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Less than .5% of US Adults are HIV Positive
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mindmetoo

Joined: 02 Feb 2004

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:23 am Post subject:

cunning_stunt wrote:

You people need to do some research about hiv and stop letting yourselves be scaremongered by pharmaceutical companies

It would seem condoms are the suggested method of prevention. I'm not sure how pharmaceutical companies profit from this. Do they make large profits from such sales? Or is this an industry separate from the drug makers?

Papa Smurf

Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Seoul

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:59 am Post subject:

mindmetoo wrote:

cunning_stunt wrote:

You people need to do some research about hiv and stop letting yourselves be scaremongered by pharmaceutical companies

pwned

reactionary

Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Location: korreia

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:57 pm Post subject:

well, it IS scaremongering, but probably not from pharmaceutical companies - after all, wouldn't they want to encourage people to get HIV and take their drugs? However, it wouldn't surprise me if it was the religious right (First: "Look! God hates homosexuals!" Then: "Look! No casual sex, EVAR! The HIV might even be small enough to go through condoms!") here's another tidbit about HIV a lot of people never read about: http://www.techmuseum.org/exhibits/online/ugenetics/news.php?id=13 Estimated that 1% of Caucasians are IMMUNE to HIV and 20% (this number is higher than I'd read previously) are "resistant" thanks to either 2 or 1 mutations on a gene. Why is this not widely publicized? Maybe it would cause some retards to gamble on their 1:100 odds and shoot up tons of heroin. but the point is, most of us are not fully educated on this virus.

mindmetoo

Joined: 02 Feb 2004

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:31 pm Post subject:

reactionary wrote:

Why is this not widely publicized? Maybe it would cause some retards to gamble on their 1:100 odds and shoot up tons of heroin. but the point is, most of us are not fully educated on this virus.

There's a phenomenon called "off setting behavior". Every advance that makes something safer always has off setting behavior. For example, anti lock brakes were first seen by insurance companies as a sure fire way to reduce accidents and initially offered discounts to drivers with ABS cars. Drivers, however, assumed since they were better protected, they took more risks. The accident rates didn't drop as predicted.

I think they're finding more and more people are thinking AIDS is as good as cured and are taking more risks than they used to when they assumed it was a death sentence.

browneyedgirl

Joined: 17 Jul 2007

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:13 pm Post subject: Re: Less than .5% of US Adults are HIV Positive

Brady wrote:

According to a new CDC study.

This should fairly soundly debunk the "foreigners with AIDS" myth, at least among us Yanks. Keep this one in your arsenal.

Unless you're from the Washinton, D.C., area. The AIDS/HIV rate there is crazy.

Almost 12,500 people in the District were known to have HIV or AIDS in 2006, according to the report. Figures suggest that the number of new HIV cases began declining in 2003, but the administration said the drop more likely reflects underreporting or delayed reporting. A quarter-century into the epidemic, the city's cumulative number of AIDS cases exceeds 17,400

And those are just the people that are have been tested.

cunning_stunt

Joined: 16 Dec 2007

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:45 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Do you think i'm suggesting that people shouldn't use condoms ? Where did you get that silly idea ? There would be and are plenty of good reasons to use condoms even if AIDs didn't exist .

As far as pharaceutical companies go , their agenda is to load off as many drugs as possible onto Africa especially . The fact that these drugs are callously given to people with poor diets and false positives without looking at the disease from a hollostic context results in more deaths than ever before .

If you don't care or know much about the issue , please don't hijack it with silly comments .

Quote:

Why is this not widely publicized? Maybe it would cause some retards to gamble on their 1:100 odds and shoot up tons of heroin. but the point is, most of us are not fully educated on this virus.

Yes of course . Same with the information about the 7000 exposures . Nobody wants people to underestimate the threat , but at the same time there are a lot of people who are living their lives pertrified ...even convinced that they have contracted the disease . In Africa they are too scared to take tests , the partake in binge drinking to curb their fears and start having more unprotected sex as a result . The stress with poir diet takes a massive toll on their immune systems and diseases like TB take route and kills thousands . This is a very real phenomena and with this in mind perhaps it would be better to give people all the information .

mindmetoo

Joined: 02 Feb 2004

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:39 pm Post subject:

cunning_stunt wrote:

Quote:

Your full quote:

Quote:

You people need to do some research about hiv and stop letting yourselves be scaremongered by pharmaceutical companies and the sensationalistic media . The fact of the matter is that it's just extremely hard to get the disease via heterosexual sex . In fact it's been shown that it would take on average 7000 exposures for a man and 3500 for a women to have any significant chance of getting it . Factored into this are risks of people having std's and the likes .

It would seem to me the media says "use condoms to protect yourself from AIDS." That is the whole of the message. You are arguing the chances of getting AIDS isn't as great as the media makes it seem so we should not buy into the scaremongering of the "pharmaceutical companies and the sensationalistic media". The scare mongering, it follows, is because they profit. Since the only solution contained within the scare mongering message is buy rubbers, I'm curious then what angle big pharm has in the "scare mongering" about the odds of NA hetros getting AIDS?

