Korean Job Discussion Forums

dimitri31 · Joined: 24 Oct 2006

Today, I prepared a lesson that I wanted to be fun and interesting for my 3-4 o'clock class of 3 male students, aged 9, 10, and 11. I had everything planned out, but not being unusual, everything didn't work out as planned.

We played BINGO. One student won 3 times, another 1 time, and the third, didn't win any of the 4 games we played. I wrote the names of the students on the board and put the number of games they won next to their names. The student who didn't win any games seemed to be upset and marked through everyone's name on the board. I immediately recognized that he saw it as a competition. Fine. Understandably, from this point of view I can see why he would be upset. However, he grabbed the student who had won 3 times by the shirt and was threatening to punch him. I could see the fear in the eyes of the student being threatened, and I had to intervene.

Being that I felt my authority in the classroom was not being respected, I had a male Korean teacher come in to intervene. The two students involved were yelled at and disciplined (disciplined the typical Korean way, with students made to stand up with their arms in the air).

I'm tired of having to deal with my Korean students and their occasional lack of respect for me. Sure, I do have authority and respect in the classroom the majority of the time, but it's not the same as the respect Korean teachers have in the classroom.

I really think it is the language and cultural difference that keeps the foreign teachers from getting the same respect the Korean teachers get.

Chris Kwon · Joined: 23 Jan 2008 Location: North Korea

He probably would've lost the fight too

RACETRAITOR · Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Location: Seoul, South Korea

Man, four games, three players, and not winning once? I'd be pissed too.

schwa · Joined: 18 Jan 2003 Location: Yap

Respect isnt automatically accorded -- its earned. Same goes for K-teachers but they tend to be better attuned to student expectations.

Hint: think beyond bingo. Its already a language class cliche in elementary schools & too often the staple of inexperienced hagwon teachers.

You kept score on the board yet seem surprised the students viewed it as a competition?

You need to make allowances for the different ages of your students. Thats an awkward class set-up you have. Koreans are hugely sensitive to age-based pecking order (even at those ages). In a class like that I'd avoid activities that entail winners & losers.

Better to establish a separate relationship with each student & dole out praise as its merited. Without comparisons.

Its almost always a mistake to bring in outsiders to establish order -- thats your job. To do so is about the most effective way to undermine your own authority.

It takes time to learn how to win students but ultimately your most potent weapon is teacher kindness.

Best luck.

Yu_Bum_suk · Joined: 25 Dec 2004

It depends. Some KTs get a lot more respect than others. So do some FTs. Next time why don't you try disciplining them yourself? If you don't, the kids will think you have no authority beyond complaining to Mr Kim.

yingwenlaoshi · Joined: 12 Feb 2007 Location: ... location, location!

Well first of all, stop playing bingo.

dimitri31 · Joined: 24 Oct 2006

i'm quite satisfied with the turn out of the situation. Besides, every teacher's situation, classroom dynamic, and students' personalities/behaviors are different.

i did learn something though....and that is to not make a game one of winners and losers. Learning mistake on my part...

cunning_stunt · Joined: 16 Dec 2007

Kimchieluver · Joined: 02 Mar 2005

ryouga013 · Joined: 14 Sep 2007

umm... most kids don't have that much respect for teachers... throw yourself in Korea, how many Koreans have respect for foreigners? just using odds, you have reduced the chances of respect by quite a bit. Kids just don't get it sometimes and it doesn't matter what discipline you take with them. So don't think about taking it too harshly or anything because it will work the same for you working your butt off for a day as if you did nothing for a day sometimes.

Just keep in mind what type of respect you wish to have (fear, obedience, or kinship)

Thunndarr · Joined: 30 Sep 2003

Here's a neat trick I've found. Kids don't care so much if they don't win as long as they don't come in last place.

And how do you make this miracle come about? Well, when you're assigning teams, make sure that there is always a "Teacher Team."

And obviously, Teacher Team always comes in last place. Works like a charm.

mistermasan · Joined: 20 Sep 2007 Location: 10+ yrs on Dave's ESL cafe

if you must play bingo...

don't have just one winner per go. have the first winner at the first bingo. keep tokens on cards. keep playing. have another winner on 3 bingos and five bingos and first to cover entire card.

i have had to play picture bingo a couple of times because the previous teacher played it alot. i wouldn't say the name of the object but rather describe it. the previous teacvher also had them play "hully gully". can't figure out how she milked any english outta that.

cunning_stunt · Joined: 16 Dec 2007

Ok . I've taught in more places than Korea . If you think Korean kids are disrespectful I'm pretty sure the problem is you , or their previous western teachers were a joke . The kids here are fantastically well behaved .

When you are trying alter behaviour my suggestion is positive reinforcement rather than punishing and shouting at them . Make everything a game or a contest . Make up charts and reward them through the year . Find any reason to reward the worst kids and you will win them over and into the system . It really works and especially with Korean kids who are hyper competitive .

Cerriowen · Joined: 03 Jun 2006 Location: Pocheon

Ways... that I've found to break up the whole "winner/loser" is...

First of all I remind them that there isn't any point in winning or losing, it's just a fun game to play, and if they get too competative, we will stop and go back to doing the books. It's just a nice break.

(1) Team games... In an uneven, small class... teacher joins one team, so I can control how well, we do (somewhat). Keeping them from losing toooo far behind the other team.

(2) part way through a sport-type game, I'll stop and switch the teams up. This confuses the score.

(3) choose multiple games that will play to different persons strong suit (speaking game, listening game, drawing game, music game, throwing game... etc) That way they're likely to at least place above someone else in one section.

Examples...

I taught a class with only games two days ago. One boy is a little bit shy and doesn't like talking... but I know he's crafty... so we had a "paper-aeroplane" competition... make an aeroplane, stand in a line, see whose goes furthest.

Another girl is also shy and much lower level, but she can draw... so we played pictionary.

I'd suggest never taking discipline outside of your classroom unless absolutely necissary. Make them stand there with their hands up yourself. You're the teacher. If you're just the talking monkey, then the person outside is the real power.

anyangoldboy · Joined: 28 Sep 2007

[quote="cunning_stunt"]Ok . I've taught in more places than Korea . If you think Korean kids are disrespectful I'm pretty sure the problem is you , or their previous western teachers were a joke . The kids here are fantastically well behaved .

When you are trying alter behaviour my suggestion is positive reinforcement rather than punishing and shouting at them . Make everything a game or a contest . Make up charts and reward them through the year . Find any reason to reward the worst kids and you will win them over and into the system . It really works and especially with Korean kids who are hyper competitive .[/quote]

Umm you obviously haven't taught in the rich areas in Korea then...Or well at least not my area...The kids are so fucking spoilt...