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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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wannago
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
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 Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:03 am Post subject: Re: A Sports Thread worth reading-really |
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| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| This was on Bill Simmons blog today. It's about the possibly/likely move of the Seattle Super Sonics to Oklahoma (14th largest market to 45th largest). I hate when people call things "tragic" when they aren't, but this qualifies. It reminds me of how the Winnipeg Jets were stolen away only to have teams with half-filled buildings in Nashville, Miami, and god knows where else. If you've ever really cared about a sports team, then you should read this. I'm going to write nasty emails to David Stern, Howard Schulz, Clay Bennett and the City of OKlahoma for even thinking of going ahead with this. It's the kind of thing that kills sports, the way the NHL strike killed hockey in the U.S. |
Look, the Sonics are not the property of the City of Seattle. They are the property of Clay Bennett...period. The fine folks in Seattle can certainly refuse to build a new arena if they so choose, but Bennett should be able to take his BUSINESS anywhere he chooses and, if that's OK City, so be it. I think if Bennett's not happy with the popcorn they serve at the arena in Seattle, he can move his team. HE pays the salaries, HE pays the operating costs of the team, not the residents of Seattle. The only thing they pay for are tickets (if they choose) and team merchandise (if they choose). If Bennett's not happy with the arena FOR WHATEVER REASON, he can go.
Personally, I don't think it makes much sense to move to such a low market area. He should move the team to Las Vegas or St. Louis, maybe even Kansas City. I say more power to him. Why is it alright that the Sonics should be MADE to stay in Seattle?
I will be contacting everyone whose emails addresses you supply to encourage them to go ahead with the move.
Last edited by wannago on Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:07 am; edited 1 time in total |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:06 am Post subject: Re: A Sports Thread worth reading-really |
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| wannago wrote: |
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| This was on Bill Simmons blog today. It's about the possibly/likely move of the Seattle Super Sonics to Oklahoma (14th largest market to 45th largest). I hate when people call things "tragic" when they aren't, but this qualifies. It reminds me of how the Winnipeg Jets were stolen away only to have teams with half-filled buildings in Nashville, Miami, and god knows where else. If you've ever really cared about a sports team, then you should read this. I'm going to write nasty emails to David Stern, Howard Schulz, Clay Bennett and the City of OKlahoma for even thinking of going ahead with this. It's the kind of thing that kills sports, the way the NHL strike killed hockey in the U.S. |
Look, the Sonics are not the property of the City of Seattle. They are the property of Clay Bennett...period. The fine folks in Seattle can certainly refuse to build a new arena if they so choose, but Bennett should be able to take his BUSINESS anywhere he chooses and, if that's OK City, so be it. I think if Bennett's not happy with the popcorn they serve at the arena in Seattle, he can move his team. HE pays the salaries, HE pays the operating costs of the team, not the residents of Seattle. The only thing they pay for are tickets (if they choose) and team merchandise (if they choose). If Bennett's not happy with the arena FOR WHATEVER REASON, he can go.
Personally, I don't think it makes much sense to move to such a low market area. He should move the team to Las Vegas or St. Louis. I say more power to him. Why is it alright that the Sonics should be MADE to stay in Seattle? |
Did you read the link? I think sports teams are not like regular businesses. They involve a "social contract". If the NBA allows this to happen, they do so at their own peril. It's not only immoral, it's bad business. |
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wannago
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:11 am Post subject: Re: A Sports Thread worth reading-really |
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| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| wannago wrote: |
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| This was on Bill Simmons blog today. It's about the possibly/likely move of the Seattle Super Sonics to Oklahoma (14th largest market to 45th largest). I hate when people call things "tragic" when they aren't, but this qualifies. It reminds me of how the Winnipeg Jets were stolen away only to have teams with half-filled buildings in Nashville, Miami, and god knows where else. If you've ever really cared about a sports team, then you should read this. I'm going to write nasty emails to David Stern, Howard Schulz, Clay Bennett and the City of OKlahoma for even thinking of going ahead with this. It's the kind of thing that kills sports, the way the NHL strike killed hockey in the U.S. |
Look, the Sonics are not the property of the City of Seattle. They are the property of Clay Bennett...period. The fine folks in Seattle can certainly refuse to build a new arena if they so choose, but Bennett should be able to take his BUSINESS anywhere he chooses and, if that's OK City, so be it. I think if Bennett's not happy with the popcorn they serve at the arena in Seattle, he can move his team. HE pays the salaries, HE pays the operating costs of the team, not the residents of Seattle. The only thing they pay for are tickets (if they choose) and team merchandise (if they choose). If Bennett's not happy with the arena FOR WHATEVER REASON, he can go.
