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diver
Joined: 16 Jun 2003
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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When my students bring up Ohno, I tell them to do an internet search on:
'Roy Jones Jr Boxing Seoul Olympics 1988'
Try it with your students |
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komtengi

Joined: 30 Sep 2003 Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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I find it ironic that they don't care that when Ohno won that the Korean skate desecrated the Korean flag bt spiking it into the ice. In most other countries that skater would cop a beating.
Its also ironic that the referee from the Italy/Korea World Cup match has admitted to taking bribes in the past, and from the look of some of the calls in that game he wasn't far off it again. |
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Holyjoe

Joined: 03 Mar 2003 Location: Away for a cuppa
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 9:17 pm Post subject: Re: The most hated athlete in South Korea |
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Gladiator wrote: |
An Chong Hwan didn't exactly help diffuse the issue when he made that provocative "skating" gesture following his equaliser against the US in the WC group match did he? FIFA normally cracks down on nonsense like that and discplines players who inflame crowds (as Gascoine/Fowler et al found out) but in this case maybe Korea's joint host status perhaps prevented it.
The fact is it was anything but good natured banter.
When the society's role models behave like morons....reach your own conclusions |
Perhaps FIFA didn't realise the significance. They tend to discipline folk who gesture directly at the crowds, or do anything blatantly provocative. But it's not so different from some of the other daft goal celebrations you see (Bebeto's "rocking baby" routine, Gazza's "dentist chair" etc) |
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butterface

Joined: 23 May 2003 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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Diver brings up an excellent point about Roy Jones Jr. What follows is a quote from a BBC biography of the American fighter who lost a gold medal to a Korean fighter in what should have been a unanimous victory. Belive me, anyone who remembers that fight know that Roy Jones inflicted a severe and decisive beating against his opponent, but - inexplicably- lost the fight and the gold medal to a South Korean in Seoul:
"he lost a highly disputed decision in the final fight. Jones Jr. lost to a South Korean fighter, and a subsequent investigation led some of the judges to admit that they had accepted bribes from Korean officials to vote against Jones Jr. Jones Jr. never accepted the silver medal, and his case, along with Carbajal's case, led Olympic organizers to establish a new scoring system for Olympic boxing, a system that later began to be used on all amateur fights. "
Last I remember, I don't recall any of the judges in the 2002 Winter Games admitting to accepting bribes. I saw the replay and two things were obvious: Ohno legitimately was fouled and Kim Dong Sung's behavior following his disqualification was more befitting of a bedwetting schoolyard athlete than an olympic medalist. Korea's unflinching allegiance to his graceless protest is another example of the simplistic group-think mentality that infects the minds of Koreans, or at least the vast majority of them. |
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Joe Thanks

Joined: 01 Oct 2003 Location: Dudleyville
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Posted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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komtengi wrote: |
Its also ironic that the referee from the Italy/Korea World Cup match has admitted to taking bribes in the past, and from the look of some of the calls in that game he wasn't far off it again. |
In Taiwan at the time, that was the big joke amongst my adult sudents - not just the Italian ref but Koreans and cheating.
Word spreads through other expats' experiences in SK too - I learned.
Cheers,
Joe |
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Ody

Joined: 27 Jan 2003 Location: over here
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:07 am Post subject: |
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diver wrote: |
When my students bring up Ohno, I tell them to do an internet search on:
'Roy Jones Jr Boxing Seoul Olympics 1988'
Try it with your students |
brilliant!
' will keep that in mind.
~ |
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Joe Thanks

Joined: 01 Oct 2003 Location: Dudleyville
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:49 am Post subject: |
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Some interesting thoughts on the subject:
http://jeffinkorea.blog-city.com/read/356957.htm
and
http://incestuousamplification.blog-city.com/
You need to scroll down towards the middle where the musing begins with:
Quote: |
Jeff mentions the Leonardo Dicaprio episode, and I remember that one particularly well. I was teaching at the time, and we had a discussion about film. I was asking students to tell me their favorite and least favorite actor/actress. Several students mentioned Leo as their least favorite without explanation, and finally after about the 8th one had piled on, I asked why so many of them disliked Dicaprio. One girl pipes up and says that Leo said in an interview that Koreans are disgusting and dirty, and that he loves Japan because it's so clean and the people are more friendly than Koreans. |
Jingoism is evil. Nothing good came from people worshiping flags or nationalism. It's imply regionalism placed into the grand scale; lots of euphamistic p e n i s waving.
It's time for all jingoists and so-called "patriots" to line up for a hearty cold co cking (you know the kind where the back of your head smarts for half an hour after the smackdown was laid on).
My opinion is not exclusive to Korea either, but if you have to start somewhere you do it where it's easily managed - and then work your way up to the big boys (America, China, etc.)
I hope Ohno comes and wipes the floor with the competion - AND - that the world gets to see the ugly cancer that poisons Korea. Sadly, I think the spin put on it will be "The world is against Korea" instead of "Enough of us have f'd up and the world has called us on it."
If Korea dropped its jingoism it'd be a great place. IT is, I think, the biggest hurdle in its development.
Joe |
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mithridates

