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| Has abortion made your life better? |
| Yes |
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61% |
[ 19 ] |
| No |
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38% |
[ 12 ] |
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| Total Votes : 31 |
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Stormy
Joined: 10 Jan 2008
Location: Here & there
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 Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 2:07 am Post subject: |
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| riverboy wrote: |
I not too keen on the whole notion, as I see pregnancy and birth as beautiful. I also love children.
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Yeah & a woman who chooses to have an abortion for whatever reason obviously doesn't......she obviously sees pregnancy & birth as revolting & hates children...... |
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OneWayTraffic
Joined: 14 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 7:21 am Post subject: |
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| riverboy wrote: |
That's why I don't condemn those who have had abortions. I not too kkeen on the whole notion, as I see pregnancy and birth as beautiful. I also love children.
My wife and I had a little problem this spring. The doctor told her our baby's neck was thicker than normal which indicated a possibility of Down Syndrome.
We had a month to think long and hard about whether or not to abort. I wanted to keep the bat if it had Downs, I told my wife I supported her choice. Before the final test she told me she would keep the baby regardless. I fell in love with her just a little bit more that day. |
We'll see how that love is going along when he's waking you up for 3am feedings and 5am nappy changes and 7am cuddles.
Have fun! That part of my life is behind me now. (At least if I get that vasectomy.)
Of course I wouldn't go back for the world. |
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riverboy
Joined: 03 Jun 2003
Location: Incheon
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| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 8:30 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Yeah & a woman who chooses to have an abortion for whatever reason obviously doesn't......she obviously sees pregnancy & birth as revolting & hates children...... |
I don't know. Thant;s why I created this post. |
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riverboy
Joined: 03 Jun 2003
Location: Incheon
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| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 8:41 am Post subject: |
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We'll see how that love is going along when he's waking you up for 3am feedings and 5am nappy changes and 7am cuddles.
Have fun! That part of my life is behind me now. (At least if I get that vasectomy.)
Of course I wouldn't go back for the world. |
I did all that Onewaytrafiic and I loved it. I really do love fatherhood. I love my son and am even really tickled at being a father for a second time.
That's my question. dDoy reall feel that abortion has had a directly positive effect on you life |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 10:36 am Post subject: |
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Do a little reading on pro choice sites, and you'll keep coming across the phrase "every child a wanted child". To me, that sounds like wanting the best possible life for every child that is born.
You keep mentioning abortion used as birth control, that seems such a cop out to me. It's very often the same people protesting outside abortion clinics that protest sex-ed in schools and the availability of contraceptives. I'd have far more respect for those who disagree with me on this matter if they spent less time limiting women's choices, and more time making alternatives to abortion more palatable, by building affordable day care centres for example. |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:10 am Post subject: |
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| Big_Bird wrote: |
| I'd be interested to know what the percentage of males who disapprove of abortion is compared to that of females. Just anecdotally, it seems men are more likely to disapprove than women. Perhaps it's easier to judge when you are unlikely to ever fall pregant yourself. |
According to an American poll just released...
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There are no major differences between mens' and womens' stands on the issue. 40% of men believe abortion should be generally available, and 37% of women think it should be. 20% of men think it should not be permitted, and slightly more women, 24%, agree.
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This is in line with the results of a Canadian telephone survey that I worked on as a market researcher in the 1980s. More men were pro-choice than women in that poll as well.
Anecdotally, I come from a strong Catholic family on my mother's side, and the most militantly anti-choice people I know personally are women. One of my aunts has actually protested in front of abortion-providers' clinics. This has had little impact on my own views, as I do not evaluate arguments based on the gender of the person making them.
http://tinyurl.com/9tulp |
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ReeseDog
Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Location: Classified
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| Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Big_Bird wrote: |
| I'd be interested to know what the percentage of males who disapprove of abortion is compared to that of females. Just anecdotally, it seems men are more likely to disapprove than women. Perhaps it's easier to judge when you are unlikely to ever fall pregant yourself. |
Eat shit. Single father here. We got pregnant, and she wanted to abort. Only after I swore to take care of the kid did she agree not to abort the pregnancy. She left our daughter (and me) four weeks after the birth. I've raised her so far and don't have one single regret. We're just fine here.
