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Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
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PGF
Joined: 27 Nov 2006
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 Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:16 am Post subject: |
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| crescent wrote: |
| www.expatkorea.com |
thanks for the link...
*bump*
Welcome to eslcafe!
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Whether you are a current, former or future Korean expat, you're welcome in our community forum! Registered forum users can use live chat, play flash games, play poker with other users in the casino, post photos to the gallery, and use many other interactive features within the website. Registration is simple and free. We won't ask you to write an essay to join, we don't care about your home phone number and address, and we don't accept ad revenue from unscrupulous Hagwons or recruiters. As a matter of fact, this website is 100% commercial advertisement free. |
sounds nice-e |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:52 am Post subject: |
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| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
| What is the rationale behind the filter anyway? I've asked before and never had an answer. |
I can't explain why they beep the ones they do in English, but in order to beep swears in Hangul, the software would have to recognize them, and it currently doesn't.
Can't imagine it would be that challenging to add -sek*i and -ny*n to the filter, though -n*m could present problems.
since Expats is coming up a fair bit in this thread, I might as well say it. I mod there, and our modding styles are fairly different,
BUT
if you're thinking of coming over to troll or start the same three threads that are always going here, might as well stay put. We tolerate far less ass-hattery there, outside of fight club at any rate. |
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Poktanju
Mod Team
Joined: 15 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
| Poktanju wrote: |
| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
| Poktanju wrote: |
Please let us know which error you are getting regarding the swear filter. We've been consulting with Dave on working out the kinks on that. Last I've seen it's almost back to normal (as of a 2-3 weeks ago).
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Out of curiosity, what exactly would Dave have to say about problems with the swear filter? I'm guessing it's something along the lines of "Yeah, yeah, deal with it." |
His responses to our requests to add/remove swears have amounted to 'Done. Cheers, Dave.' The lingering problems stem from us wanting to add some new words on account of filter dodges. But the filter is buggy, so we asked him to remove the new list of additions. But perhaps he missed some and also accidentantly took out some needed ones. We'll follow-up with him to be sure. |
As far as I'm concerned, the only words that possibly need to be banned are Korean swears. We're all adults--the English swears are all pretty ineffectual now. If I want to be offensive I can do it without using any censored words. What is the rationale behind the filter anyway? I've asked before and never had an answer. |
Well, all due respect to other Korean boards, but its easy to forget the difference in managing boards that have the same 30-40 regular members posting over and over, versus something like this where we seem to have 100+ daily regulars, even more who are infrequently on every other week or longer, and an even greater number who read much more than post, where we can often see 100+ registered and unregistered readers online at any given moment. Are all those active and passive users reading and commenting in threads like this, which would help ascertain the overall board sentiment towards modding and swear filters? Of course, not.
And of those who have followed the trivialities of intra-board discussions, there's really not much board-wide interest in that kind of drama, when looking at the same usernames that can always be seen popping up in these threads. Does that mean that we do not consider the interests of smaller cliques here who cross-post on any (or in many cases, all) of the alternative boards? Of course not.
But we need to consider the opinions not just of those who are so active online that they feel compelled to pick out the color of the drapes of their online homes, as well as the ones who are just drop-in readers who don't get too overly wound up with internet drama and the weiner-measuring contests, however do find offence when they read certain colorful remarks. And we get these comments from them via post report. So we need to try to strike a balance between the hardcore groups and the passive readers. No one will ever be happy and almost everything we do is never cut-and-dried. So the best that we can hope for is finding balance.
Steering this back to the original intention of the OP, are there any more questions or concerns about modding or recent wrinkles that may be worth discussing, but have yet to be addressed? |
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Bramble
Joined: 26 Jan 2007
Location: National treasures need homes
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| Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| peppermint wrote: |
| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
| What is the rationale behind the filter anyway? I've asked before and never had an answer. |
I can't explain why they beep the ones they do in English, but in order to beep swears in Hangul, the software would have to recognize them, and it currently doesn't.
