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| What do you think of Islam? |
| Islam is nice. |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
| Islam is not nice. |
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100% |
[ 1 ] |
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| Total Votes : 1 |
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mateomiguel
Joined: 16 May 2005
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 Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:58 pm Post subject: Baptism deliberate, provocative, triumphalist tool |
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I believe that Islam is not nice. In support of this belief, I present not the past 35 years of history, but a single story that happened this week.
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Scholar denounces Muslim baptism
A Muslim scholar involved in high-level dialogue with the Vatican has denounced the Pope's baptism on Saturday of a prominent Italian Muslim convert.
Aref Ali Nayed, the head of Jordan's Royal Islamic Strategic Studies Centre, called the baptism of journalist Magdi Allam a deliberate and provocative act. The Vatican has not yet commented, but its official newspaper said the gesture aimed to promote religious freedom.
The Pope traditionally baptises adult converts to Catholicism on Easter eve.
Mr Allam'a invitation to the ceremony, which took place in St Peter's Basilica, was however kept secret by the Vatican, until just before the Easter vigil mass.
The Egyptian-born Italian TV and newspaper commentator has been an outspoken critic of Islamist militancy and a strong supporter of Israel.
He says such controversial views and his conversion to Christianity have provoked threats on his life, and he is now protected by a police escort.
'Triumphalist tool'
In a stinging rebuke of Saturday's televised ceremony, Mr Nayed denounced what he called "the Vatican's deliberate and provocative act of baptising Allam on such a special occasion and in such a spectacular way".
"It is sad that the intimate and personal act of a religious conversion is made into a triumphalist tool for scoring points," he said in a written statement.
Mr Nayed said Pope Benedict XVI's actions came "at a most unfortunate time when sincere Muslims and Catholics are working very hard to mend ruptures between the two communities".
The Jordanian scholar has been at the forefront of an initiative gathering more than 130 Muslim scholars who recently wrote to the Pope and other Christian leaders calling for greater dialogue and good will between Muslims and Christians.
The Vatican has also been keen to repair relations with moderate Muslims, particularly after the crisis caused by a speech the Pope gave in Germany in 2006, in which he appeared to associate Islam with violence.
But Mr Nayed added that despite the Vatican's actions, the initiative for dialogue to improve relations would continue.
"Our basis for dialogue is not a tit-for-tat logic of 'reciprocity' but a compassionate theology of mending," he wrote.
The Vatican has not yet commented on the criticism, but its official newspaper L'Osservatore Romano on Tuesday denied that the ceremony had been intentionally inflammatory, noting that it had not been publicised in advance.
The newspaper wrote that the baptism had been a papal "gesture" without hostile intentions aimed at stressing "in a gentle and clear way, religious freedom". |
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ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Islam to Catholicism, like jumping from a burning ship onto a sinking one. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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People are free to change religions of course, and if Muslims don't like it when someone leaves the fold, they should maybe ask themselves what that person found in the new faith that he wasn't getting in Islam.
Now, having said that, given the high profile of the convert, this particular baptism is pretty much the equivalent of making out with your girlfriend while seated next to her old boyfriend in a movie theatre. The guy is known in the Muslim world for saying a lot of controversial things, and as such, the Pope certainly must have foreseen that a papal baptism, held at the Vatican, would recieve wide media coverage, and would be viewed in the context of the convert's previous statements.
If the Pope wants to engage in a flame war with Islam, that's his right. I'm just not really buying it when he then turns around and wonders how anyone could interpret this as anything but an innocent recpetion into the faith. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
People are free to change religions of course, and if Muslims don't like it when someone leaves the fold, they should maybe ask themselves what that person found in the new faith that he wasn't getting in Islam.
Now, having said that, given the high profile of the convert, this particular baptism is pretty much the equivalent of making out with your girlfriend while seated next to her old boyfriend in a movie theatre. The guy is known in the Muslim world for saying a lot of controversial things, and as such, the Pope certainly must have foreseen that a papal baptism, held at the Vatican, would recieve wide media coverage, and would be viewed in the context of the convert's previous statements.
If the Pope wants to engage in a flame war with Islam, that's his right. I'm just not really buying it when he then turns around and wonders how anyone could interpret this as anything but an innocent recpetion into the faith. |
Why did the pope have to baptize this fellow? I think the Jordanian scholar was being extremely modern and diplomatic with his language and seems rather progressive. A regular priest could have baptized that Egyptian Italian at a local parish. I agree that it is not hard for people to see this as not an insensitive act. It is not the fact the guy got baptized. It was the high profile way. Also, in my opinion, this is major ego by the pope, and it is not befitting of the church. I know John Paul II would not have done that, because he had better judgement, I think. I admired John Paul II, and I liked the words "John Paul II, I love you". He was a good pope. I hope this current pope will work on his PR. Didn't he also upset some Native Americans in Mexico last year? I don't see what's wrong with objecting to the pope's act, though I think people should get baptized if they want to swim in the Ganges for all I care.
By the way, the poll above is very flawed. Why can't there be more choices? I mean it's simply a black-and-white poll. How about a poll that actually gives us more choices? What are your views on other religions say Hinduism, Buddhism, Orthodox Judaism, Catholicism, Mateo?
You are just simply trying to re-inforce your own ideas as evidenced by the poll rather than knowing what we think... |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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| By the way, the poll above is very flawed. Why can't there be more choices? |
Especially given that there really isn't anything "not nice" about the Muslim reaction to the baptism, as represented in the article. As you said, the Jordanian commentator sounds very reasonable. |
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canuckistan
Mod Team
Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Location: Training future GS competitors.....
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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| I thought it was inappropriate to publicize it so loudly. It became a political statement and I don't believe it was one intended to provoke smiles. |
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