Joined: 03 Mar 2003 Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 9:15 am Post subject: |
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That's all true, though I can see where their paranoia comes from. Historically Korea's been backstabbed more than once whenever they've let their guard down. I think it was some three days before North Korea invaded that S. Korea decided to give their soldiers leave to go back to their homes to visit; as soon as they did that North Korea poured in.
Hmm, but North Korea is Korea too, now that I think about it.
Nevertheless, being right in the centre of China (largest population in the world + huge military) and Japan (2nd largest economy in the world and former empire) with US soldiers inside and a million North Korean soldiers on the other with the world watching their every move makes them a bit nervous and edgy when it comes to the outside world watching them. This doesn't justify it, but I think it explains it to a certain extent. I think a unified North and South with some firm military and economic treaties with the countries around them would help them relax a bit.
That's not likely though. |
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Joe Thanks

Joined: 01 Oct 2003 Location: Dudleyville
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: |
mithridates"]
Hmm, but North Korea is Korea too, now that I think about it. |
As with all things Korean - if it's done by locals it will be forgiven:
Case in point - Kim dae-han ruthlessly slaughters over 140-150 people in Daegu almsot a year ago. How many locals are screaming at the govenment?
An American Skater with Japanese in his blood FAIRLY beats the poor-sport Korean skater back in 2001 and NOBODY died - and the nation's zeitgeist won't forget about it. In fact, dare I say it - the frenzy over this lingers longer than the tragic, accidental death tf the two teens crushed by American military.
I'm no professional, but that to me seems like psychopathic xenophobia, don't you think?
Cheers,
Joe |
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KoreanLifer
Joined: 30 Jan 2003
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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whats up with the koreans showing World Cup highlights when ur waiting in the immigration line-up at ICN.to most folks its all over and in the history books.i guess they still want to prove to the world they r still #1 & bestuuh!!! |
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Gladiator
Joined: 23 May 2003 Location: Seoul
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 4:49 pm Post subject: The most hated athlete in South Korea |
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Holy Joe wrote
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Perhaps FIFA didn't realise the significance. They tend to discipline folk who gesture directly at the crowds, or do anything blatantly provocative. But it's not so different from some of the other daft goal celebrations you see (Bebeto's "rocking baby" routine, Gazza's "dentist chair" etc)
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Fair points Holy Joe, but I think we are comparing chalk and cheese re: Gazza's infamous "Dentists Chair" vs Ahn Chong Hwan's "skating". If you brought up Gazza's unsavoury "piping" act deliberately intended to aggravate the rival sectarian Celtic supporters years back that would be closer to the mark.
Bebeto, Romario et al's celebrations were exclamations of joy at the birth of the former's child. Gazza's infamous antics were an intended dig at the UK press/media.
I feel Ahn's gesture was something darker than that I'm afraid. He was deliberately playing on ignorant, nationalistic and blatantly anti-US (not to say incredibly petty) sentiments with his actions and I hope one day he will look back with a sense of shame.
As other posters have hinted, if SK's athletes can't learn to temper such nationalistic fire that stains sportsmanship and destroys the very values events such as the WC and Olympics are suppose to champion (yes niaive I know) maybe they shouldn't compete at all. |
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Holyjoe

Joined: 03 Mar 2003 Location: Away for a cuppa
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Posted: Thu Nov 20, 2003 4:58 pm Post subject: Re: The most hated athlete in South Korea |
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Gladiator wrote: |
Fair points Holy Joe, but I think we are comparing chalk and cheese re: Gazza's infamous "Dentists Chair" vs Ahn Chong Hwan's "skating". If you brought up Gazza's unsavoury "piping" act deliberately intended to aggravate the rival sectarian Celtic supporters years back that would be closer to the mark. |
To be honest though, Gazza as simple as he is just didn't realise the offense it would cause.
Barry Ferguson ( ), then a Rangers player, told him to do it as it was the 'done' thing, and the Geordie muppet followed no questions asked. |
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Gwangjuboy
Joined: 08 Jul 2003 Location: England
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 2:26 am Post subject: |
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KoreanLifer wrote: |
whats up with the koreans showing World Cup highlights when ur waiting in the immigration line-up at ICN.to most folks its all over and in the history books.i guess they still want to prove to the world they r still #1 & bestuuh!!! |
Why don't they show the recent defeat to Vietnam? I hope the Koreans milk their world cup exploits, for they won't win a game should they get to Germany in 2006. |
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matko

Joined: 16 Jan 2003 Location: in a world of hurt!
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:32 am Post subject: |
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The next time the Americans play Korea and score a goal, the goal scorer should run to the nearest corner flag, pick it up and slam it to the ground in disgust!
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posco's trumpet
Joined: 20 Apr 2003 Location: Beneath the Underdog
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Posted: Fri Nov 21, 2003 5:21 am Post subject: |
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Last edited by posco's trumpet on Sat Dec 06, 2003 8:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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