Site Search:
 
Speak Korean Now!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Religion and Korea..
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Off-Topic Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
nomad-ish



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Location: On the bottom of the food chain

PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vanislander, i was kidding.

lucas_p wrote:
Huh, maybe those stats haven't been updated, because I live outside of Seoul, and it seems like I always am meeting Christians, and almost all the people I know are Christians ... and I certainly don't actively meet them. And going into a house and noticing a crucifix right over the doorway, and the hoards of people rushing to the 15 churches in one block....


same for me, i think it's because i'm a foreigner that they approach me a lot. i've had them striking up a conversation with me, then launching into a christian speech, following me, blocking my path on the street, and scurrying after me when i'm walking to the store. not to mention showing up at my apartment.

i never had a problem with christians before, to each their own, but i've found the christians (not all christians, just the ones actively recruiting) to be irritating in korea
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jajdude



Joined: 18 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Victimhood and self-pity, "Han," conformity, acceptance and fear of authority, love of groups, belonging, and desire to maintain an image of respectability and be seen as a good person in your community, reputation, all make fine ingredients for religious fervor and speaking in tongues. I shudder when I hear them.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
pdx



Joined: 19 Jan 2007

PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

agoodmouse wrote:
You see how Koreans, if they go for a casual hike or walk about town, go full out and don North Face gear, bring oxygen tanks, and two sherpas to carry three week supplies of kimchi as if they're making a final assault on K2. Why do you think they'd do anything less concerning man's ultimate destination, eternity?

lucasp wrote:
These followers are NOT casual -- they are INTO it.....


HA! this is exactly the reasoning my roommate and I came up with when we were in Korea. We decided that Koreans don't do anything half-assed. Whether it's climbing to the top of Namsan in their full on hiking gear (which, Namsan is about the same size as the park behind the college I went to, and nobody there ever wore hiking gear), drinking with their co-workers, or gettig their kids to learn English, Koreans are anything but half-assed.

Which would explain why they're so gung-ho about their religions.

Which was quite strange, because I'm a pretty dedicated Christian, as is my roommate, but we were constantly assaulted by really strange sects of Christianity and people arguing with us over the most trivial bits of Christianity.

Insane.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TheChickenLover



Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Location: The Chicken Coop

PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The image that has never left my mind when it comes to Christianity in Korea is this one



To me, this image is one of the reasons my hatred towards evengelical religions is nearly absolute. This monk is doing his own thing in peace while this idiot mocks the poor monk. It's disgusting & not uncommon here.

I was dragged to a few chuches, was disgusted with what I saw. It's seemed more a cult than anything. That immediate reminder of paying 10% to your church was also insulting. As if, I'll choose what I will donate thank you very much (& I'm not religious at all).

Avoid religion here, it's nearly complete nonsense unless you're looking for the peaceful & spiritual type as in buddhism. Christianity is just slavery for your soul.

Chicken
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
TheChickenLover



Joined: 17 Dec 2007
Location: The Chicken Coop

PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The image that has never left my mind when it comes to Christianity in Korea is this one



To me, this image is one of the reasons my hatred towards evengelical religions is nearly absolute. This monk is doing his own thing in peace while this idiot mocks the poor monk. It's disgusting & not uncommon here.

I was dragged to a few chuches, was disgusted with what I saw. It's seemed more a cult than anything. That immediate reminder of paying 10% to your church was also insulting. As if, I'll choose what I will donate thank you very much (& I'm not religious at all).

Avoid religion here, it's nearly complete nonsense unless you're looking for the peaceful & spiritual type as in buddhism. Christianity is just slavery for your soul.

Chicken
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Omkara



Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Location: USA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 4:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That photo looks as though it is from Busan, in Seomyon, just outside of the Lotte Department Store. Is it?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
exit86



Joined: 17 May 2006

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always firmly believed that Korea needs MORE religion, particularly
to help instill the notion of universal absolutes in terms of "Law."
The Judeo-Christian and Muslim faiths all help to keep believers
keep themselves in line with the idea that the Divine has made
certain laws which are not to be broken. Though most cultures have the
big laws in this class (i.e. "Killing is wrong" "Don't steal" "Don't screw your
neighbor's wife or husband"), it is the minor Divine Laws which might help
Korea a bit (i.e. "Don't lie" "Don't kill unborn children because they are females" "Don't cheat on your husband or wife with someone at the love hotel" "Prostitution is not a good thing and in no way, shape, or form should it be socially acceptable" etc) When Westerners with such a religious background do bad things (example--killing your unborn child because
it is a girl) most of us--even those ardent atheists out there--usually know or feel that some Divine Being is watching us and we are gonna be in deep sh_t after we kick the bucket. Following this, many Western societies make civil laws to further uphold the Divine Law (i.e. the American Southern States). We feel bad--GUILT--for our actions.