Can't imagine it would be that challenging to add -sek*i and -ny*n to the filter, though -n*m could present problems.
since Expats is coming up a fair bit in this thread, I might as well say it. I mod there, and our modding styles are fairly different,
BUT
if you're thinking of coming over to troll or start the same three threads that are always going here, might as well stay put. We tolerate far less ass-hattery there, outside of fight club at any rate. |
You tolerated some pretty nasty asshats a few months ago. |
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redredwine
Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Location: John 15-13
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 12:12 am Post subject: |
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| peppi is a wonderful mod at that other Expatsite. |
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SuperFly
Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Location: In the doghouse
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 3:52 am Post subject: |
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| Bramble wrote: |
You tolerated some pretty nasty asshats a few months ago. |
You should know, you're the biggest asshat expats ever banned. |
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bellum99
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Location: don't need to know
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:11 am Post subject: |
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I have never been banned...and I have deserved it. I think the mods are usually okay. If I was banned then I would just get a new name. I am not so attached to this one, anyway. Why do people care so much about their rep, name and status on this board anyway?
For the record: I hate you all equally. Every one is an asshat! |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:14 am Post subject: |
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| bellum99 wrote: |
I have never been banned...and I have deserved it. I think the mods are usually okay. If I was banned then I would just get a new name. I am not so attached to this one, anyway. Why do people care so much about their rep, name and status on this board anyway?
For the record: I hate you all equally. Every one is an asshat! |
I think you are an asshat for not hating me more than other people. Why not? What haven't I done wrong? |
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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:19 am Post subject: |
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| Poktanju wrote: |
Trolls and whining children should be treated like adults?
/jots down advice. |
No. But those who supposedly represent a "commercial enterprise" should act like adults. I always laugh when posts are deleted with the explanation that Dave's is a commercial enterprise...blah, blah blah. Some mods seem not to appreciate this as they belittle patrons of this commercial enterprise however. While I recognize that many of the deleted posts are not in the best interest of Dave's from a financial perspective, I am waiting for the day when Dave wakes up to the realization that the condescending attitudes of some of the mods isn't contributing anything to the bottom line either.
Some lessons are best learned the hard way I guess. |
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anyway
Joined: 22 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:47 am Post subject: |
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| Poktanju wrote: |
As for our occassional responses of 'we don't know what happened to it', I think its pretty obvious that we are being sincere, given that really tame threads would vanish such as 'where do I catch a bus to Sokcho' and we'd shrug our shoulders, whereas we'd have no problems in saying this or that flame thread was pulled due to XYZ reason citing the TOS.
Anyways, to sum up, you can see by the above links that we do encourage and are not afraid of suggestions on how to improve, if they are legitimately constructive criticisms. But these troll outbreaks get treated like other redundant troll outbreaks of other subject matter. If a user has a legit concern over the whereabouts of their thread, we ask to PM one of us. In the event that you get no PM response after a few days, sure, post a thread to get our attention and we'll look into it. |
Horse Hockey! |
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Poktanju
Mod Team
Joined: 15 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 7:45 am Post subject: |
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| Join Me wrote: |
| Poktanju wrote: |
Trolls and whining children should be treated like adults?
/jots down advice. |
No. But those who supposedly represent a "commercial enterprise" should act like adults. I always laugh when posts are deleted with the explanation that Dave's is a commercial enterprise...blah, blah blah. Some mods seem not to appreciate this as they belittle patrons of this commercial enterprise however. While I recognize that many of the deleted posts are not in the best interest of Dave's from a financial perspective, I am waiting for the day when Dave wakes up to the realization that the condescending attitudes of some of the mods isn't contributing anything to the bottom line either.
Some lessons are best learned the hard way I guess. |
In all sincerity, can you please let me know (even if you send me a PM) of any incident where a mod has told you that something was recently deleted due to this place being a commercial enterprise? I'm not trying to sound like a smartass about that, so please don't misread my intentions. Thx.
As for the other stuff regarding hurt feelings, no, we're not push-overs when it comes to dealing with asshats and trolls. Please don't mistake this place for a customer service environment where we are required to sport perma-grins and do chants of 'customer is always right!'. We're regular users here who also volunteer our time to ensure that the pockets of adult-looking children don't spoil the things that keep you coming back every day.
