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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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RJjr
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: Turning on a Lamp
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 Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 9:21 pm Post subject: |
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| As an American, I would like to apologize to South Korea for Nike acting like a bunch of pussies. |
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ryouga013
Joined: 14 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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| hack wrote: |
Regardless, now our Korean business agents no longer market this course in Korea although we still frequently get expressions of interest from Korean business people, so we quote them 50% more than anyone else and we still manage to fill a class with Koreans every couple of months but they have to sign a "no refund" waiver, pay the full tuition when booked and we spell out the details of acceptable and non acceptable behaviour in their contract. No Korean has ever asked me to explain those details any further as they just seem to accept them as something a stiff-azzed Westerner would ask of them.
I also find it interesting that 20-30% of our Japanese and Chinese students are female, but we have yet to have 1 female applicant from Korea. |
Good on you. After continual stupidity, oops, I meant to say inability to see that their behavior is assbackwards, dang, i can't get this out straight... after numerous occasions in which one group showed that it cannot work with others, including the teachers you took the initiative to show that if they are serious about entering a professional class that they must live up to the terms, regardless of how strict they are. If more and more people did this to the Korean business, maybe Koreans would get the drift (after about 10years) that their behavior is not acceptable by many other people.
How many Korean companies have female superiors? And how many would "waste" their time on training a woman that will be put out to pasture once she gets married or has a baby (as is still common practice)?
| PBRstreetgang21 wrote: |
| And lets not forget, Civilized Japan is still aborting fetuses if its a girl, and China is even worse. Korea is the only East Asian country where this (at least according to the NY Times) no longer occurs. |
hahaha where do you think they got the numbers? from Koreans. "Yes, yes, we don't do that anymore, only savages would do such a thing." **HA~GKRKRKGK *spit* {goes to beat wife who's pregnant with a girl so there is no "abortion."}
Sorry, but with the way Korea sees women and the hundreds of years of thinking they are worthless I cannot see modern Korea giving up that practice.
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
If Koreans were charging foreigners more simply because they are foreigners and a few foreigners have exhibited bad behaviour...you'd be leading the charge to demonize them.
Yet you have no qualms about charging Koreans more simply because they are Korean and a few Koreans have exhibited bad behaviour. |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| We initially put students from Korea, Singapore, China and Japan in the same class (usually 6-7) but had to stop this integrating of nationals after the Koreans continually questioned and ridiculed some Western standards such as sexism and working with women as equals in a business environment. Notwithstanding the past bad blood between Chinese and Japanese, we were able to keep them in the same class together and had no issues with the business |
Your answer is right here... Korean students were sent there to learn about Western culture and business ethic and continually fought against it, even breaking the law within the classroom. If this were people from the US or Canada going to Korea and doing the same, they should be charged extra as well AS LONG AS THERE IS A STRONG TENDENCY. It seems at this school it was a problem most of the time. |
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Scotticus
Joined: 18 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 10:24 pm Post subject: |
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| PBRstreetgang21 wrote: |
| If mature, calm, reserved, collected people were the most succesful, than the US would be run by Mormoms |
Wha... huh... uh?  |
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PBRstreetgang21
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Location: Orlando, FL--- serving as man's paean to medocrity since 1971!
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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but with the way Korea sees women and the hundreds of years of thinking they are worthless I cannot see modern Korea giving up that practice.
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I really think you are reading WAY over generalizing to the point hysteria with that comment. Women in Korea, and Asian societies in general have alsways occuppied a lower status yes. There is zero argument there. However, I dont think there are many societies where the status and the thoughts on women are advancing more than in Korea. Im not saying Korea treats women the way we in the West have come to see they should be treated, however I think Korea is moving in that direction far faster than its far wealthier neighbor to the East.
Also I hardly think the NY Time just said "Oh ok...we'll take it" without at least some fact checking.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/23/world/asia/23skorea.html?_r=1&scp=5&sq=korean+women&st=nyt&oref=slogin
I think its important to have perspective on this issue. This is a country where a household is run by woman. A man is expected to hand over his paycheck to her and put the power of the purse in HER hands. Women occupy far more political power in Korean that in China, Japan, or many other asian nations. Are they lagging in the business world? Yes, but then again they are lagging in the business world in the States too.
Too say that modern day Korean society doesnt value women and sees them as worthless is a absolutely ridiculous, infamaltory, and most importantly IGNORANT statement to make. What family in South Korea doesnt want to see their daughter succeed and do well? What family wouldn't grieve if they lost her, or if she fell into trouble?
If women were worthless I dont think Lee Myung Bak woild be cursing the existence of Park Geun hye right now.