Here in North-East Asia, you are guilty only if you get caught, then comes
the SHAME as the dip-sh_ts on the evening news in the cop shop put their jackets over their heads to hide their faces so nobody knows it was them who raped the three school children or whatever.

I think it would be nice to see more religion in this country.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ella



Joined: 17 Apr 2006

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It doesn't matter what someone says they believe. Confucianism trumps all religion in Korea.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pink Freud



Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Location: Daegu

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

exit86 wrote:
I've always firmly believed that Korea needs MORE religion, particularly
to help instill the notion of universal absolutes in terms of "Law."
The Judeo-Christian and Muslim faiths all help to keep believers
keep themselves in line with the idea that the Divine has made
certain laws which are not to be broken. Though most cultures have the
big laws in this class (i.e. "Killing is wrong" "Don't steal" "Don't screw your
neighbor's wife or husband"), it is the minor Divine Laws which might help
Korea a bit (i.e. "Don't lie" "Don't kill unborn children because they are females" "Don't cheat on your husband or wife with someone at the love hotel" "Prostitution is not a good thing and in no way, shape, or form should it be socially acceptable" etc) When Westerners with such a religious background do bad things (example--killing your unborn child because
it is a girl) most of us--even those ardent atheists out there--usually know or feel that some Divine Being is watching us and we are gonna be in deep sh_t after we kick the bucket. Following this, many Western societies make civil laws to further uphold the Divine Law (i.e. the American Southern States). We feel bad--GUILT--for our actions.

Here in North-East Asia, you are guilty only if you get caught, then comes
the SHAME as the dip-sh_ts on the evening news in the cop shop put their jackets over their heads to hide their faces so nobody knows it was them who raped the three school children or whatever.

I think it would be nice to see more religion in this country.


If the only thing keeping you from doing evil is a so-called "divine law", then you are seriously messed up.

The ten commandments are not divine. They are Mosaic.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
exit86



Joined: 17 May 2006

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My point is that Western ideas of Law come from these ancient
religious ideas. The Judeo-Christian laws from JHWH (not all 613 of them from the Bible, but the major ones like JHWH's 10 Commandments
which He delivered to the Israelites via Moses) as well as Greco-Roman laws which were in many cases Divinely commanded and/or upheld
(Zeus' laws of "Xenos" which dictated how guests and hosts must
behave as well as all the punishments for any type of trangressions
committed under the auspices of the host/guest relationship).
As a further example "lex talionis." Where does this come from?
Straight from the Judeo-Christian JHWH's "An eye for an eye"
proclamation.

Due to these Divine Laws--seen as something very real and very
believable in the pre-modern era--civic laws have often been put in place.
Accordingly, this Western system often has multiple levels of prohibitions and punishments. (Ex.: Not only will you go to jail for perjury in most
states in the US, but there is also the added punishment--be it in the forefront or back of one's mind--of punishment from above for having sworn an untrue oath in the name of the Divine. It may sound medieval, but it is a verifiable sociological phenomenon in the West)

Korea lacks and always has lacked such Absolutes.
(Example: Killing is wrong, but, it is okay if your fetus is a girl.
Perjury is wrong, unless you really are ashamed and are attempting to save face.
Running a red light is wrong, unless you are in a big hurry.
(I don't think any god has gone on record to prohibit this one,
but it is the willing violation of a law set in place for the overall welfare
of one's fellow citizens which gives us the guilt--"I endangered the lives
of others and myself just because I am a selfish a-hole")
Cheating on your husband is wrong, unless he is always working late, he doesn't give you enough spending money and his mother is bit_h. [this is a real one here])

