Korean Job Discussion Forums

[abedefduf]

its sounding more and more on here like signing with a hakwon = inevitable doom

[PRagic]

Working at a hakwon is like working for a fast food joint; they are the McDonald's, Burger King, and KFCs of the education market in Korea.

Just ask yourself some questions:

So when you need a job, you need something to put on your resume, and you're not qualified to do much, where do you go?

If you continue working at a fast food place, your chances of ever making a decent living or having any respect are?

If you never get any significant increases in salary, and never gain any leverage against your employer because there are a ton of people waiting to take your job and no qualifications are necessary, you feel?

If the only way 'up' you find is to be a manager of your KFC or McDonald's, your career is?

As we all know, there is no shame in working at a fast food joint at some point. Everyone needs to get that first dose of experience somewhere. The danger is in staying, and in thinking that you have a real job if you do.

[mnhnhyouh]

I worked in a great hagwon in Mok Dong. run by a gyopo. The concept was to have small classes, 6 or less. The students would come for two classes a day, one with a K teacher and one with foreign teacher. They would come 5 times a week and on top of their 10 contact hours, they should do about 10 hours of homework.

The kids had pretty good English after a year or two of this.

The wongjangnim had taught for many years and understood what it was like. He was good to work for. I would be there again but wanted to try something different, so went to the public school system.

h

[Zaria32]

PRagic expresses the negativity of Dave's very well.

It's hardly the whole story. Yes, there are horrible things that can happen in hogwons...and just as horrible things happen in public schools, although they tend to be different things...such as the teacher made to sit alone in an unheated, turned off electricity building during (cold) winter break, because the K teachers in the school would have been outraged if she had received the same winter break/vacation that they did.

Early terminations to avoid severance pay, refusal to allow sick days to be taken when ill, insults from K teachers (this happens much more in public schools than hogwons) failure/refusal to reimburse/pay airfare, sudden refusal to honor contract when you arrive in Korea if they don't like the way you look - these things happen in public schools as well as hogwons.

Many of us...who HAVE held, and WILL hold jobs many rungs higher than McDonalds, work very happily in hogwons.

This does NOT mean that some people have not had genuinely awful experiences with hogwons. And some have had the same with public schools.

Pays to be careful and do your homework...

[kprrok]

I love my hagwons. I work in two right now and they're both great. My morning job has a great boss who treats me well and is good to work for. Granted, the curriculum at the school needs fixing, but he's open to my suggestions and wants to work together to make it better.

My afternoon school is even better. The owner has just opened a new school more for elementary vs. his old one for middle and high schoolers. He hired me and another teacher with lots of experience so we could come in and do everything right from the start. I'm learning lots about what it takes to start a hagwon and loving it. He's a great boss who fully understands that to make money, he has to spend it first.

Hagwons are not all bad. They're not like McD's or KFC back home. Some are terrible, some are great. You just gotta do your homework and find a good one.

I will never work in a public school because I don't like them. I've had lots of friends work in them and I've heard all about them. No thanks, I'll stick to my good hagwon with classes of about 6 or 8 students.

KPRROK

[PRagic]

Zaria32,

You have to admit that the comparison works. Yes, some people who have worked better jobs in education do go back to hakwons. Kevin Spacy's character in American Beauty went back to a fast food joint when he decided to not worry about money and wanted no more responsibility.

I'm not being negative, I'm being honest. Even if someone does get a decent hakwon job, it's just that. So to the OP, I say come on over for a year or two. Do your homework first, and don't expect too much. Enjoy your free time, and don't take your job too seriously. Just make sure the burgers go with the right buns. No experience necessary. You can do it.

[abedefduf]

thanks for the replies.
PRagic, im not talking about doing that for the rest of my life. im speaking as a noob still in the states trying to decide whether or not i should go with a hogwon for a first teaching job.
i dont really plan on doing this for more than a year..im not really concerned with the long term growth potential lol

[PRagic]

Great, then my posts were right on the money in terms of what you should know. Hakwons can be a good in-and-out way of living abroad for a year or two.

Talk to teachers at a prospective school.

Do your homework and find a big, decent hakwon. Seoul has a lot going on, and so does Pusan, albeit to a lesser extent. If you're not a city peron, and don't want to experience a big city, look elsewhere, but stay away from the mom and pop hakwon operations. Also, if you go to Seoul or Pusan, know that these are big cities. Nothing annoys me more than nature must-haves taking a job in a city with the highest population density in Asia, and then griping continuously about how there is no nature.

Avoid split shifts if possible; they are one quick way to sour your yearlong experience.

If you want to have some fun, and especially if you weren't an education major, I strongly suggest teaching adults. Teaching kids at hakwons means pleasing mommy and babysitting jr. This often entails additional stress, and additional job responsibilities (e.g. grading homework and/or writing progress reports). Why bother for the same money? Adults take you out drinking, Jr.'s mommy just makes your life miserable. No brainer.

Most of all, when your boss tells you that you are now a professional teacher, just smile and agree. Don't take it too seriously. It's educatianment, and you'll be here short-term. They know right well that they're not hiring a professional teacher, and that they aren't running a real school. Have fun, don't sweat the little stuff, and you'll have a great stay in Korea.

It's all about perspective.

Sounds like you have a great attitude from the get go. Let us know how things work out if and when you get here. Cheers, P.R.

[Ilsanman]

I love working at my school. Just the hours are too long. I'm on hourly pay so I make a bundle.

[PRagic]

As long as they're paying you at least 5 million, sounds like you have a good gig. Liking what you do is important.

[WoBW]

I worked in three hagwons before.

First one didn't screw me out of money, pension, healthcare or any horror story like that. The management did treat us like naughty kids, even though we were older than most of them. Oh, and most of the 'management' who treated us this way had never taught before.

Second one was cool. No hassles and they just left me alone to get on with my job.

Third one was great. Great atmosphere, my own room, and only taught 12 hours a week because I had other well defined admin duties to perform. Management were all cool and treated me well. I got to choose the books, write some of my own material and generally adjust what and how I taught as I saw fit. No interference from the management in this respect.

Just be careful, they're not all bad.

[DrTommyTom]

love my hagwon...just do your research...sign directly with the school and don't negotiate with a recruiter...they can piss off....it also helps that my hagwon is run by a American...haha...

[Yu_Bum_suk]

[Suwon23]

[Katchafire]

I spent my first year here working at a 'Wonderland' hagwon in Bundang. I LOVED it. I taught Kindergarten (6/7 yr olds) in the morning ... and Elementary kids in the afternoon. My Kindy kids, could start and hold a decent conversation in English.
Now I am 7 months into Public School .. and in general .. the conversation level here rarely goes further than "Hihowareyoui'mfinethankyou" .. In ONE breath.
Public Elementary School (In my experience so far) has less hours, a bit more pay, more holidays .... but lessons are repetitive, VERY basic, up to 30 kids in a class ... and most stare at you blankly when you ask them what Day it is. I dont in any way, feel as though I have worked my way UP into a Public School job at all. I MISS the ability level that those Kindergaten kids had.
Hagwon (again, in MY experience) .. I could almost have full conversations with most of my kindergarten kids ... I could have a joke with them and they would understand it.
Bottom line is .. as it's been said MANY times ... there are GREAT Hagwons .... and there are crappy ones ... Just as there are great or crappy Public Schools/ Universities. As other posters have said .. just do your homework. There are positives and negatives to all jobs.