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Hagwon Look to Block Unqualified Foreign Teachers
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garykasparov



Joined: 27 May 2007

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 2:49 pm    Post subject: Hagwon Look to Block Unqualified Foreign Teachers Reply with quote

Hagwon Look to Block Unqualified Foreign Teachers

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2008/05/117_24409.html

By Kang Shin-who
Staff Reporter

The association of foreign language institutes or hagwon said Monday that the government should block the inflow of unqualified native English teachers, making clear its opposition to a policy to increase the number of ``questionable instructors.��

The Korea Association of Foreign Language Academies (KAFLA) complained that the government was ``recklessly�� opening the door to foreigners without building any safeguard against unqualified teachers. The association has about 7,000 members.

``The government is under the illusion that an unlimited number of English teachers exists overseas,�� said Seo Jung-sook, information director of the association. ``Inviting more foreign teachers will eventually degrade the average quality of instructors and drive up costs for us.��

Native English speakers who have no teaching experience in their 20s receive the same salaries as Koreans who have taught English for more than 10 years, she said.

The association said the Korea Immigration Service (KIS) does not retain data on foreign nationals who have had work experience here. ``No hagwon owners want to work with unqualified foreigners. Most hagwon employers terminate contracts of unacceptable foreigners, those guilty of sexual harassment or taking drugs,'' general director Choi Chang-jin said.

``However, many of these `blacklisted' foreigners return and teach English at other hagwon. I have seen a foreigner, who was expelled on drug charges, return here within three days. This is because the government does not keep records on these foreigners,'' Choi said.

The association is protesting the government's move to revise two clauses of regulations on English-teaching, or E-2 visas.

Under current rules, E-2 visa holders sign contracts with hagwon owners on a one-year basis and are required to work at least nine months at a maximum of only two locations.

The immigration authorities told the association on April 16 that it will let E-2 visa holders transfer to other working places after a month and allow them to work at more than two locations. The planned relaxation of the rules is aimed at maximizing the convenience for foreign English teachers, according to the KIS. Hagwon owners, however, are worried that this will lead to a high job turnover rate and jack up wages.

As for the proposed association for native English-speaking instructors, the owners said they will not hire teachers hired who belong to the union-like body.

``I don�t think the association will truly represent foreign English teachers, so we don�t see any point in talking with it, even if it is established,'' Choi said. KAFLA said it will take all measures possible to prevent foreign teachers from forming the representative body.

Currently, some 17,500 foreigners are registered with the KIS on English-teaching visas, but if ethnic Koreans are added, the number doubles. KIS estimates about 50,000 foreigners teach English here, including those who are doing so illegally.

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bish



Joined: 09 Jun 2007

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Hagwon Look to Block Unqualified Foreign Teachers Reply with quote

garykasparov wrote:
Hagwon Look to Block Unqualified Foreign Teachers

http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2008/05/117_24409.html

The immigration authorities told the association on April 16 that it will let E-2 visa holders transfer to other working places after a month and allow them to work at more than two locations. The planned relaxation of the rules is aimed at maximizing the convenience for foreign English teachers, according to the KIS. Hagwon owners, however, are worried that this will lead to a high job turnover rate and jack up wages.

[email protected]


They should only worry about a high turnover rate if they don't sort out the way they are with their teachers...

When will the new rules be enforced from? Sounds like an improvement (for once.)
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mehamrick



Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Location: South Korea

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
As for the proposed association for native English-speaking instructors, the owners said they will not hire teachers hired who belong to the union-like body.

``I don�t think the association will truly represent foreign English teachers, so we don�t see any point in talking with it, even if it is established,'' Choi said. KAFLA said it will take all measures possible to prevent foreign teachers from forming the representative body.


I am curious as to how they will find out if one is a member or not? I love how they are trying to keep their own shady practices hidden...
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that guy



Joined: 29 Feb 2004
Location: long gone

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 3:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
``However, many of these `blacklisted' foreigners return and teach English at other hagwon. I have seen a foreigner, who was expelled on drug charges, return here within three days. This is because the government does not keep records on these foreigners,'' Choi said.


Lie.
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Yu_Bum_suk



Joined: 25 Dec 2004

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Native English speakers who have no teaching experience in their 20s receive the same salaries as Koreans who have taught English for more than 10 years, she said. "

So in other words they pay their native Korean teachers crap.
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VanIslander



Joined: 18 Aug 2003
Location: Geoje, Hadong, Tongyeong,... now in a small coastal island town outside Gyeongsangnamdo!

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 4:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Hagwon Look to Block Unqualified Foreign Teachers Reply with quote

garykasparov wrote:
The immigration authorities told the association on April 16 that it will let E-2 visa holders transfer to other working places after a month and allow them to work at more than two locations.

After a month? ... without a letter of release?
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TexasPete



Joined: 24 May 2006
Location: Koreatown

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The planned relaxation of the rules is aimed at maximizing the convenience for foreign English teachers, according to the KIS. Hagwon owners, however, are worried that this will lead to a high job turnover rate and jack up wages.