Personally, I don't think it makes much sense to move to such a low market area. He should move the team to Las Vegas or St. Louis. I say more power to him. Why is it alright that the Sonics should be MADE to stay in Seattle? |
Did you read the link? I think sports teams are not like regular businesses. They involve a "social contract". If the NBA allows this to happen, they do so at their own peril. It's not only immoral, it's bad business. |
IMMORAL???? Good god, your definition of immoral is shitty to say the least. Why is it OK for the City of Seattle to hold a man's business hostage? It's not. I read the link.
Look, I am a HUGE Denver Broncos fan. My family STILL holds season tickets. If they were to leave Denver, I would be devastated, but I certainly wouldn't try to deny Pat Bowlen to move the team if he wanted. Its a BUSINESS...why can't people get this through their heads? |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:21 am Post subject: Re: A Sports Thread worth reading-really |
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| wannago wrote: |
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| wannago wrote: |
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| This was on Bill Simmons blog today. It's about the possibly/likely move of the Seattle Super Sonics to Oklahoma (14th largest market to 45th largest). I hate when people call things "tragic" when they aren't, but this qualifies. It reminds me of how the Winnipeg Jets were stolen away only to have teams with half-filled buildings in Nashville, Miami, and god knows where else. If you've ever really cared about a sports team, then you should read this. I'm going to write nasty emails to David Stern, Howard Schulz, Clay Bennett and the City of OKlahoma for even thinking of going ahead with this. It's the kind of thing that kills sports, the way the NHL strike killed hockey in the U.S. |
Look, the Sonics are not the property of the City of Seattle. They are the property of Clay Bennett...period. The fine folks in Seattle can certainly refuse to build a new arena if they so choose, but Bennett should be able to take his BUSINESS anywhere he chooses and, if that's OK City, so be it. I think if Bennett's not happy with the popcorn they serve at the arena in Seattle, he can move his team. HE pays the salaries, HE pays the operating costs of the team, not the residents of Seattle. The only thing they pay for are tickets (if they choose) and team merchandise (if they choose). If Bennett's not happy with the arena FOR WHATEVER REASON, he can go.
Personally, I don't think it makes much sense to move to such a low market area. He should move the team to Las Vegas or St. Louis. I say more power to him. Why is it alright that the Sonics should be MADE to stay in Seattle? |
Did you read the link? I think sports teams are not like regular businesses. They involve a "social contract". If the NBA allows this to happen, they do so at their own peril. It's not only immoral, it's bad business. |
IMMORAL???? Good god, your definition of immoral is *beep* to say the least. Why is it OK for the City of Seattle to hold a man's business hostage? It's not. I read the link.
Look, I am a HUGE Denver Broncos fan. My family STILL holds season tickets. If they were to leave Denver, I would be devastated, but I certainly wouldn't try to deny Pat Bowlen to move the team if he wanted. Its a BUSINESS...why can't people get this through their heads? |
It's immoral if it's done under lying, false pretenses. He asks for $500 million from Seattle, but OK has a $90 million arena, and that's ok. By the way, I've met the Bowlens, they are from Alberta via the States, and they would never, ever, do what is being done by Bennett and Stern, and what was done by Shulz. You have nothing to worry about. |
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wannago
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 12:36 am Post subject: Re: A Sports Thread worth reading-really |
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| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| wannago wrote: |
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| wannago wrote: |
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
| This was on Bill Simmons blog today. It's about the possibly/likely move of the Seattle Super Sonics to Oklahoma (14th largest market to 45th largest). I hate when people call things "tragic" when they aren't, but this qualifies. It reminds me of how the Winnipeg Jets were stolen away only to have teams with half-filled buildings in Nashville, Miami, and god knows where else. If you've ever really cared about a sports team, then you should read this. I'm going to write nasty emails to David Stern, Howard Schulz, Clay Bennett and the City of OKlahoma for even thinking of going ahead with this. It's the kind of thing that kills sports, the way the NHL strike killed hockey in the U.S. |
Look, the Sonics are not the property of the City of Seattle. They are the property of Clay Bennett...period. The fine folks in Seattle can certainly refuse to build a new arena if they so choose, but Bennett should be able to take his BUSINESS anywhere he chooses and, if that's OK City, so be it. I think if Bennett's not happy with the popcorn they serve at the arena in Seattle, he can move his team. HE pays the salaries, HE pays the operating costs of the team, not the residents of Seattle. The only thing they pay for are tickets (if they choose) and team merchandise (if they choose). If Bennett's not happy with the arena FOR WHATEVER REASON, he can go.
