretty sad, actually.

Justin Hale

Joined: 24 Nov 2007
Location: the Straight Talk Express

Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 9:24 pm Post subject:

itaewonguy wrote:

ILl say this one more time for the dummies ok!!

NO ONE HAS 100 % evidence that there is not a GOD!!!!!!
can that reach your thick skull???

I have already debunked this. We have no evidence for something's - anything's - lack of existence is true but only trivially. There's no evidence whatsoever that invisible aliens don't inhabit the Moon. It would be infantile to believe that they do because of this fact.

Here again is my complete debunking:

Justin Hale wrote:

Chris_J2 wrote:

I'm still waiting on that irrefutable evidence link. Surely just one of those 156 footnotes, directly relates to such concrete evidence? Thought not. And repeating a statement ad nauseum, doesn't reinforce it's validity.

Chris, it is impossible to prove the nonexistence of God. All atheists anknowledge this and repeating the same challenge - prove God doesn't exist - is a waste of good typing energy for all.

It is often the case one cannot prove the nonexistence of something. I cannot prove that I don't have a twin brother who was snatched at birth and completely absent from all photos and records. I cannot prove there is not an invisible ghost in my room right now watching me. I cannot prove that there is not a small china teapot beyond our telescopic capacity orbiting the sun between Mars and Jupiter ('Russell's Teapot').

So, since I cannot prove I don't have a twin brother, I should, or can reasonably believe, I have one? Since I can't prove there is no ghost in my room, I should, or can reasonably believe, there is one? Since we cannot prove Russell's Teapot isn't orbiting the Sun, we should, or can reasonably believe, it is? It is simply a logical fallacy, I call it the 'Russell's Teapot' fallacy:

(1). Person A cannot prove that X doesn't exist
(2). Person B asserts any/all of the following given (1): (a) X must exist (b) A has no justification for lack of belief in X if he cannot prove it doesn't exist (c) B is justified in believing X because it cannot be shown to not exist.

Read that parallel universes thread. That's some far-out stuff. I however completely reject the possibility of Justin2, inhabiting Earth2, elsewhere. Can I prove Justin2 doesn't exist? No freakin chance in a multiverse of infinite possibility, therefore Justin2 exists? Or since I cannot prove he doesn't, I should believe he does? Justin2 might exist - I doubt it, but cannot know - but, if he does exist, one's lack of ability to prove his nonexistence is not the basis for "Justin2 exists" being true. Compelling evidence for Justin2�s existence is the basis for �Justin2 exists� being true � not a dearth of evidence that he doesn�t.

Two things become clear: (1) �X exists� is true due to compelling evidence for the existence of X (�X exists� is NOT true by virtue of a dearth of evidence of X�s nonexistence); (2) Not being able to demonstrate the lack of a ghost in my room is not a valid reason for belief in said ghost. I could believe in it if I wanted, but it�s shiity reasoning to do so solely because I cannot prove its nonexistence. I hope this is clear now because it�s an extremely tiresome fallacy.

Chris_J2 wrote:

I'll restate my position yet again.

There is insufficient evidence, one way or the other, to prove or disprove the existence (or otherwise) of a God.

Clear enough?

Since it is the theists who believe in an entity, they must demonstrate what convinced them of the position. Well, they don�t have to, but it�d be nice. The atheists can freely say why they don�t believe but are under no obligation to provide proof of the veracity of the belief because one cannot prove a negative. Arguments for theism take the following form:

1. The universe exists
2. Therefore God exists

Theists accept 2 follows from 1. Atheists are unhappy to accept that 2 follows from 1 and require more in order to become theists. Absolute skeptics don't even accept that 1 can follow from sense data, so be thankful you're not dealing with someone as unreasonable as that! Laughing

Itaewonguy wrote:

word of advice though. when you start to gather research for your book!
emmmm you might need more evidence that quoting WIKIPEDIA!!