And I wouldnt be suprised if she ends up taking the presidency when he's out the door. Women may be behind the finish line here....but they are in the fast lane to equality compared to China or Japan. |
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ryouga013
Joined: 14 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 12:39 am Post subject: |
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| PBRstreetgang21 wrote: |
| Quote: |
but with the way Korea sees women and the hundreds of years of thinking they are worthless I cannot see modern Korea giving up that practice.
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What family in South Korea doesnt want to see their daughter succeed and do well? What family wouldn't grieve if they lost her, or if she fell into trouble? |
When i was helping some international students at my school one of the girls was given a new name in Korean by her parents after she was second girl to be born. "Unwanted." As soon as she was out of high school was kicked out. Luckily, she was taken in by some of her not so close relatives that were nothing like her family. Yeah, I know, one example, and that since she was born over 20 years it shows it's a little dated.
Actually, with as fast as some parts of Korea are changing I would have to say that most of the things I "knew" about Korea that have been fairly set have become dated.
That being said, I still think Ajjuma and Ajjoshi are the bane to the expansion of Korea. The only thing that seems to keep people thinking Korea has a lot of decent people are the female students going abroad that have been making a good impression and a few of the guys (2 good : 7 bad from my limited experience) |
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scytale
Joined: 26 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 1:49 am Post subject: |
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| Look, I'm from the US. Unless a politician gets caught with a gay hooker or shoots one of his buddies in the face, it barely even registers. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 3:16 am Post subject: |
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| ryouga013 wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| ;]We initially put students from Korea, Singapore, China and Japan in the same class (usually 6-7) but had to stop this integrating of nationals after the Koreans continually questioned and ridiculed some Western standards such as sexism and working with women as equals in a business environment. Notwithstanding the past bad blood between Chinese and Japanese, we were able to keep them in the same class together and had no issues with the business |
Your answer is right here... Korean students were sent there to learn about Western culture and business ethic and continually fought against it, even breaking the law within the classroom. If this were people from the US or Canada going to Korea and doing the same, they should be charged extra as well AS LONG AS THERE IS A STRONG TENDENCY. It seems at this school it was a problem most of the time. |
I never wrote this. That was hack.
And I wonder why it took THREE sexual harrassment incidents for the student in question to be dismissed. Two verbal and one physical. Heck many companies/schools would fire/kick out someone the first time.
And you don't charge people extra for causing problems, you don't bring them in in the first place OR you have some kind of screening process (like an interview). Then again I guess that would jeopardize the money earning process. It just seems funny given how he claims he is trying to teach them about WESTERN BUSINESS PRACTISES while at the same time doing something which would be illegal under WESTERN BUSINESS PRACTISES. Imagine if say Microsoft hired Korean employees and discriminated against them by paying them less, or charging them more for sending them to workshops to upgrade their skills.
It's a private school so they can do what they want...but they should at least practise what they preach. |
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ryouga013
Joined: 14 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 5:11 am Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
I never wrote this. That was hack.
And I wonder why it took THREE sexual harrassment incidents for the student in question to be dismissed. Two verbal and one physical. Heck many companies/schools would fire/kick out someone the first time.
And you don't charge people extra for causing problems, you don't bring them in in the first place OR you have some kind of screening process (like an interview). Then again I guess that would jeopardize the money earning process. It just seems funny given how he claims he is trying to teach them about WESTERN BUSINESS PRACTISES while at the same time doing something which would be illegal under WESTERN BUSINESS PRACTISES. Imagine if say Microsoft hired Korean employees and discriminated against them by paying them less, or charging them more for sending them to workshops to upgrade their skills.
It's a private school so they can do what they want...but they should at least practise what they preach. |
Sorry about the Urbanmyth. Wouldn't it be within Western business practices to discriminate as long as it was written in the contract? At least that seems like how it works anyways... |
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Bagpipes11
Joined: 10 Nov 2006
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 8:54 am Post subject: |
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| PBRstreetgang21 wrote: |
| Quote: |
but with the way Korea sees women and the hundreds of years of thinking they are worthless I cannot see modern Korea giving up that practice.
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I really think you are reading WAY over generalizing to the point hysteria with that comment. Women in Korea, and Asian societies in general have alsways occuppied a lower status yes. There is zero argument there. However, I dont think there are many societies where the status and the thoughts on women are advancing more than in Korea. Im not saying Korea treats women the way we in the West have come to see they should be treated, however I think Korea is moving in that direction far faster than its far wealthier neighbor to the East.