Law cannot be situation-based in a society of 50 million people.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Omkara



Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Location: USA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

exit86 wrote:
My point is that Western ideas of Law come from these ancient
religious ideas. The Judeo-Christian laws from JHWH (not all 613 of them from the Bible, but the major ones like JHWH's 10 Commandments
which He delivered to the Israelites via Moses) as well as Greco-Roman laws which were in many cases Divinely commanded and/or upheld
(Zeus' laws of "Xenos" which dictated how guests and hosts must
behave as well as all the punishments for any type of trangressions
committed under the auspices of the host/guest relationship).
As a further example "lex talionis." Where does this come from?
Straight from the Judeo-Christian JHWH's "An eye for an eye"
proclamation.

Due to these Divine Laws--seen as something very real and very
believable in the pre-modern era--civic laws have often been put in place.
Accordingly, this Western system often has multiple levels of prohibitions and punishments. (Ex.: Not only will you go to jail for perjury in most
states in the US, but there is also the added punishment--be it in the forefront or back of one's mind--of punishment from above for having sworn an untrue oath in the name of the Divine. It may sound medieval, but it is a verifiable sociological phenomenon in the West)

Korea lacks and always has lacked such Absolutes.
(Example: Killing is wrong, but, it is okay if your fetus is a girl.
Perjury is wrong, unless you really are ashamed and are attempting to save face.
Running a red light is wrong, unless you are in a big hurry.
(I don't think any god has gone on record to prohibit this one,
but it is the willing violation of a law set in place for the overall welfare
of one's fellow citizens which gives us the guilt--"I endangered the lives
of others and myself just because I am a selfish a-hole")
Cheating on your husband is wrong, unless he is always working late, he doesn't give you enough spending money and his mother is bit_h. [this is a real one here])

Law cannot be situation-based in a society of 50 million people.


Have you one good reason to believe that there exists a god? Then, are you just as credulous?

I want no response save that which justifies your hypothesis, that there exists a god.

You may argue, on the other hand, that god may be a fiction. Yet, it is good for people to beleive in a fiction owing to a better situation.

Can you stick to these two points, or will you run astray with you argument?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ED209



Joined: 17 Oct 2006

PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

exit86 wrote:
I've always firmly believed that Korea needs MORE religion, particularly
to help instill the notion of universal absolutes in terms of "Law."


Sorry could you site where religious societies have lower crime rates than less religious ones.

exit86 wrote:
The Judeo-Christian and Muslim faiths all help to keep believers
keep themselves in line with the idea that the Divine has made
certain laws which are not to be broken.


Any totalitarian society can achieve this, it is not necessarily a good idea.

exit86 wrote:
Though most cultures have the
big laws in this class (i.e. "Killing is wrong" "Don't steal" "Don't screw your
neighbor's wife or husband"), it is the minor Divine Laws which might help
Korea a bit (i.e. "Don't lie" "Don't kill unborn children because they are females" "Don't cheat on your husband or wife with someone at the love hotel" "Prostitution is not a good thing and in no way, shape, or form should it be socially acceptable" etc)


Yet they keep doing it. Go figure.


exit86 wrote:
When Westerners with such a religious background do bad things (example--killing your unborn child because
it is a girl) most of us--even those ardent atheists out there--usually know or feel that some Divine Being is watching us and we are gonna be in deep sh_t after we kick the bucket.


So ardent atheist believe in God now?

exit86 wrote:
Following this, many Western societies make civil laws to further uphold the Divine Law (i.e. the American Southern States). We feel bad--GUILT--for our actions.


Don't the more religious states in the US have higher crime and usually also carry the death penalty?(honest question)

exit86 wrote:
Here in North-East Asia, you are guilty only if you get caught, then comes
the SHAME as the dip-sh_ts on the evening news in the cop shop put their jackets over their heads to hide their faces so nobody knows it was them who raped the three school children or whatever.

I think it would be nice to see more religion in this country.


Which religion Islam, Mormin, Janist?
I do not see how religion would improve society any more than believing Santa won't bring gifts you've been a bad boy. Religion often enables crime and abuse of freedoms. The Christians I've met here are very different to the ones back home. They scare me.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jajdude



Joined: 18 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 9:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ella wrote:
It doesn't matter what someone says they believe. Confucianism trumps all religion in Korea.