Evidence like this?

http://evolution-101.blogspot.com/2006/03/molecular-evidence-1-protein.html
http://evolution-101.blogspot.com/2006/04/molecular-evidence-2-dna-functional.html
http://evolution-101.blogspot.com/2006/04/molecular-evidence-3-transposons.html
http://evolution-101.blogspot.com/2006/04/molecular-evidence-4-redundant.html
http://evolution-101.blogspot.com/2006/04/molecular-evidence-5-endogenous.html

mindmetoo

Joined: 02 Feb 2004

Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2008 11:35 pm Post subject:

Italguy, the evidence has been offered. More than wiki pages. Further wiki pages are offered as a good starting point for your own research. They give a good understandable summary plus links to the actual peer reviewed research. You can sit there like a know it all blow hard making silly claims about the evidence not sticking. I'm calling your bluff. Examine the evidence offered and get back to me with your detailed criticism. Anything else you're just puffing around like someone who has, to all observers, clearly lost the fight but you're too dumb to know it yourself.

itaewonguy

Joined: 25 Mar 2003

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 1:51 am Post subject:

Billy Pilgrim wrote:

itaewonguy wrote:

Billy Pilgrim wrote:

My irony detector goes into overdrive every time itaewonguy posts in this thread.

wow arent you cool Rolling Eyes

! is that the best you could come with it!?!

thats it be a good cult follower and protect your fellow cult brothers!!

really??? where have I preached that I am certain !! my arguements have all been its possible!! still not enough evidence!
what mindme too is doing.. is he is a 7day eventist knocking at my door!
big difference!!
I have never once stated fact! becuase my argument has been from the first! their is not enough evidence to know 100% so everything is just theory!

itaewonguy

Joined: 25 Mar 2003

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 1:55 am Post subject:

mindmetoo wrote:

Italguy, the evidence has been offered. More than wiki pages. Further wiki pages are offered as a good starting point for your own research. They give a good understandable summary plus links to the actual peer reviewed research. You can sit there like a know it all blow hard making silly claims about the evidence not sticking. I'm calling your bluff. Examine the evidence offered and get back to me with your detailed criticism.

Anything else you're just puffing around like someone who has, to all observers, clearly lost the fight but you're too dumb to know it yourself.

lost the fight??? im still waiting for your evidence that their is no god!!!
im still waiting for to prove to me that we are not all living under gods plan! take your time buddy , when you have solid evidence that their is no god! and you can be sure of that! bring it!! ill be right here..

itaewonguy

Joined: 25 Mar 2003

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:22 am Post subject:

Justin Hale wrote:

really??
then I can just present this! from a different scientist who debunks that!
but the question is, would you guys be willing to read it or even want to accept it!? atheists!??? NOWAY!!

http://www.trueorigin.org/ca_ac_01.asp

Quote:

Circumstantial evidence is a very tricky thing,� thoughtfully; �it may seem to point very straight to one thing, but if you shift your point of view a little, you may find it pointing in an equally uncompromising manner to something entirely different� . . . �There is nothing more deceptive than an obvious fact.�

as I have been saying all along! the evidence is not substancial enough to take only one view 100%! thats why you guys are idiots! and im sitting on the fence! so when it comes time we have the evidence I wont be left looking like an idiot! you guys will be there scratching your head!!
feeling like a bunch of real utter twits!!

all your theories and beliefs are resting in scientists who write papers!
your theories and belief are same as christians or anyone else!
you believe what you choose to believe with the words you choose to accept!
AMEN!?!?
NO GOD!!
VAI HITLER!
DAE HAN MING KUK!
USA!!! USA !!!

CANADA RULES!!!

OCN! koreans number one movie channel !!.. is it??
if you want to believe it!! so be it..

again one more time.. hope it sticks this time..
NOT ENOUGH EVIDENCE TO CHOOSE ONE SIDE BY FACT!!!
choose by faith? YES!! 100% solid fact! NO!!!

its seems to every theory their is someone out there ready to debunk it
so believe the side which you want to I guess..
you have a closed mind! I have an open mind..

http://www.trueorigin.org/
look through the main page .. everything you guys preach is debunked!
it all comes down to how you choose to see it ...

EVIDENCE IS INSUFFICENT AT THIS TIME!!
which is not suprising becuase we have only been using computers and other advanced technology for the past 30 years! humans are not that good ok!
everyone likes to predict the ending of a movie! but come on!
we have answered all of lifes mysteries in the past 30 years with computers!??? give me a break...
human arrogance at its best again..
we will probably never really know, thats my view..

what caused the big bang?? can that actually be answered in fact?? NO!
hahhahaha you guys are like headless chickens..