It also seems to me drug companies aren't much interested in selling anti-HIV drugs in Africa as they would rather sell them in rich and middle income nations. Where is evidence of the rich market you claim?

What do you define as a "holistic context" and how does this lead to more deaths?

Quote:

In Africa they are too scared to take tests , the partake in binge drinking to curb their fears and start having more unprotected sex as a result . The stress with poir diet takes a massive toll on their immune systems and diseases like TB take route and kills thousands .

Is this really a significant factor in the growth of AIDS in africa? They are afraid of AIDS, drink, stress their immune system, and get AIDS and other diseases? Got the medical literature on that one? Or are you just making that up?

cunning_stunt

Joined: 16 Dec 2007

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject:

Quote:

I don't know about the media where you come from...but where I come from almost every article you read is shouting the message into your ear that sleeping around WILL lead to aids .

Drug companies berate african governments for not providing free aids drugs to the populations , or officials are bribeb . I think you will find many african countries are providing free aids drugs to their populations , where the gross majority of cases lie . South Africa , Brazil and India are currently fighting patent laws to produce their own generics , but already huge money has been made . The numerous "charity" orginisations collecting money also have an agenda to use hyperbole when talking about aids in africa .

Quote:

What do you define as a "holistic context" and how does this lead to more deaths?

aaaaah.....this is the heart of the matter .

With or without the hiv virus in the equation people in africa would still die if you gave them these aids drugs . If you take a person with a poor diet , give him high stress by telling him he has a fatal disease and then give him highly toxic anti retrivirals.....he will actually die quicker . You need to deal with factors that are in place that already hinder the immune systems of the poor individuals .

When the minister of health in South Africa was bold enough to suggest that as part of the aids fighting regime people should eat more vegitables ...including beetroot and garlic (cheap and full of vitamins) ....the world media went ballistic , calling her a "witch doctor" etc....the idea was laughed off . Thanks to these dogmatic idiots many people won't be taking this fantastic advice and will die . In fact there has been more success dealing with aids in africa by simply giving people vitamins and placebos than giving them toxic aids drugs .

There is also a debate going on about how much that is labelled aids is actually aids in africa . When people die of TB and diseases they have always died from it's often sceptically seen as aids . The tests for aids notoriously prodice false positives in people will low immune systems/pregnant women etc ....and this alone spells a death penalty ...if you add stress to the equation of person with poor diet alone it will make them sick . Take this in context of how difficult it is to spread aids through sex....and one has to rethink what this disease that undoubtably killing people is.....

This makes us think : in africa is sexual abstinance and condom usuage going to stop this disease alone ? You could stop people having sex and I bet you anything they will still be dying at a massive rate from low immune systems .

Is there not an obvious third force which needs to be adressed ? (the poor maze based diet )? Does not the whole disease in africa need a serious rethink before we shove toxic drugs down peoples throats ?

Quote:

Plenty of big names in the arena have alluded to this factor . I suppose you just think aids in africa is more widespread because those darn africans cant keep their legs closed ?

Rolling Eyes

Why then is "aids" more widespread than any other std if it's notoriously hard to spread heterosexually ? Don't you think there might me more to the disease than purely the hiv retrovirus ?

brento1138

Joined: 17 Nov 2004

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:36 pm Post subject:

RACETRAITOR wrote:

I heard it can be spread by kissing. That was an elected official who had a medical doctorate who said that one. (I know, he was a retard).

Actually, it is possible for it to be spread by kissing. If both people have open wounds in their mouths, even minor (caused by flossing or brushing, or even hot foods) then it can happen.

Not probable, but not impossible.

inseoul

Joined: 16 Oct 2006

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:01 pm Post subject: real figures

.5% of US adults. Someone suggested 1 million. How many of them are gay? Makes me feel pretty safe as a hetro male. Ive been quoting that hypothesis for some time: the risk is very low for hetro males. In saying that, I did shoot in a girls asss last night. It started out as an accident, but turned out she liked it. So guess I'm a little more at risk today.

Julius

Joined: 27 Jul 2006

Posted: Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:15 pm Post subject: Re: Less than .5% of US Adults are HIV Positive

browneyedgirl wrote:

And those are just the people that are have been tested.

This is it... the most irresponsible ones don't get tested until they get sick.

I know one dude who reported sleeping with 32 prostitutes in Thailand, in a couple of cases without protection. He hasn't been tested, and doesn't really want to(his words) His g/f of course doesn't know about it.

And from what I've heard from dudes who bang hookers here and in thai...they generally don't get tested if they can avoid it.

So its a case of official figures obviously relating only to those who get tested. What % of vulnerable people is that?

ryouga013

Joined: 14 Sep 2007

Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 3:19 am Post subject:

reactionary wrote:

Estimated that 1% of Caucasians are IMMUNE to HIV and 20% (this number is higher than I'd read previously) are "resistant" thanks to either 2 or 1 mutations on a gene.