Personally, I don't think it makes much sense to move to such a low market area. He should move the team to Las Vegas or St. Louis. I say more power to him. Why is it alright that the Sonics should be MADE to stay in Seattle? |
Did you read the link? I think sports teams are not like regular businesses. They involve a "social contract". If the NBA allows this to happen, they do so at their own peril. It's not only immoral, it's bad business. |
IMMORAL???? Good god, your definition of immoral is *beep* to say the least. Why is it OK for the City of Seattle to hold a man's business hostage? It's not. I read the link.
Look, I am a HUGE Denver Broncos fan. My family STILL holds season tickets. If they were to leave Denver, I would be devastated, but I certainly wouldn't try to deny Pat Bowlen to move the team if he wanted. Its a BUSINESS...why can't people get this through their heads? |
It's immoral if it's done under lying, false pretenses. He asks for $500 million from Seattle, but OK has a $90 million arena, and that's ok. By the way, I've met the Bowlens, they are from Alberta via the States, and they would never, ever, do what is being done by Bennett and Stern, and what was done by Shulz. You have nothing to worry about. |
Look, I agree that moving to OKC doesn't make much business sense, but it really doesn't matter the reason. Seattle decides NOT to give him the $500 arena, so he decides to move. You really don't know what OKC has planned for the team but I would imagine there would be some significant upgrades to the existing arena, maybe even a totally new structure. Don't you think OKC would love to have a professional basketball team?
My family has had Broncos season tickets for 35 years. Its a way of life. You do know that Denver built Bowlen and the Broncos a brand new stadium a few years ago, right? And there were some veiled threats to move the team if the taxpayers didn't approve the new place. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:25 am Post subject: |
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1. Oklahoma City can support and will support a team, as they did last year with New Orleans team.
2. OC has a far smaller fan base to draw on (Seattle has 5 million if you count Vancouver)
3. Seattle gave $200 mil to the team 13 years ago. The stadium is not the issue, it is a smokescreen.
4. Bennett only wants to move the team. He will not talk to ownership possibilities from Seattle.
5. OC has not been asked to ante up any money, and they have an inferior arena.
6. The NBA owes it to the fans of Seattle, and to the fans of other teams, to not allow this to happen. It sends entirely the wrong message. This is not a regular business. If it were, teams with horrible records should fold, but this never happens, because there is an implicite agreement to support your team through thick and thin.
7. Owners have always made demands and threats to get arena deals. That's part of business. But when it is done in bad faith as a ruse to move the team, then it is a whole different ball game. That's where the league needs to step in and not allow a model franchise to be torn down. What the hell is Stern thinking, anyway? |
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mistermasan
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Location: 10+ yrs on Dave's ESL cafe
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:50 am Post subject: |
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st.louis doesn't want em. st.louis doesn't have the interest in the NBA.
had the hawks, lost em. had the ABA spirits and lost em. the university team fits the old boy network just swell. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:28 am Post subject: |
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| mistermasan wrote: |
st.louis doesn't want em. st.louis doesn't have the interest in the NBA.
had the hawks, lost em. had the ABA spirits and lost em. the university team fits the old boy network just swell. |
That's the mystery, taking a team away from a city with great history, winning tradition, great fans, great corporate base, large population base, love of the NBA. For what? A city with no NBA tradition, with a small population, and a crap arena. Like I said, slitting their own throat.
As for Europe and Asia, I can just imagine the quality of play from these coddled players when you mix in an 11 hour flight, customs, and jet lag. You'll have about a 95% home team winning. Good luck with that Stern. |
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wannago
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:29 am Post subject: |
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| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
1. Oklahoma City can support and will support a team, as they did last year with New Orleans team.
2. OC has a far smaller fan base to draw on (Seattle has 5 million if you count Vancouver)
3. Seattle gave $200 mil to the team 13 years ago. The stadium is not the issue, it is a smokescreen.
4. Bennett only wants to move the team. He will not talk to ownership possibilities from Seattle.
5. OC has not been asked to ante up any money, and they have an inferior arena.
6. The NBA owes it to the fans of Seattle, and to the fans of other teams, to not allow this to happen. It sends entirely the wrong message. This is not a regular business. If it were, teams with horrible records should fold, but this never happens, because there is an implicite agreement to support your team through thick and thin.
