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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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 Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:37 am Post subject: The sun is getting colder/earth's cooling phase begins |
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Al Gore is going to look like a big jackass, and very soon. The scientific community that has piled on to the global warming cash cow are going to look the scientific equivalent of subprime lenders. Not good news for Canada, who would have benefited from better crops in the global warming predictions. Oh well, at least we can keep pumping out oil now.
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The Sun Also Sets
By INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Thursday, February 07, 2008 4:20 PM PT
Climate Change: Not every scientist is part of Al Gore's mythical "consensus." Scientists worried about a new ice age seek funding to better observe something bigger than your SUV � the sun.
Related Topics: Global Warming
Back in 1991, before Al Gore first shouted that the Earth was in the balance, the Danish Meteorological Institute released a study using data that went back centuries that showed that global temperatures closely tracked solar cycles.
To many, those data were convincing. Now, Canadian scientists are seeking additional funding for more and better "eyes" with which to observe our sun, which has a bigger impact on Earth's climate than all the tailpipes and smokestacks on our planet combined.
And they're worried about global cooling, not warming.
Kenneth Tapping, a solar researcher and project director for Canada's National Research Council, is among those looking at the sun for evidence of an increase in sunspot activity.
Solar activity fluctuates in an 11-year cycle. But so far in this cycle, the sun has been disturbingly quiet. The lack of increased activity could signal the beginning of what is known as a Maunder Minimum, an event which occurs every couple of centuries and can last as long as a century.
Such an event occurred in the 17th century. The observation of sunspots showed extraordinarily low levels of magnetism on the sun, with little or no 11-year cycle.
This solar hibernation corresponded with a period of bitter cold that began around 1650 and lasted, with intermittent spikes of warming, until 1715. Frigid winters and cold summers during that period led to massive crop failures, famine and death in Northern Europe.
Tapping reports no change in the sun's magnetic field so far this cycle and warns that if the sun remains quiet for another year or two, it may indicate a repeat of that period of drastic cooling of the Earth, bringing massive snowfall and severe weather to the Northern Hemisphere.
Tapping oversees the operation of a 60-year-old radio telescope that he calls a "stethoscope for the sun." But he and his colleagues need better equipment.
In Canada, where radio-telescopic monitoring of the sun has been conducted since the end of World War II, a new instrument, the next-generation solar flux monitor, could measure the sun's emissions more rapidly and accurately.
As we have noted many times, perhaps the biggest impact on the Earth's climate over time has been the sun.
For instance, researchers at the Max Planck Institute for Solar Research in Germany report the sun has been burning more brightly over the last 60 years, accounting for the 1 degree Celsius increase in Earth's temperature over the last 100 years.
R. Timothy Patterson, professor of geology and director of the Ottawa-Carleton Geoscience Center of Canada's Carleton University, says that "CO2 variations show little correlation with our planet's climate on long, medium and even short time scales."
Rather, he says, "I and the first-class scientists I work with are consistently finding excellent correlations between the regular fluctuations of the sun and earthly climate. This is not surprising. The sun and the stars are the ultimate source of energy on this planet."
Patterson, sharing Tapping's concern, says: "Solar scientists predict that, by 2020, the sun will be starting into its weakest Schwabe cycle of the past two centuries, likely leading to unusually cool conditions on Earth."
"Solar activity has overpowered any effect that CO2 has had before, and it most likely will again," Patterson says. "If we were to have even a medium-sized solar minimum, we could be looking at a lot more bad effects than 'global warming' would have had."
In 2005, Russian astronomer Khabibullo Abdusamatov made some waves � and not a few enemies in the global warming "community" � by predicting that the sun would reach a peak of activity about three years from now, to be accompanied by "dramatic changes" in temperatures.
A Hoover Institution Study a few years back examined historical data and came to a similar conclusion.
"The effects of solar activity and volcanoes are impossible to miss. Temperatures fluctuated exactly as expected, and the pattern was so clear that, statistically, the odds of the correlation existing by chance were one in 100," according to Hoover fellow Bruce Berkowitz.
The study says that "try as we might, we simply could not find any relationship between industrial activity, energy consumption and changes in global temperatures."
The study concludes that if you shut down all the world's power plants and factories, "there would not be much effect on temperatures."
But if the sun shuts down, we've got a problem. It is the sun, not the Earth, that's hanging in the balance. |
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bjonothan
Joined: 29 Apr 2003
Location: All over the place
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 4:39 am Post subject: |
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I always said that the global warming stuff was a load of crap. How so many "smart" people can get it wrong is amazing to me. A little lesson I learnt as a kid was that until you know for sure, don't say anything.
I will love to rub it in with the fellas that were sure that the world was about to end because of some smog. 
That being said, I still think we should be taking better care of the planet. |
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Harpeau
Joined: 01 Feb 2003
Location: Coquitlam, BC
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 4:50 am Post subject: |
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| bjonothan wrote: |
I always said that the global warming stuff was a load of crap. How so many "smart" people can get it wrong is amazing to me. A little lesson I learnt as a kid was that until you know for sure, don't say anything.
I will love to rub it in with the fellas that were sure that the world was about to end because of some smog.