Good point.

As for most religion and prayer I'd guess self-pity is at the heart of it. No wonder churches are everywhere.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ukon



Joined: 29 Jan 2008

PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

exit86 wrote:
I've always firmly believed that Korea needs MORE religion, particularly
to help instill the notion of universal absolutes in terms of "Law."
The Judeo-Christian and Muslim faiths all help to keep believers
keep themselves in line with the idea that the Divine has made
certain laws which are not to be broken. Though most cultures have the
big laws in this class (i.e. "Killing is wrong" "Don't steal" "Don't screw your
neighbor's wife or husband"), it is the minor Divine Laws which might help
Korea a bit (i.e. "Don't lie" "Don't kill unborn children because they are females" "Don't cheat on your husband or wife with someone at the love hotel" "Prostitution is not a good thing and in no way, shape, or form should it be socially acceptable" etc) When Westerners with such a religious background do bad things (example--killing your unborn child because
it is a girl) most of us--even those ardent atheists out there--usually know or feel that some Divine Being is watching us and we are gonna be in deep *beep* after we kick the bucket. Following this, many Western societies make civil laws to further uphold the Divine Law (i.e. the American Southern States). We feel bad--GUILT--for our actions.

Here in North-East Asia, you are guilty only if you get caught, then comes
the SHAME as the dip-sh_ts on the evening news in the cop shop put their jackets over their heads to hide their faces so nobody knows it was them who raped the three school children or whatever.

I think it would be nice to see more religion in this country.


I think you seriously need to take a few psychology courses. Numerous are the reasons that explain what your talking about and why they have little to do with divine reasons. For starters, that same guilt/shame dynamic applies everywhere....do you think thieves and corrupt types in the USA than Koreans feel more guilt for doing bad things?!?!

They may feel more or less guilty about different deeds(ie: abortion), but claiming Koreans are more prone to sociopathic tendencies(abscence of guilt) is quite possibly the most ignorant statement I've ever heard.


HOWEVER, there are things that can encourage less morality and sociopathic tendencies in people. City life encourages it more than small town living for instance in many cases for a variety of reasons that have jack**** to do with western "divine laws". Hell, go visit some hick korean farmers, They'll have more morality than you can shake a stick at.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ukon



Joined: 29 Jan 2008

PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

exit86 wrote:


Due to these Divine Laws--seen as something very real and very
believable in the pre-modern era--civic laws have often been put in place.
Accordingly, this Western system often has multiple levels of prohibitions and punishments. (Ex.: Not only will you go to jail for perjury in most
states in the US, but there is also the added punishment--be it in the forefront or back of one's mind--of punishment from above for having sworn an untrue oath in the name of the Divine. It may sound medieval, but it is a verifiable sociological phenomenon in the West)

Korea lacks and always has lacked such Absolutes.
(Example: Killing is wrong, but, it is okay if your fetus is a girl.
Perjury is wrong, unless you really are ashamed and are attempting to save face.
Running a red light is wrong, unless you are in a big hurry.
(I don't think any god has gone on record to prohibit this one,
but it is the willing violation of a law set in place for the overall welfare
of one's fellow citizens which gives us the guilt--"I endangered the lives
of others and myself just because I am a selfish a-hole")
Cheating on your husband is wrong, unless he is always working late, he doesn't give you enough spending money and his mother is bit_h. [this is a real one here])

Law cannot be situation-based in a society of 50 million people.


B******, Those examples you provided also happen in the west....even moreso during the more religious eras of our nation ironically

Example in olden times:

Killing is wrong....unless it's a uppity black slave or a evil jew who doesn't know his place. Hell, even today....killing and toture is wrong...unless it's a raghead terrorist!

I suggest you bring up your " ran a red light" example of western morality to a state trooper....he'll laugh so hard he'll forget why he pulled you over in the first place. Also, the lack of driving curtesy in many non-western countries has little to do with divinity or morality and moreso to do with the accepted rules and norms of the road in that culture.

The Cheating thing happens here(arguably less) for the exact same reasons and then some....not sure what fantasy land you live in but cheating is a common fact of life in most societies if not all...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Off-Topic Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Page 2 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International