As for if we do Dave's bidding on pulling stuff that is 'harmful' to his business, once again, we're volunteers. Ask past mods, if you don't believe me. Lord knows that there are enough ex-mods here and on Expats. They'll tell you the same thing. We don't see a dime, nor does Dave whisper in our ears to pull this or that. Dave has his own mod handle. Whether he gets complaint emails and comes in and mods something without telling us, I could care less. It's his board. Not sure why anyone else should care so much, either. We're just talking about words that will be on page 2 of the thread list within a few days.
But whether or not he actually does mod stuff out of concern for his money, take a moment to actually put some thought into that. I'm pretty sure that after 10 years of seeing all sorts of crap in his forums and that his job boards seem to keep getting more ads every year (take a look at the site in archive.org, if you want to fact check me on that), that he's not overly fixated on micro-managing forum content.
We can go on and on and cook up more mod conspiracies and paranoid assumptions. But at the end of the day, we volunteer, because we'd like to see the community not go down the tank. And based on our perspectives, the feedback in post reports, and dealings with a large cross-section of users, the majority also likes it here, too, but are not so wound up over their precious words and what mods are up to, like the smaller contingent of users who focus so much on these things.
Whether this user or that doesn't believe us and would rather subscribe to paranoia or is upset that we often need to publicly slap some trolls upside the head, oh well. It wouldn't be Daves without you.  |
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samd
Joined: 03 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| Poktanju wrote: |
| Join Me wrote: |
| Poktanju wrote: |
Trolls and whining children should be treated like adults?
/jots down advice. |
No. But those who supposedly represent a "commercial enterprise" should act like adults. I always laugh when posts are deleted with the explanation that Dave's is a commercial enterprise...blah, blah blah. Some mods seem not to appreciate this as they belittle patrons of this commercial enterprise however. While I recognize that many of the deleted posts are not in the best interest of Dave's from a financial perspective, I am waiting for the day when Dave wakes up to the realization that the condescending attitudes of some of the mods isn't contributing anything to the bottom line either.
Some lessons are best learned the hard way I guess. |
In all sincerity, can you please let me know (even if you send me a PM) of any incident where a mod has told you that something was recently deleted due to this place being a commercial enterprise? I'm not trying to sound like a smartass about that, so please don't misread my intentions. Thx.
As for the other stuff regarding hurt feelings, no, we're not push-overs when it comes to dealing with asshats and trolls. Please don't mistake this place for a customer service environment where we are required to sport perma-grins and do chants of 'customer is always right!'. We're regular users here who also volunteer our time to ensure that the pockets of adult-looking children don't spoil the things that keep you coming back every day.
As for if we do Dave's bidding on pulling stuff that is 'harmful' to his business, once again, we're volunteers. Ask past mods, if you don't believe me. Lord knows that there are enough ex-mods here and on Expats. They'll tell you the same thing. We don't see a dime, nor does Dave whisper in our ears to pull this or that. Dave has his own mod handle. Whether he gets complaint emails and comes in and mods something without telling us, I could care less. It's his board. Not sure why anyone else should care so much, either. We're just talking about words that will be on page 2 of the thread list within a few days.
But whether or not he actually does mod stuff out of concern for his money, take a moment to actually put some thought into that. I'm pretty sure that after 10 years of seeing all sorts of crap in his forums and that his job boards seem to keep getting more ads every year (take a look at the site in archive.org, if you want to fact check me on that), that he's not overly fixated on micro-managing forum content.
We can go on and on and cook up more mod conspiracies and paranoid assumptions. But at the end of the day, we volunteer, because we'd like to see the community not go down the tank. And based on our perspectives, the feedback in post reports, and dealings with a large cross-section of users, the majority also likes it here, too, but are not so wound up over their precious words and what mods are up to, like the smaller contingent of users who focus so much on these things.
Whether this user or that doesn't believe us and would rather subscribe to paranoia or is upset that we often need to publicly slap some trolls upside the head, oh well. It wouldn't be Daves without you. |
Nice post.