Also I hardly think the NY Time just said "Oh ok...we'll take it" without at least some fact checking.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/23/world/asia/23skorea.html?_r=1&scp=5&sq=korean+women&st=nyt&oref=slogin
I think its important to have perspective on this issue. This is a country where a household is run by woman. A man is expected to hand over his paycheck to her and put the power of the purse in HER hands. Women occupy far more political power in Korean that in China, Japan, or many other asian nations. Are they lagging in the business world? Yes, but then again they are lagging in the business world in the States too.
Too say that modern day Korean society doesnt value women and sees them as worthless is a absolutely ridiculous, infamaltory, and most importantly IGNORANT statement to make. What family in South Korea doesnt want to see their daughter succeed and do well? What family wouldn't grieve if they lost her, or if she fell into trouble?
If women were worthless I dont think Lee Myung Bak woild be cursing the existence of Park Geun hye right now.
And I wouldnt be suprised if she ends up taking the presidency when he's out the door. Women may be behind the finish line here....but they are in the fast lane to equality compared to China or Japan. |
This is a very good post. I don't think that anybody will refute that Korean families don't care about their mothers or daughters. Yes, of course they want to see them do well. But women who are educated in Korea past high school are educated after their brother's educational needs have been taken care of.
Since Korea's industrial revolution, more women have been going to college because their families have more disposable income to do so.
Males still have a much higher earning potential than females in Korea. So if you had a son and a daughter, and could only afford to send one of them to University...from purely an economic standpoint, which one would you send??
This system breeds sexism because it is economically inclined to do so. |
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michi gnome
Joined: 15 Feb 2006
Location: Dokdo
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 9:49 am Post subject: |
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Nike--those paragons of virtue and puritanical behavior
i stand with you in shock & outrage at this example of statue-crotch-fondling depravity
perhaps all can be forgiven if the statue is somewhat hot? alas, we may never know
it's sad the best a couple of grown men could do was to cop a feel of cold, hard stone-crotch and/or ass-crevice
as hosts, and as a cultural/tourism gesture, the least Nike could have done was call them a proper escort service |
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TECO
Joined: 20 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 11:32 am Post subject: |
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| michi gnome wrote: |
| Nike--those paragons of virtue and puritanical behavior....... |
yeah - that's what i was thinking also.
true - 99% of the korean male behaviour we see wouldn't be tolerated in the feminised West. |
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yingwenlaoshi
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: ... location, location!
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| I'm off to the Philippines tonight where I look forward to seeing countless ajeoshis acting like over-grown middle school boys with platinum cards. Who knows, if things get boring I might even play the new-best-friend waegook card and join them! |
Why.
Sometimes I wonder. Just gotta.
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yingwenlaoshi
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: ... location, location!
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 6:51 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| ryouga013 wrote: |
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| ;]We initially put students from Korea, Singapore, China and Japan in the same class (usually 6-7) but had to stop this integrating of nationals after the Koreans continually questioned and ridiculed some Western standards such as sexism and working with women as equals in a business environment. Notwithstanding the past bad blood between Chinese and Japanese, we were able to keep them in the same class together and had no issues with the business |
Your answer is right here... Korean students were sent there to learn about Western culture and business ethic and continually fought against it, even breaking the law within the classroom. If this were people from the US or Canada going to Korea and doing the same, they should be charged extra as well AS LONG AS THERE IS A STRONG TENDENCY. It seems at this school it was a problem most of the time. |
I never wrote this. That was hack.
And I wonder why it took THREE sexual harrassment incidents for the student in question to be dismissed. Two verbal and one physical. Heck many companies/schools would fire/kick out someone the first time.
And you don't charge people extra for causing problems, you don't bring them in in the first place OR you have some kind of screening process (like an interview). Then again I guess that would jeopardize the money earning process. It just seems funny given how he claims he is trying to teach them about WESTERN BUSINESS PRACTISES while at the same time doing something which would be illegal under WESTERN BUSINESS PRACTISES. Imagine if say Microsoft hired Korean employees and discriminated against them by paying them less, or charging them more for sending them to workshops to upgrade their skills.
It's a private school so they can do what they want...but they should at least practise what they preach. |
Yeah, but what's that got to do with "Short Circuit"? The best movie of all time. |
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Scorpion
Joined: 15 Apr 2012
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| Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| In honor of the "Another ajoshie gets in trouble thread" I'm bumbing this older thread. Same theme..Korean reps behaving badly overseas. |
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optik404
Joined: 24 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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So Nike gets mad at them for touching a statue and horrifying the employees.
But little Asian kids working in sweatshops is just fine with Nike. |
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