In other words, they're worried that they may actually have to treat their employees decently in order to keep them at their poorly run, mismanaged, crappy excuse for "schools". God forbid they should actually be accountable for their actions.
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that guy



Joined: 29 Feb 2004
Location: long gone

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TexasPete wrote:
Quote:
The planned relaxation of the rules is aimed at maximizing the convenience for foreign English teachers, according to the KIS. Hagwon owners, however, are worried that this will lead to a high job turnover rate and jack up wages.



In other words, they're worried that they may actually have to treat their employees decently in order to keep them at their poorly run, mismanaged, crappy excuse for "schools". God forbid they should actually be accountable for their actions.


Yep. It's all about the bottom line.
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R. S. Refugee



Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Location: Shangra La, ROK

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The immigration authorities told the association on April 16 that it will let E-2 visa holders transfer to other working places after a month and allow them to work at more than two locations. The planned relaxation of the rules is aimed at maximizing the convenience for foreign English teachers, according to the KIS. Hagwon owners, however, are worried that this will lead to a high job turnover rate and jack up wages.


I'd like to hear more about this relaxation of the rules if anyone comes across any official or semi-official statements about them.

Some E-2s already work at more than one location. For example, ps teachers that teach at multiple schools.
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PRagic



Joined: 24 Feb 2006

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This will ensure that:

1) Foreign teachers are treated better
2) Foreign teachers can work legally to earn a better income

From a hakwon owner's persepective, though, I defintely wouldn't provide housing under these new conditions, nor would I provide a plane ticket. If newbies can exercise their option to work at more than one place and maximize their income on the economy, then they can pay their own way over and pay for their own digs. You can't have your cake and eat it, too.

In general, I think this will increase the number of long-termers in Korea, and motivate people interested in education as a career to upgrade their credentials.
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ED209



Joined: 17 Oct 2006

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

R. S. Refugee wrote:
Quote:
The immigration authorities told the association on April 16 that it will let E-2 visa holders transfer to other working places after a month and allow them to work at more than two locations. The planned relaxation of the rules is aimed at maximizing the convenience for foreign English teachers, according to the KIS. Hagwon owners, however, are worried that this will lead to a high job turnover rate and jack up wages.


I'd like to hear more about this relaxation of the rules if anyone comes across any official or semi-official statements about them.

Some E-2s already work at more than one location. For example, ps teachers that teach at multiple schools.


Maybe they mean giving the teacher the option to do this without their first bosses permission. All a step in the right direction but who is this coming from, could be any old desk jockey down at immi. Also I don't think public schools would be too happy about teachers having that much freedom.
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Hagwon Look to Block Unqualified Foreign Teachers Reply with quote

Quote:


As for the proposed association for native English-speaking instructors, the owners said they will not hire teachers hired who belong to the union-like body.

``I don�t think the association will truly represent foreign English teachers, so we don�t see any point in talking with it, even if it is established,'' Choi said. KAFLA said it will take all measures possible to prevent foreign teachers from forming the representative body.


[email protected]



And now ATEK's got a uphill battle on their hands as the hakwons are just going to ignore them.

As for the public schools, they are not likely to bother with ATEK either...the principals and VP's are NOT going to take kindly to ANY perceived challenge to their authority (real or imagined).

I can foresee a new clause being put into hakwon contracts that you can not be a member of any such organization and if it is found out that you are, you can be fired and not given severance or airfare.

And the government is much more likely to listen to voters (the hakwon employers and their workers) as opposed to people who don't have a vote (the foreign teachers).

Well it was fun while it lasted. See you (the pro-association people) again in six months then?


Last edited by TheUrbanMyth on Mon May 19, 2008 5:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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TheUrbanMyth



Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PRagic wrote:
This will ensure that:

1) Foreign teachers are treated better
2) Foreign teachers can work legally to earn a better income

From a hakwon owner's persepective, though, I defintely wouldn't provide housing under these new conditions, nor would I provide a plane ticket. If newbies can exercise their option to work at more than one place and maximize their income on the economy, then they can pay their own way over and pay for their own digs. You can't have your cake and eat it, too.

.


Most newbies tend to be people fresh out of university and don't have that kind of money. They just won't bother coming (they can't afford it). A lot of people who are here now, wouldn't be here initally if it wasn't paid for. You don't really think that hakwons haven't tried this before?
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bish



Joined: 09 Jun 2007

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PRagic wrote:
This will ensure that:

1) Foreign teachers are treated better
2) Foreign teachers can work legally to earn a better income

From a hakwon owner's persepective, though, I defintely wouldn't provide housing under these new conditions, nor would I provide a plane ticket. If newbies can exercise their option to work at more than one place and maximize their income on the economy, then they can pay their own way over and pay for their own digs. You can't have your cake and eat it, too.

In general, I think this will increase the number of long-termers in Korea, and motivate people interested in education as a career to upgrade their credentials.


I heard something about it a while back but have been suprised to see little made of it and had begun to thought I'd been mistaken when I'd read it.

If this is happening then it's good news for us. Does anyone have details? When will it happen?
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PRagic



Joined: 24 Feb 2006

PostPosted: Mon May 19, 2008 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They you'd have to sell your soul for 6 months or so to get the plane ticket and housing. No outside work for the first contract, or for the first 6 months of the contract...or some other arrangement.

As an owner, there is no way I'd pay someone's way over AND put them up in housing only to have them work at 2 or three jobs and bank away. Not a chance.
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