You mods are appreciated, but as always, you only hear from us when we're pissed off. Sorry. |
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asylum seeker
Joined: 22 Jul 2007
Location: On your computer screen.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:57 am Post subject: |
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| This thread really surprised me. Dave's ESL is one of the most leniently moderated forums I've ever seen. People get away with making racist posts here all the time and NEVER seem to get banned. One poster was using the word 'chink' in a thread the other day and it was allowed to remain. I personally think that there should be tighter rules to prevent meaningless race-baiting as it seems several people who post here are really just trying to stir up hatred. |
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Join Me
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Poktanju wrote: |
| Join Me wrote: |
| Poktanju wrote: |
Trolls and whining children should be treated like adults?
/jots down advice. |
No. But those who supposedly represent a "commercial enterprise" should act like adults. I always laugh when posts are deleted with the explanation that Dave's is a commercial enterprise...blah, blah blah. Some mods seem not to appreciate this as they belittle patrons of this commercial enterprise however. While I recognize that many of the deleted posts are not in the best interest of Dave's from a financial perspective, I am waiting for the day when Dave wakes up to the realization that the condescending attitudes of some of the mods isn't contributing anything to the bottom line either.
Some lessons are best learned the hard way I guess. |
In all sincerity, can you please let me know (even if you send me a PM) of any incident where a mod has told you that something was recently deleted due to this place being a commercial enterprise? I'm not trying to sound like a smartass about that, so please don't misread my intentions. Thx.
As for the other stuff regarding hurt feelings, no, we're not push-overs when it comes to dealing with asshats and trolls. Please don't mistake this place for a customer service environment where we are required to sport perma-grins and do chants of 'customer is always right!'. We're regular users here who also volunteer our time to ensure that the pockets of adult-looking children don't spoil the things that keep you coming back every day.
As for if we do Dave's bidding on pulling stuff that is 'harmful' to his business, once again, we're volunteers. Ask past mods, if you don't believe me. Lord knows that there are enough ex-mods here and on Expats. They'll tell you the same thing. We don't see a dime, nor does Dave whisper in our ears to pull this or that. Dave has his own mod handle. Whether he gets complaint emails and comes in and mods something without telling us, I could care less. It's his board. Not sure why anyone else should care so much, either. We're just talking about words that will be on page 2 of the thread list within a few days.
But whether or not he actually does mod stuff out of concern for his money, take a moment to actually put some thought into that. I'm pretty sure that after 10 years of seeing all sorts of crap in his forums and that his job boards seem to keep getting more ads every year (take a look at the site in archive.org, if you want to fact check me on that), that he's not overly fixated on micro-managing forum content.
We can go on and on and cook up more mod conspiracies and paranoid assumptions. But at the end of the day, we volunteer, because we'd like to see the community not go down the tank. And based on our perspectives, the feedback in post reports, and dealings with a large cross-section of users, the majority also likes it here, too, but are not so wound up over their precious words and what mods are up to, like the smaller contingent of users who focus so much on these things.
Whether this user or that doesn't believe us and would rather subscribe to paranoia or is upset that we often need to publicly slap some trolls upside the head, oh well. It wouldn't be Daves without you. |
Dude...you sound paranoid. There is no conspiracy to bring down the mods. |
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Poktanju
Mod Team
Joined: 15 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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I don't recall me nor anyone in this thread talking about a conspiracy to bring down the mods. If someone said that, then we'll mark it down as being another thing we can laugh at in the mod forum. Anyways, if you read my post it was more about debunking your conspiracy and baseless assumptive droppings that suggest that our mod decisions are influenced by site revenue.
If school owners from Korea, China, Japan, Poland, Spain, Thailand, Turkey, etc...who advertise here are so overly concerned about a needle-in-a-haystack forum comment in a thread that is quickly buried by endless new threads, then I worry for the teachers who have to work with such anal directors who put such silly, petty logic ahead of making business decisions.
Seriously, I have no problem with reading the mod and eslcafe conspiracies, but given how much free time some of you have, would it kill you to use some of that time to come up with something plausible? Why give up on yourself so easily?
As for other users comments about how we miss some racist stuff, yes, we're aware that some things like that get by us. There's a list of habitual offenders who we've been watching and are being asked to shape up or ship out. Much more easier to go after the source than keep having to mop up the BS they leave behind. |
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