Korean Job Discussion Forums

[sonicmatt]

I was wondering if people thought i was still worth it coming to korea even with all the visa changes or would going to japan be a better option. i know you can save or make more money in korea and you get a free housing but is it still worth it and just go to japan to avoid the hassle. thanks.

[laogaiguk]

It's worth going to Japan just because it's Japan. If you don't have to worry too much about money, go there. I've been to both, trust me. Almost everyone (except little mixed girl) will tell you this.

Korea is better for saving though.

[TBirdMG]

I did 3.5 years total, 1 in Korea, 2.5 in Japan. Here's my lowdown:

Korea:

-Teaching experience was with EPIK in the countryside. I had surprisingly good support from co-teachers AND administration. MS kids were great, had very few discipline problems, was invited to participate in extra-curriculars from video games to bball to English Club.
-Always received pay on time, housing issues (broken water heater, broken ondol) were dealt with, albeit slowly, got everything due me on my last day.
-As I was one of only 2 foreign teachers in my town, we had private offers galore...I could have done privates for 2 hours every night at 30-35K/hour.
-Korean attitude regarding foreigners and foreign cultures was strongly influenced by stereotypes, prejudices, etc. This may have just been the countryside, but when I went to visit Seoul, I found most of the general public minimally interested in 'everything foreign.'
-In my opinion, Koreans behaved in a rather rough around the edges manner, but tend to be very loyal once they come to know and accept you.
-There is still a lot of 'social discomfort' regarding Korean/foreign couples. My girlfriend at the time was Korean, and we always got nasty looks/inappropriate comments for simple things like walking down the street together, speaking quietly in English in cafes, or sitting next to each other on the train. I tried to kiss her once in public and she freaked....
-Korean language is a bit harder to pick up, and most Koreans seemed impatient in understanding my limited, beginner attempts to make heads or tails of the language. Writing in Hangul was an immense advantage.

Japan:

-Teaching experience was with JET both in the countryside and a mid-size city of 500k+. I also taught at a conversation school for 6 months in Osaka. JET was the best deal in Asia financially. Free housing (SMALL), $3,000 US/month, fair holidays and time off for cultural events/teacher conferences.
-Japanese co-teachers were a mixed bag. Many didn't speak English well and were rather xenophobic or indifferent to English learning other than high school and university entrance exams. There was less room for improvisation and creativity in the classroom. General attitude was to stick to the textbook, no matter how irrelevant and archaic.
-Rural kids were very polite but unmotivated. Urban kids were very savvy, if not very academic. Many picked up street English from God knows where and adult manga....
-Adult conversation school was very corporate and professional, although there was distinct segregation between the foreign and Japanese instructors. Pay was minimal at $2,500/month. After JET, not a pleasant experience.
-Japanese culture is more accessible compared to Korean culture. There are schools, academies, community centers where language, art, athletics, music, etc. are available. Reasonable fees for everything. I took taiko for some time, and while language was a challenge at times, the class was happy to include me. I took Japanese classes at a local community center with a ton of Koreans, Chinese, and Filipinos. I learned at a slower rate, but otherwise was a positive experience. My friend took Akido and loved it.
-Japanese, although typically less sincere than Koreans, are still centuries ahead in terms of politeness and formality. They may not always mean it, but they know when and how to say the right thing at the right time.
-Japan is twice as expensive. Internal travel, albeit easy, diverse, and fun, can get pricey. Going out is pricey. Everything except eating at home and drinking the tea in the teacher's room is pricey.
-Japan has about a 20-30 year progressive curve on international relations. I had a Japanese girlfriend for more than a year, and sometimes strangers made sarcastic comments, it was usually in jest or indifference. I rarely encountered anybody hostile towards me and my Japanese woman, except when we tried to sneak into public onsen together.
-The Japanese don't cheat as aggregiously as the Koreans. They're more subtle and refined in how they will influence your behavior and direct an outcome to their advantage. Koreans always negotiated like a bull in Pamplona. Get out of the way or het a horn in the ass.

[pkang0202]

[Dukey77777]

[twg]

[Oreovictim]

Let's get to the fun part: Korean vs. Japanese women.

Or do they pretty much look the same and act the same?

[TBirdMG]

D -

1) Yeah, for relationships and otherwise socially, Japan was soooo much easier. Many younger and even middle aged Japanese have this perception of foreigners as being weird in a good way (i.e. genki kowai), whereas in Korea, they are seen as weird in a threatening way.....In terms of pursuing a relationship in Korea, I would imagine you're safe in Seoul, Pusan (I REFUSE to spell it Busan!), you're much better off.

2) As for saving, you'll earn more in Japan, but save more in Korea. My privates covered vacations, and so I managed to bank 75% of my salary in Korea. In Japan, utilities, transportation, and other daily living costs cut into my savings....about 1/2 my salary. Either way, I was putting away 15K annually in both situations, but I had an easier/more pleasant time going out to eat, out to entertainment, pubs, movies etc. in Korea. In Japan, I had to be very disciplined about seeking out budget activities.

Night in Seoul (WON): Subway: 3000, Food: 10000, Drinks: 12000, Other: 10000. Total = 35000, or $35.
Night in Osaka (YEN): Subway: 1300, Food: 1500, Drinks: 2000, Other: 1500. Total = 6300, or $60.

3) As for public school gigs in Japan, the best way to go is JET, although it doesn't guarantee you a geographic assignment. 2/3 of the teachers end up in small or middle size cities, with a few in the REAL boondocks, and a handful in legitimate metropoli. JET has only one annual intake, and you have to do an in-person interview in Japan or your home country.
In order to reduce costs, some provincial public schools circumvent JET and hire directly, although you usually need to be in Japan to find these gigs. As well, private MS and HS hire, but they are usually by word of mouth/hand me down gigs.
Do a Google search for Ohayo sensei newsletter for ESL teachers to get an idea of what is available. Honestly, it takes a year in-country to get your feet wet and find the better jobs.
And granted, the vast majority of eikawa (conversation) schools are similar to Korean hakwons....low pay, high hours, and mediocre treatment.

[TBirdMG]

The Difference: Korean women complain in public, Japanese women complain at home.
The Same: They both moan.

The Difference: Korean women tend to have wider jaws, broader shoulders, and damn big calf muscles. They also wear too much make up for my taste.

Japanese women tend to have smaller frames and their fashion sense is questionable. It's so hard to find a Japanese woman who dresses in a classy, timeless sense.

The Same: funny half heels that they really don't know how to walk in.

[Sadebugo1]

Not much I can add to what's already been said except to add another vote for Japan.

Social Life: The winner is Japan hands down.

Work Environment: In my experience, much more professional in Japan

I can't really comment on cost of living since I was subsidised and didn't have to worry about it.

I think the deciding factor for me is just your everyday life. In Japan, I was able to take part in a variety of activities. In Korea, I sometimes didn't want to leave the apartment for fear of being mocked or verbally abused. Perhaps others had a better experience in Korea than I did.

Sadebugo
Djibouti, Horn of Africa
http://travldawrld.blogspot.com/

[poohbear]

[TECO]

Yokoso Japan!
Listen to the music at the 2:00 minute mark with the Shinkansen coming at the centre of the screen - it starts to rock with that koto!

Korea Sparkling

[sonicmatt]

so as far as work conditions and living japan is better. what kind of visa requirements are there with japan, is it like korea used to be. and going out to eat and partying is alot cheaper in korea, right?

[jadarite]

If you want to work in Japan, get a full-time job. Part-time juggling is not worth it.

[Oreovictim]