7. Owners have always made demands and threats to get arena deals. That's part of business. But when it is done in bad faith as a ruse to move the team, then it is a whole different ball game. That's where the league needs to step in and not allow a model franchise to be torn down. What the hell is Stern thinking, anyway? |
You've made a lot of accusations here. But, tell me, WHY does Bennett want to move the franchise if it makes no business sense to move them to OKC? Does he want to punish Seattle for something? |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:40 am Post subject: |
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| wannago wrote: |
| blaseblasphemener wrote: |
1. Oklahoma City can support and will support a team, as they did last year with New Orleans team.
2. OC has a far smaller fan base to draw on (Seattle has 5 million if you count Vancouver)
3. Seattle gave $200 mil to the team 13 years ago. The stadium is not the issue, it is a smokescreen.
4. Bennett only wants to move the team. He will not talk to ownership possibilities from Seattle.
5. OC has not been asked to ante up any money, and they have an inferior arena.
6. The NBA owes it to the fans of Seattle, and to the fans of other teams, to not allow this to happen. It sends entirely the wrong message. This is not a regular business. If it were, teams with horrible records should fold, but this never happens, because there is an implicite agreement to support your team through thick and thin.
7. Owners have always made demands and threats to get arena deals. That's part of business. But when it is done in bad faith as a ruse to move the team, then it is a whole different ball game. That's where the league needs to step in and not allow a model franchise to be torn down. What the hell is Stern thinking, anyway? |
You've made a lot of accusations here. But, tell me, WHY does Bennett want to move the franchise if it makes no business sense to move them to OKC? Does he want to punish Seattle for something? |
No, his business partner and part-owner spilt the beans when he admitted that they always wanted to move the team. It's in the article. The only reason he's doing what he's doing with the arena b.s. is so he can get league approval from the other owners. So far it's worked as the Sonics haven't been on the radar of most fans, but I guarantee now that Simmons has put it on the map and the fans feel impowered, it is going to turn into a spectacle Stern has never seen the likes of. I hope it overshadows all the good that has come in the league this year, because this kind of thing has no place in sports. It's akin to the Browns and Colts moving, only Seattle spent $200 mil on stadium reno in 1996, and Bennett has made zero concessions: he just picked a random number of $500 mill, and won't budge. Plus, the league should have never allowed the sale in the first place. If he wanted to do what he's done, why not be upfront about it before buying the team. Schulz and Bennett represent all that is wrong with sports in the 21st century. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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| The whole thing is just welfare for the rich. |
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blaseblasphemener
Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Location: There's a voice, keeps on calling me, down the road, that's where I'll always be
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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| I read today that they will try and do what the Browns did and use legal means to stop any move of the Supersonics name and logo. There are several ownership groups who will either build an arena with private funds or do some work on the present arena. They will try and bring another team to town from a city that doesn't support their team. |
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mistermasan
Joined: 20 Sep 2007
Location: 10+ yrs on Dave's ESL cafe
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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i agree w/ yata 100%.
the cubs are on the block. the current owner owns the team and wrigley field. word is he is gonna sell them seperately. the team'll go to another rich guy and the field will go to a state run entity that will refurbish the old gal. the state is going to buy, refurbish and then give back the field.
a team is gonna sell for north of a billion and neither the current owner nor the future owners have any interest in the stadium and instead let the state foot the bill for generations of privately held inaction.
gotta love ILLinois! |
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Pluto
Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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| mistermasan wrote: |
i agree w/ yata 100%.
the cubs are on the block. the current owner owns the team and wrigley field. word is he is gonna sell them seperately. the team'll go to another rich guy and the field will go to a state run entity that will refurbish the old gal. the state is going to buy, refurbish and then give back the field.
a team is gonna sell for north of a billion and neither the current owner nor the future owners have any interest in the stadium and instead let the state foot the bill for generations of privately held inaction.
gotta love ILLinois! |
Yeah, I saw an article in the Journal a couple weeks back that Mark Cuban is in the market. If that asshole ends up owning the Cubs I'll have to disavow them until new management comes in. Hell, I might even do the unthinkable and become a Cardinals fan.  |
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