That being said, I still think we should be taking better care of the planet. |
Agreed. $mart people need to begin fighting the effects of Global Cooling. |
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Justin Hale
Joined: 24 Nov 2007
Location: the Straight Talk Express
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 5:13 am Post subject: |
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STFU you douchebags!
Harpeau, I've told you 23 zillion times previously that global cooling never had scientific support (=)
I realize you TEFL in Korea types are constantly drunk, but please try to remember this from National Geographic |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 5:41 am Post subject: |
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| The sun can cool but it's still sending out solar radiation. If that solar radiation is not radiated back into space because more and more is being trapped by more and more greenhouse gases, it doesn't really mean much to say the sun is cooling. (Assuming it is. I'm a little skeptical about getting correct science reporting from an investment magazine.) |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 6:07 am Post subject: |
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| Justin Hale wrote: |
STFU you douchebags!
Harpeau, I've told you 23 zillion times previously that global cooling never had scientific support (=)
I realize you TEFL in Korea types are constantly drunk, but please try to remember this from National Geographic |
From your link:
Other recent research has suggested that the effects of variations in the sun's output are "negligible" as a factor in warming, [b]but other, more complicated solar mechanisms could possibly play a role.[/b]
sounds like you're the douchebag. |
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twg
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Location: Getting some fresh air...
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:19 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I'm a little skeptical about getting correct science reporting from an investment magazine. |
What? But but big business has proven that cigarettes clear your skin and the pig shit pollution makes the daisies grow!
It's in print mindmetoo! That makes it reliable and trust-worty. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:41 am Post subject: |
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| twg wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I'm a little skeptical about getting correct science reporting from an investment magazine. |
What? But but big business has proven that cigarettes clear your skin and the pig *beep* pollution makes the daisies grow!
It's in print mindmetoo! That makes it reliable and trust-worty. |
| Quote: |
R. Timothy Patterson, professor of geology and director of the Ottawa-Carleton Geoscience Center of Canada's Carleton University, says that "CO2 variations show little correlation with our planet's climate on long, medium and even short time scales."
Rather, he says, "I and the first-class scientists I work with are consistently finding excellent correlations between the regular fluctuations of the sun and earthly climate. This is not surprising. The sun and the stars are the ultimate source of energy on this planet."
Patterson, sharing Tapping's concern, says: "Solar scientists predict that, by 2020, the sun will be starting into its weakest Schwabe cycle of the past two centuries, likely leading to unusually cool conditions on Earth."
"Solar activity has overpowered any effect that CO2 has had before, and it most likely will again," Patterson says. "If we were to have even a medium-sized solar minimum, we could be looking at a lot more bad effects than 'global warming' would have had."
In 2005, Russian astronomer Khabibullo Abdusamatov made some waves � and not a few enemies in the global warming "community" � by predicting that the sun would reach a peak of activity about three years from now, to be accompanied by "dramatic changes" in temperatures.
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So you're counting University professors as big business? strange. |
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Czarjorge
Joined: 01 May 2007
Location: I now have the same moustache, and it is glorious.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 9:46 am Post subject: |
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| I didn't realize there were so many scientists on this board. |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:32 am Post subject: |
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| Czarjorge wrote: |
| I didn't realize there were so many scientists on this board. |
It is truly a humbling experience to be amongst them, isn't it? Even though there is practically zero scientific agreement on virtually any topic, it is clear this forum is very cutting edge.
I like it. |
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Czarjorge
Joined: 01 May 2007
Location: I now have the same moustache, and it is glorious.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| I like you. |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Czarjorge wrote: |
| I like you. |
Finally, we have some agreement. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:19 pm Post subject: |
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| caniff wrote: |
| Czarjorge wrote: |
| I didn't realize there were so many scientists on this board. |
It is truly a humbling experience to be amongst them, isn't it? Even though there is practically zero scientific agreement on virtually any topic, it is clear this forum is very cutting edge.
I like it. |
That's an over broad statement. Depends on what you define as scientific agreement. Relativity, although backed by reams of observational and experimental evidence (GPS would not work if it weren't for taking relativity into account), has a few doubters in the scientific community, although they don't offer much in the way of evidence.
There's still lots of room for debate in global warming, albeit the growing consensus is man made global warming is happening. Before I place too much faith in any consensus, I do remind myself of the 1970s when the world was running out of oil. Why, it was foolish to believe we weren't running out of oil. And then we found new reserves, we ramped up efficiency, and we had an oil glut for 25 years.
However, the word of one scientist printed in one investment newsletter by a reporter who might not even have a scientific background, may not be the most accurate source. |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:25 pm Post subject: |
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| twg wrote: |
| But but big business... |
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caniff
Joined: 03 Feb 2004
Location: All over the map
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| Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
Before I place too much faith in any consensus, I do remind myself of the 1970s when the world was running out of oil. Why, it was foolish to believe we weren't running out of oil. And then we found new reserves, we ramped up efficiency, and we had an oil glut for 25 years.
However, the word of one scientist printed in one investment newsletter by a reporter who might not even have a scientific background, may not be the most accurate source. |
I see the point you are making with your two examples, especially about the investment newsletter. My comment was mainly made tongue-in-cheek.
After reading your post, however, I have a follow-up question:
What ever happened to keane/EFL? |
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