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Omkara
Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Location: USA
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catman
Joined: 18 Jul 2004
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 Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Great issue for the Republicans to exploit. |
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Omkara
Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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"Exploit" is the right word. . .
Office at the price of a minority class . . . exploit prejudice . . . ignore science . . . |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree. Exploit is the right word. The Culture Wars have a way of overshadowing real problems for a lot of voters. I think it's called the fear factor. |
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traveler81
Joined: 18 Mar 2008
Location: Byeongjeom, Gyeonggi-do
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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Science? Can someone point me to any study that has conclusively proved that homosexuality is genetic and not a lifestyle choice? I know that there have been studies that have shown a proclivity or predisposition to it, but not a 1:1 connection between a specific gene and homosexuality.
Personally, I think government should get out of the business of marriage. However, seeing as their already in it they should simply open up all avenues of unions--hetero, homo, poly, incestuous, bestial, etc. I mean why not? It's the person's right. |
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Omkara
Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not sure where to find the studies right now, but some interesting facts I've seen are:
1) Every time a mother has a male child, the probability of that male child being homosexual increases.
2) That when the hair-swirl on the back of someone's head is counter-clockwise, the probability that that person is homosexual is higher.
Mind you, these are statistical tendencies, and they are statistically significant by a wide margine. The margin implies that homosexuality has heredity as a major, even at times sufficient, causal factor.
Why are you so quick to link homosexuality to perverse sexual acts? Is the union of a man and a woman only defined by the sexual act? Can people see no dignity in homosexual love? Who, then, is perverted? |
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Tarmangani
Joined: 17 Apr 2006
Location: the Calm
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Good for them. They can now enjoy things like divorce, alimony, California community property laws, and an increase in the number of pillows with bite marks in them in all the bay area honeymoon suites |
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jim_we
Joined: 06 May 2004
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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| I can't wait for the People's Republic of California to fall into the ocean. But it's been a PC sewer for decades, anyway! |
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Omkara
Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 10:07 pm Post subject: |
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| jim_we wrote: |
| I can't wait for the People's Republic of California to fall into the ocean. But it's been a PC sewer for decades, anyway! |
PC Sewer? PC has more to do with euphemism and proper use of terms, does it not?
This is civil rights . . . gotta love the progressive mind!
As for enjoying divorce, I'm sure that'll be less messy than their heterosexual counterparts. . .no children. And finally, they'll get some property and tax rights. . . maybe one day we'll treat them as human beings, and not bite-marks in pillows.
Imagine if your brother, sister or daughter happened to be born homosexual. . .would you not want for their civil liberties? |
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traveler81
Joined: 18 Mar 2008
Location: Byeongjeom, Gyeonggi-do
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Omkara wrote: |
I'm not sure where to find the studies right now, but some interesting facts I've seen are:
1) Every time a mother has a male child, the probability of that male child being homosexual increases.
2) That when the hair-swirl on the back of someone's head is counter-clockwise, the probability that that person is homosexual is higher.
Mind you, these are statistical tendencies, and they are statistically significant by a wide margine. The margin implies that homosexuality has heredity as a major, even at times sufficient, causal factor.
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You've only listed two reasons that show probability/predisposition. Where's the direct cause? Has anyone from the Human Genome Project located the "gay gene"? It just seems to be a matter of nurture over nature, with some bump on the nature part. Take alcoholics for example. If alcoholism was an issue for one or both parents, you are more likely to have a problem with alcohol--even to the point of being psychologically and physically predisposed to that condition. Nevertheless, just because your parent is an alcoholic it doesn't necessitate that you will be one.
[/quote]
Why are you so quick to link homosexuality to perverse sexual acts? Is the union of a man and a woman only defined by the sexual act? Can people see no dignity in homosexual love? Who, then, is perverted?[/quote]
None of the examples I listed necessitate sexual acts. You yourself ask if a person can see no dignity in homosexual love. Can you not see any dignity in a man's love for his wives, a woman's love for her son, or a woman's love for her cat? I don't see polygamy as a perverse sexual act. Why should incest be any different? Given the advances in contraceptive care, a couple need not fear having a physically/mentally challenged child. Why can't a man or woman decide that they want to marry their pet? I'm not the one who is saying that any of these relationships necessitate physicality. In fact, many elderly homosexual couples no longer have regular sex--much like many elderly heterosexual couples. It's more of two old spinsters that getting married to each other.
I see a lot of dignity in homosexual love. However, I agree with Dante that it is not the highest love. It is love, don't get me wrong. However it is love that has missed the mark. Just like a hetero-couple that has their highest love in each other.
Another question related to this: What is there to keep the CEO and the CFO of some corrupt Enron-style company from exchanging vows so that they cannot be forced to testify against each other? |
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mnhnhyouh
Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Location: The Middle Kingdom
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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| traveler81 wrote: |
Another question related to this: What is there to keep the CEO and the CFO of some corrupt Enron-style company from exchanging vows so that they cannot be forced to testify against each other? |
I would guess that Enron has some fairly strong internal rules about spouses working together.
h |
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ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Omkara wrote: |
2) That when the hair-swirl on the back of someone's head is counter-clockwise, the probability that that person is homosexual is higher. |
*checks mirror* "Nooooo!!!"
*Realizes it's a mirror image*. Phew, I can go to the sauna without fear of getting a hard on.
Science doesn't say there is a gay gene, but genes do play a part.
Genes make proteins and how these behave can be unpredictable, there can also be other environmental factors such as the level of testosterone in the mother's blood during pregnancy.
Either way I see nothing wrong in it either being genetic or a life choice. It's consentual and doesn't harm anyone.
Also gay couples are perfectly capable of having children. This can be through a previous heterosexual relationship, surrogacy, sperm donor or adoption. So divorce may well get messy, though there probably a lower rate of gay parents than straight . |
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Omkara
Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Location: USA
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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| ED209 wrote: |
| Omkara wrote: |
2) That when the hair-swirl on the back of someone's head is counter-clockwise, the probability that that person is homosexual is higher. |
*checks mirror* "Nooooo!!!"
*Realizes it's a mirror image*. Phew, I can go to the sauna without fear of getting a hard on.
Science doesn't say there is a gay gene, but genes do play a part.
Genes make proteins and how these behave can be unpredictable, there can also be other environmental factors such as the level of testosterone in the mother's blood during pregnancy.
Either way I see nothing wrong in it either being genetic or a life choice. It's consentual and doesn't harm anyone.
Also gay couples are perfectly capable of having children. This can be through a previous heterosexual relationship, surrogacy, sperm donor or adoption. So divorce may well get messy, though there probably a lower rate of gay parents than straight . |
Wait, don't you need two mirrors?! |
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Grimalkin
Joined: 22 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 1:44 am Post subject: |
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| traveler81 wrote: |
Science? Can someone point me to any study that has conclusively proved that homosexuality is genetic and not a lifestyle choice? I know that there have been studies that have shown a proclivity or predisposition to it, but not a 1:1 connection between a specific gene and homosexuality.
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A lifestyle choice?
You can't be serious!
You mean you think some people actually think to themselves "mmm let me see...will I be straight or gay"....and then after weighing up the pros and cons some choose to be heterosexual and the others choose to be homosexual?
You gotta tell me what you think goes in the pros column of those who choose to be homosexual  |
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ED209
Joined: 17 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 1:55 am Post subject: |
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| Omkara wrote: |
Wait, don't you need two mirrors?! |
I'm a teacher. I have eyes in the back of my head. |
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