|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
|
 Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 3:01 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Wouldn't forensic anthropologists be able to look at the image on the shroud and determine if it had the sort of features that we would expect to see on a 1st Century Jewish man in the middle east? If it didn't have those features, that would pretty much prove it to be a hoax. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Well a normal person of any ethnicity wouldn't leave such an image. If this was taken from a person it would be more smudged and indistinguishable.
Has it been shown that it isn't most likely either a rubbing or a painting? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Funkdafied wrote: |
| Quote: |
| What do you think of the claims of statues of Jesus and also the Virgin Mary crying blood? |
I think the claims are nonsense. People who desperately want to see confirmations of thier faith will go to great lengths of self delusion to comfort themselves. |
Indeed. Penn & Teller can make a statue or painting cry blood. It's rather easy too. When people aren't looking (called distraction in the magic biz) you simply dip your hand in your hidden blood load and splash the blood on the statue. Behold. It's crying tears of blood. |
This isn't limited to Christ and Mary. Remember Vishnu's thirst for milk? South Park covered this, time to move on.
http://www.southparkzone.com/episode.php?vid=914 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
the_beaver
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ED209 wrote: |
Well a normal person of any ethnicity wouldn't leave such an image. If this was taken from a person it would be more smudged and indistinguishable.
Has it been shown that it isn't most likely either a rubbing or a painting? |
Actually, because a shroud would hang down over a body with, in this case, the nose being the highest point, the outline would be distorted like a funhouse mirror. In order to get a true image like the one one on the shroud (and assuming, of course, that only surface features would remain on the cloth rather than, say, intestinal tracts and other features which would leave their own image mixed in with the original surface features giving us a human shape in outline but solid colored fill inside) the cloth would have to have been pulled taut like a canvas. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
stevemcgarrett
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 8:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
To (most) of the posters responding:
Judging by the superficiality and ad hominem level of the responses, I'm guessing most of you still haven't bothered to view the video (6 segments) but feel confident--or rather arrogant--enough to pass judgment on my observations. If that isn't narrow-minded and juvenile, I don't know what is.
The only ones who are blinded by their beliefs are the atheists on this board who think they've seen and heard all the arguments whether they actually have or not, but still feel entitled to belittle those of us open to the possibilities.
I never said that I'm convinced the Shroud of Turin is authetic, nor did I imply that I needed it to vindicate my faith in Christianity. But most of you just keep right on putting words in my mouth while putting your feet in your own.
stillnotking:
| Quote: |
| Otherwise, you're just cherry-picking, seeking out evidence that confirms your beliefs without giving equal weight to contrary evidence. That's not faith, it's bias. Junior's approach is more intellectually consistent. |
I see no logical correlation between the Shroud investigation and what you're talking about. Please do illuminate me, oh, prince-in-waiting. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
|
| Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:03 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
The only ones who are blinded by their beliefs are the atheists on this board who think they've seen and heard all the arguments whether they actually have or not, but still feel entitled to belittle those of us open to the possibilities.
|
I find your comments to be very cynical.
I'm very open to the shroud been proved genuine(2000years old) but like the Christians who posted here, I find it irrelevant to the existence or non-existence of Christ. The authenticity of the cloth can be argued as much amongst Christians as between them and atheists. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 6:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
| stevemcgarrett wrote: |
To (most) of the posters responding:
Judging by the superficiality and ad hominem level of the responses, I'm guessing most of you still haven't bothered to view the video (6 segments) but feel confident--or rather arrogant--enough to pass judgment on my observations. If that isn't narrow-minded and juvenile, I don't know what is.
The only ones who are blinded by their beliefs are the atheists on this board who think they've seen and heard all the arguments whether they actually have or not, but still feel entitled to belittle those of us open to the possibilities.
I never said that I'm convinced the Shroud of Turin is authetic, nor did I imply that I needed it to vindicate my faith in Christianity. But most of you just keep right on putting words in my mouth while putting your feet in your own.
stillnotking:
| Quote: |
| Otherwise, you're just cherry-picking, seeking out evidence that confirms your beliefs without giving equal weight to contrary evidence. That's not faith, it's bias. Junior's approach is more intellectually consistent. |
I see no logical correlation between the Shroud investigation and what you're talking about. Please do illuminate me, oh, prince-in-waiting. |
Your scholarship is poor. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Funkdafied
Joined: 04 Nov 2007
Location: In Da House
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 6:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| I watched the first two parts and simply can't go on. So far there has been nothing about why it might not be a fake. The angle they are going on is that it is difficult to theorise HOW the forger did it. But not being able to know exactly how it was done is absolutely NOT proof that it is authentic. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Funkdafied wrote: |
| I watched the first two parts and simply can't go on. So far there has been nothing about why it might not be a fake. The angle they are going on is that it is difficult to theorise HOW the forger did it. But not being able to know exactly how it was done is absolutely NOT proof that it is authentic. |
I've seen many shroud "documentaries". This is why I was asking SM what HE found compelling because, like you, I'm pretty sure I'd find nothing compelling.
Now, Steve-o. You've already made one logical fallacy earlier: since no one can explain how the shroud was made, that lends evidence to its authenticity. Even if the first part is true (it's not, as my links demonstrate), it's the argument from ignorance fallacy.
So maybe now you'd like to entertain us with what YOU find compelling evidence? It really, really, matters not whether it's in a video or not. For a so called professor, it's rather disturbing you can't articulate a single compelling point you found in the documentary, but you run for cover claiming "until you view this film or read this mound of documentation, I can't even be bothered to summarize it."
Real researchers simply don't dump their published papers on someone's desk and say "that's my argument." Real researchers and academics first summarize their arguments. The onus is then on the other side to agree or disagree with the arguments. If the person disagrees, then they supply evidence why they think the claim is false. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
