Korean Job Discussion Forums

wannago · Joined: 16 Apr 2004

I would say that plumbers and lawyers have a lot in common, although plumbers are infinitely more valuable. One profession deals with getting rid of sh*t and the other deals in spewing it and spreading it around.

Its about time the most worthy of professions starts being paid like the most unworthy.

Kuros · Joined: 27 Apr 2004

[quote="thepeel"]

thepeel · Joined: 08 Aug 2004

This is a pet topic of mine. My opinion is that there are farrr to many people in liberal arts undergrad programs that are learning essentially nothing, and graduating with tens of thousands of dollars in debt with no skills. The esl industry is a symptom of this.

But as Joseph Alois Schumpeter points out, the university does something else as well. It establishes white-collar values and expectations in people who have no hope of becoming white-collar. They shun blue collar work as they feel above it. Who is going to study sociology and then move on to plumbing? In this case, the arrogance of being a uni grad stunts your vocational advancement. There is nothing at all wrong with being a plumber or welder. These are middle class jobs.

I remember so many people after graduation saying in disbelief "but I have a degree" when being totally unable to find middle class income. The degree is meaningless unless it is directed towards a vocation (engineering, medicine and others).

Ya-ta Boy · Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: Established in 1994

Kuros · Joined: 27 Apr 2004

contrarian · Joined: 20 Jan 2007 Location: Nearly in NK

thepeel is on to something with his comments.

People that actually do something are valuable. Those who sit and pontificate are rather useless.

thepeel · Joined: 08 Aug 2004

The only thing a liberal arts degree qualifies you for is a masters in the liberal arts, which qualifies you to get a PhD. Now, some people are solid students and very much benefit from this, and the society benefits from them. But when the liberal arts degree is seen as a necessary condition for admission to 'thoughtful' society I think we have a problem.

Most young men who go to Uni, unless going to be doctors or such, would be much more better served getting a trade.

About law. I considered it. The opportunity cost is massive, though.

I was accepted to attend a solid private school in the South. Tuition 34k/yr for 3 years. Forgone income of 50+/- for 3 years. Living expenses of 30k/yr (after the income from summer jobs) for 3 years. Plus the cost of servicing debt. 342,000$ before interest. Now, from the school I was going to attend, the top 10-15% got the "big law" jobs that start at 200k. The the next top 10-15% went to "mid-law" and earn 100-120k$. The rest start at between 30k (to work with a state judge) to 40k (as a entry level government lawyer). If you can't be sure that you will be top 30%, you should not attend. Full stop. If you can't get into a regional top 10 school, you should not attend, full stop. The opportunity cost is huge for the chance at a good job.

I just couldn't justify the expense and picked another path. There are too many law schools and way too many lawyers.

thepeel · Joined: 08 Aug 2004

blaseblasphemener · Posted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:29 pm Post subject:

liberal arts degrees are good for getting sales rep jobs back in Canada. That's what most guys with them.

Starting pay: $40-45,000

thepeel · Joined: 08 Aug 2004

Sales rep? I don't know anybody who did that. Selling what?

Neil · Joined: 02 Jan 2004 Location: Tokyo

Plumbers in London aren't earning as much as they were a few years ago, EU expansion means a lot of Polish and Czech plumbers come over and work cheaper (also doing a more efficent job).

Justin Hale · Joined: 24 Nov 2007 Location: the Straight Talk Express

Liberal Arts degrees = teaching. That's what I did and although I never imagined I'd end up a teacher, am reasonably glad I am. The main reason is that I can work abroad almost at will (Teachanywhere.com). Were it not for the fact that I save per month what an average Korean family of 3 earns, I wouldn't remain in this primitive dump.

My theory as to the dwindling numbers of plumbers, plasterers, etc is that it is the same reason we have a dwindling number of mothers. Nobody wants to do hard work. We need more guys to go to work and scrub dirt out of their knuckles at the end of a 10 hour hard day and more girls to get pregnant and breed.

I studied Law at college and quit because it was excruciatingly boring. I enjoy law at the everyday, lay level and know a bit about it, but at degree level it's painful.

riverboy · Joined: 03 Jun 2003 Location: Incheon

There is s flipside to the coin here folks. I have my third block as a carpenter and all my hours as acook. I also ran seismic crews and worked on the oil rigs in Alberta.

I made great money and I heve buddies making a thousand dollars a day without highschool diplomas. I only went to university to learn, I never fit in with the intellectual snobbery and preferred the labour scene. But a car accident which left me unable to work in trades resulted in my coming to Korea and working ESl.

When I graduated highschool, there was not one guidance counsellor in the country who recommended trades. Everyone went into computers and we had a serious shortage of tradesmen in Canada.

Personally I thik it is about diversity. Give a guy an arts degree and a trade and he is still more valuable than a guy with just a trade.

wannago · Joined: 16 Apr 2004