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Korean English Fever Betrayed by Test Scores
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Fishead soup



Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Location: Korea

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found this kind of question on an Exam for middle school students.

Which is more correct.


Paper is made of wood.
Paper is made from wood.
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Julius



Joined: 27 Jul 2006

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 5:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Koreans are too socially self-conscious and calculated when speaking. Too afraid of loss of face, too afraid to be wrong, too afraid to offend the group, too afraid to be seen as a traitor by being to keen to learn the foreign language. too afraid to be publicly corrected.

Just too afraid.
This does not lend itself to easy and spontaneous acquisition of language or speaking skills.
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rocklee



Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My Japanese students were the shyest of the lot, some even cried for suddenly becoming the centre of attention. That was an incredible learning experience for them and myself.

The Japanese and Koreans are treating English as just another subject. Drilling it into them might make them good students but that may be as far as they are willing to go. I bet you weren't crazy about the polar form of complex numbers or talk math all day long did you?

If anything, English is considered a friendly exchange and should no way be considered a "second" language to them like what it may be to Singaporeans, Malaysians, South Africans and Filipinos.

Pop culture goes a long way in the classroom, unfortunately some teachers have none.
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wylies99



Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They're just going through the motions while in class and not practicing while outside of class.
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marlow



Joined: 06 Feb 2005

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Julius wrote:

The english ability of Korea will improve radically when attitudes to the outside world change. Several decades yet. Until then, just enjoy the cash. To any serious teachers that want real job satisfaction I would advise heading for a different country. Any number of third world countries are twice as good at learning english than here.

i taught english to mozambicans with no more than a stick, writing words in the sand. They picked up the language faster than any korean I have ever taught.


Right.

I bet the Mozambicans did way better. Learning is a joke in Korea. It's all about "studying".
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mikeyboy122



Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Location: namyang

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Julius wise.
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rocklee



Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think it is the students that are showing inadequacy.

It may well be the teachers themselves, but of course it can't be any of you right?
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some waygug-in



Joined: 25 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's a whole host of things together, but the biggest that I see is trying to force people to learn something that they have no real interest in learning.

Imagine if someone told you that you had to learn Swahili or Mongolian, and then tried to convince you that you will get a better job if you do.


Koreans spend way too many hours in classrooms and it is little wonder that they have no real zest for learning.

How many friggin' hours a day do these kids sit in a desk anyway?

10, 12,14?

I had to laugh at the recent article telling about how South Koreans are the hardest working people in the world...because they spend the most hours/ day at work. It would be interesting to see a counter study that rated productivity levels during those hours. I'd bet Korea would be somewhere near last in productivity.

It's the same thing with the students, they spend far to much time putting in time and far too little time doing anything useful.

Blame the teachers if you want to, but if the gov't would back off a bit and allow us to all teach privates legally, I'd bet you'd see a vast improvement
over the next couple years. (won't happen, but....you know)

As Julius so nicely pointed out, the system won't allow us to really teach much, mostly we are putting in time as well.
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rocklee wrote:
I don't think it is the students that are showing inadequacy.

It may well be the teachers themselves, but of course it can't be any of you right?


I think it's team work, right? It is not really about the foreign teachers. The majority of teachers teaching English are Korean. You don't seem to be looking at that. The Korean teachers of the English language easily outnumber us. We are just a fraction of the English teachers out there, and there are not enough of us out there. There wouldn't need to be so many of us out there anyway if the Korean teachers would do a better job or if they knew more English. Then again, I don't know how the students are like in public schools. Also, the hagwon industry is not regulated enough for problems with corruption and the like. We do play a role in all this, but how much I am not sure. I think my students do learn a lot of English from me. I do not focus on the books, because you can't learn enough English just focusing on the curriculum. My students appreciate that. They even write down words I teach them. I know I do work very hard. I know I make a difference, but the students must do their own studying at home.
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Young FRANKenstein



Joined: 02 Oct 2006
Location: Castle Frankenstein (that's FRONKensteen)

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

rocklee wrote:
I don't think it is the students that are showing inadequacy.

It's hard to show inadequacy when one is too busy sleeping, texting in class, doing homework from another class, or spending inordinate amounts of time "in the bathroom" because they are "sick today, teacher".

To show inadequacy, one must first show some effort. Only then can one demonstrate that their effort totally sucks.
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Young FRANKenstein wrote:
rocklee wrote:
I don't think it is the students that are showing inadequacy.

It's hard to show inadequacy when one is too busy sleeping, texting in class, doing homework from another class, or spending inordinate amounts of time "in the bathroom" because they are "sick today, teacher".

To show inadequacy, one must first show some effort. Only then can one demonstrate that their effort totally sucks.



I don't think you could really put it on the students as much as you are saying. Do you know why? Well, some students are conscientious, correct?
If the majority of Koreans who teach English were very good or somewhat decent at English, then a much larger percentage of Koreans would excel at English. Since this is not the case, then the problem lies with the teachers, the teachers union, and the government.

I would like to see the Korean Government pay native speakers to teach
Korean teachers English lessons and require Korean teachers to have a minimum of English hours if they want a raise or pay them to attend the English lessons. It is cheaper in the long run then trying to bring thousands of native teachers beyond what they already have.
If they could really help the Korean teachers learn English, then you would see a major change. One of my friends teaches with an English teacher who doesn't really know how to use an English dictionary, believe it or not. I believe him. When I first taught at a hagwon, the English teacher who taught grammar couldn't understand native speakers until I really helped him with his oral English. It is not our fault that Koreas are not scoring well enough. We can only do so much within this system.
I don't blame the students.
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Young FRANKenstein



Joined: 02 Oct 2006
Location: Castle Frankenstein (that's FRONKensteen)

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adventurer wrote:
One of my friends teaches with an English teacher who doesn't really know how to use an English dictionary, believe it or not.

I've known a not insignificant number of Koreans who didn't know how to use a KOREAN dictionary. I'm looking up words within secords as I watch them flip back and forth all over the place looking for words. The word is 바보, so why are you looking under ㅊ the section?
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rsmm0224



Joined: 06 Feb 2008
Location: Changwon

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bibbitybop wrote:
Not speaking the language outside of the classroom is one huge reason no one can speak English.


I totally agree. The mother of one of my student works at the hogwon and I teach her twice a week after school. The student is about 13 or so and has a fair level of English but needs a lot of improvement.

I told them both if they want to get better they need to speak English to each other at home. They won't do it.
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wylies99



Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rocklee wrote:
I don't think it is the students that are showing inadequacy.

It may well be the teachers themselves, but of course it can't be any of you right?


Practice makes perfect. Wink
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We should remember when discussing this that so many Canadians who have had years of French cannot speak French well. How many millions of Americans have taken Spanish, but cannot speak it? However, I would suspect that more of our teachers of French and Spanish can speak those languages better than the Koreans can speak English. Of course, those languages are all European languages like English. The Korean teachers need to have their English improved. Why doesn't the government force them to have English lessons from the native speakers and take so many hours of English from a native speaker? That is cheaper than trying to get more and more foreigners. It is a no brainer of an idea.
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