Billy Pilgrim

Joined: 08 Sep 2004

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:44 am Post subject:

itaewonguy wrote:

Justin Hale wrote:

Quote:

This is literally the most poorly articulated argument I think I have ever seen anywhere, from anyone, about anything.

The last line is a classic.

Yes, I have descended into denigrating your style. But please take into account that you have no content for me to chew on.

Last edited by Billy Pilgrim on Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:45 am; edited 1 time in total

seoulunitarian

Joined: 06 Jul 2004

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:44 am Post subject: re:

itaewonguy wrote:

Justin Hale wrote:

Quote:

I thought I was finished with this conversation, but I would like some answers from itaewonguy:

(1) Do you understand the scientific process of coming to a provisional conclusion based on probablities?

(2) Do you realize the article you posted (i.e. Camp vs. Theobald) is a "debate" between a man trained in theology and law (Camp) and a man trained in biochemistry (Theobald)? See http://www.creationdigest.com/archives/Archive_2003_Winter/Ashby_Camp_Interview.htm and http://www.bio.brandeis.edu/faculty/theobald.html.

Peace

mindmetoo

Joined: 02 Feb 2004

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 2:46 am Post subject:

itaewonguy wrote:

Justin Hale wrote:

Where is the debunking in that url?

Here this debunks your url:

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comdesc/

Anyone can play that game.

You'll notice I

a) gave you a summary of the evidence
b) put it in an analogy
c) then provided links for expanded reading

So what do you find compelling in that url you barfed up? Before you simply wave your hands and say "all of it!" what are the top 3 claims in that url that you find compelling or problematic for the molecular evidence I presented?

itaewonguy

Joined: 25 Mar 2003

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 3:14 am Post subject:

mindmetoo wrote:

itaewonguy wrote:

Justin Hale wrote:

you read it!!!
then ask me the question...
or perhaps you are just to lazy becuase you have already made up your mind!!!

itaewonguy

Joined: 25 Mar 2003

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 3:23 am Post subject: Re: re:

seoulunitarian wrote:

why would you be finished with this conversation?? have you made up your mind that their is no god??? good for you..
1: Do I understand... sure!! but im not going to say its 100% fact!! do you understand the difference there..?
2: so what are you saying! I should support the atheist because he doesnt support christianity so that must mean his arguement is right??
camp was an athiest! he believe in the evolution theory!
but he changed his view..
if you read the link.. you will see how theobald is wrong!! he has been proven wrong.. its a great argument and it could stick.. thats what I am saying.. all we have are two guys... you all want to believe a guy from colorado has the keys to it all.. go for it.. but that doesnt mean half the world has to believe this guy trying to make a name for himself..
and when he gets questioned he starts calling names..
he has been debunked! read the story!! makes sense to me.. you can look at it from the other stand point..
so .. as I said.. the JURY IS OUT!!!
all we have at present 2008 are arguments and theories..

problem is all you guys just dont want to admit that I AM RIGHT!!
there is not enough evidence to point in only one direction..

jesus!! just go to AMAZON.COM and look at the thousands of books on evolution VS christianity, science, faith, biochemistry.. you name it..
and after you have read all those books! and you reach 100 years old..
what do you have?? probability!!!!
not fact!! so please stop preaching to me that you guys are so right..
every evolution book, every evolution website, every evolution Radio program, TV doco, movie etc... uses various forms of intellectual snobbery to try to prove its point and put people down. Frankly, I find this offensive and closed-minded. but hey if that makes you feel better so be.

you guys dont have all the facts.. so please give it up.. its starting to look rather desperate and pathetic.. just admit it.. you dont have all the facts!!
and then change your writing styles to "its possible........."!!
could have happend.. we believe that ... maybe.. might have...
NOT WE ARE SURE!!

I believe in evolution!!

with intelligent design
I dont need to prove it becuase it cant be proved 100%
just like you cant disprove it 100%...
I choose to believe it..
as richard gere chooses to be a buddhist and tom cruise chooses to believe aliens..

are you guys starting to catch on yet...
no one can disprove SQUAT yet.. so until then we only have THEORIES!!

Last edited by itaewonguy on Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:10 am; edited 2 times in total

laogaiguk

Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 3:31 am Post subject:

This is crazy.

itaewonguy

Joined: 25 Mar 2003

Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 3:41 am Post subject:

laogaiguk wrote:

This is crazy.

I agree..
but when you are dealing with extremist cults you have to be extreme!

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