I had heard different numbers on this. In a different study, it wasn't simply Caucasian, but rather from native country and it had showed that Ukrainians had the highest immunity, as high as 21% with Russians following. I have tried to find the study again, but to no avail.

mindmetoo

Joined: 02 Feb 2004

Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 4:26 am Post subject:

cunning_stunt wrote:

I don't know about the media where you come from...but where I come from almost every article you read is shouting the message into your ear that sleeping around WILL lead to aids.

Having multiple partners without using protection can increase your chances of getting aids. That's the message I keep reading.

Quote:

Drug companies berate african governments for not providing free aids drugs to the populations , or officials are bribeb .

Drug companies are doing this? Do you have a source to back up that claim?

Quote:

With or without the hiv virus in the equation people in africa would still die if you gave them these aids drugs.

Ummm. You do realize AIDS drugs are only for people with HIV? They don't do anything else but interfere with the viruses ability to reproduce. I'm not sure why you would give people without AIDS these drugs.

Quote:

If you take a person with a poor diet , give him high stress by telling him he has a fatal disease and then give him highly toxic anti retrivirals.....he will actually die quicker

Got the medical literature to support that? I'm still not clear on who is prescribing such drugs to people who don't test HIV+.

Quote:

You need to deal with factors that are in place that already hinder the immune systems of the poor individuals .

Which are?

Quote:

When the minister of health in South Africa was bold enough to suggest that as part of the aids fighting regime people should eat more vegitables ...including beetroot and garlic (cheap and full of vitamins) ....the world media went ballistic , calling her a "witch doctor" etc....the idea was laughed off .

I don't think he was merely saying people should have a healthier diet. I think he was claiming one didn't need drugs, one could treat or cure AIDS with beetroot.

Quote:

In fact there has been more success dealing with aids in africa by simply giving people vitamins and placebos than giving them toxic aids drugs .

Got any medical literature to support that?

Quote:

There is also a debate going on about how much that is labelled aids is actually aids in africa .

It seems to me if you test positive for HIV and you die of a disease related to HIV, then you got a pretty good idea the person died of AIDS.

Quote:

The tests for aids notoriously prodice false positives in people will low immune systems/pregnant women etc ...

.

This site about pregnancy and HIV testing makes no mention about the increased chances of a false positive:

http://sogc.org/health/pregnancy-hiv_e.asp

Can you support that statement literature?

Quote:

Is there not an obvious third force which needs to be adressed ? (the poor maze based diet )? Does not the whole disease in africa need a serious rethink before we shove toxic drugs down peoples throats ?

Well, it seems to me the best evidence based medicine says no. People who test positive for HIV should be put on anti viral meds asap.

Quote:

I suppose you just think aids in africa is more widespread because those darn africans cant keep their legs closed ?

I think it's because of widespread unprotected sex.

Quote:

Why then is "aids" more widespread than any other std if it's notoriously hard to spread heterosexually ? Don't you think there might me more to the disease than purely the hiv retrovirus?

Where are you getting your stats that HIV is more widespread in Africa than any other STD?

cunning_stunt

Joined: 16 Dec 2007

Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 4:56 am Post subject:

Quote:

This is very revealing . You obviously have no idea about false positives or how hiv testing works and the flaws .

Quote:

There are many diseases that people can die from , due to their low immune systems . This outcome does not require the hiv retrovirus .

Quote:

Well, it seems to me the best evidence based medicine says no. People who test positive for HIV should be put on anti viral meds asap.

Do you have any literature to back up that opinion ? That people with poor diet should be put on anti retrovirals ? Rolling Eyes

Do you know how toxic these drugs are ? Don't be lazy...you seem interested in the issue . You have questions in this regard then go and do the research , instead of asking me to keep doing it for you .

Quote:

I think it's because of widespread unprotected sex.

Do you realise how tiny the odds of contracting hiv through heterosexual sex are ? There is no way this can account for the masses of deaths each year . If aids is only related to hiv , then it's the most prevelent std . Even though it's the hardest to spread . Can you explain that ?

Cry as much as you like..I've spent 4 years reading about this phenomenon . I'm not going to spend my time digging out the necessary data to appease you . Sorry , I'm far too lazy . If you are interested be a big boy and go do some research and come to your own conclusions .

Otherside

Joined: 06 Sep 2007

Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:02 am Post subject:

cunning_stunt wrote:

I really have to dispute this 7000/3500 number. As a male, this would dicate I would be able "on average" to have unprotected sex with an aids infected person EVERYDAY for 20 years, before I had a "significant" chance of getting AIDS. And that's assuming each and EVERYONE has AIDS.

Let's get real.

Perhaps those figures mean (and I apologise if I misread), that one would need 7000 unprotected exposures....and this takes into account the fact only 0.5% of the population has AIDS, i.e. 1/35 chance vs 1/7000 chance. Obviously then, this figure would be at best a rough a guide - depending on the demographic of your partner.

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