Edit: The point of the Dog family anecdote was to impress upon y'all that there are men willing to step up and handle their lives rather than...well... |
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Stormy
Joined: 10 Jan 2008
Location: Here & there
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 1:11 am Post subject: |
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| ReeseDog wrote: |
| Big_Bird wrote: |
| I'd be interested to know what the percentage of males who disapprove of abortion is compared to that of females. Just anecdotally, it seems men are more likely to disapprove than women. Perhaps it's easier to judge when you are unlikely to ever fall pregant yourself. |
Eat shit. Single father here. We got pregnant, and she wanted to abort. Only after I swore to take care of the kid did she agree not to abort the pregnancy. She left our daughter (and me) four weeks after the birth. I've raised her so far and don't have one single regret. We're just fine here.
Edit: The point of the Dog family anecdote was to impress upon y'all that there are men willing to step up and handle their lives rather than...well... |
You're bringing your daughter to Korea? |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 4:11 am Post subject: |
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| ReeseDog wrote: |
| Big_Bird wrote: |
| I'd be interested to know what the percentage of males who disapprove of abortion is compared to that of females. Just anecdotally, it seems men are more likely to disapprove than women. Perhaps it's easier to judge when you are unlikely to ever fall pregant yourself. |
Eat shit. Single father here. We got pregnant, and she wanted to abort. Only after I swore to take care of the kid did she agree not to abort the pregnancy. She left our daughter (and me) four weeks after the birth. I've raised her so far and don't have one single regret. We're just fine here.
Edit: The point of the Dog family anecdote was to impress upon y'all that there are men willing to step up and handle their lives rather than...well... |
It doesn't take a genius to realize big bird and educated readers of this board understand there are exceptions like yours. Of course you still didn't have to carry and birth it. |
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manlyboy
Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Location: Darwin, Northern Territory, Australia
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| peppermint wrote: |
| That and it's terribly nice to live in a nation where the government recognizes that women are fully functioning, independent beings that have the right to choose what happens to their bodies. |
Their bodies? A developed foetus is perfectly capable of surviving outside of its mother's womb. The woman is not just making a decision about her body; She is making a decision about someone else's body. |
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ReeseDog
Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Location: Classified
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| Stormy wrote: |
| ReeseDog wrote: |
| Big_Bird wrote: |
| I'd be interested to know what the percentage of males who disapprove of abortion is compared to that of females. Just anecdotally, it seems men are more likely to disapprove than women. Perhaps it's easier to judge when you are unlikely to ever fall pregant yourself. |
Eat shit. Single father here. We got pregnant, and she wanted to abort. Only after I swore to take care of the kid did she agree not to abort the pregnancy. She left our daughter (and me) four weeks after the birth. I've raised her so far and don't have one single regret. We're just fine here.
Edit: The point of the Dog family anecdote was to impress upon y'all that there are men willing to step up and handle their lives rather than...well... |
You're bringing your daughter to Korea? |
Not sure about that yet. |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 1:16 pm Post subject: |
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| manlyboy wrote: |
| peppermint wrote: |
| That and it's terribly nice to live in a nation where the government recognizes that women are fully functioning, independent beings that have the right to choose what happens to their bodies. |
Their bodies? A developed foetus is perfectly capable of surviving outside of its mother's womb. The woman is not just making a decision about her body; She is making a decision about someone else's body. |
Foetuses aren't generally considered viable until after at least 20 weeks of gestation, and in the few countries where late term abortions are legal, they're only performed after that point around 1% of the time. In Canada, abortions are only carried out after 22 weeks if the health of either the foetus or mother is in jeopardy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Late-term_abortion |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:06 pm Post subject: |
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| peppermint wrote: |
| Foetuses aren't generally considered viable until after at least 20 weeks of gestation... |
People are capable of rationalizing all kinds of things, Peppermint. And when you employ euphemisms such as "viable" you only tend to confirm that you, too, are rationalizing this. (As is Mindmetoo, with his very harshly calling another poster's daughter "it.")
In any case, I still accept Roe vs. Wade as a solid compromise (only extremists seem to object to it) and I would not overturn it -- or any part of it, for that matter. In the long run, it will function humanely and it will keep the peace. Abortion seems a necessary evil in an imperfect world, then -- a pressure-valve for many, in all kinds of specific circumstances. We also recognize "excusable homocide" and "justifiable homocide," and do not call them "murder," for example -- but these acts remain a kind of homocide nonetheless. |
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peppermint
Joined: 13 May 2003
Location: traversing the minefields of caddishness.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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viable was shorthand for existing outside the womb- I was speaking to manlyboys rationalization.
Speaking as a woman, I'd find that decision a very very tough one to make, even in the first weeks of pregnancy. I'd think that for me personally, the line between foetus and baby would be crossed when I felt it move, but I'm guessing that's a fairly useless measure for legal purposes. |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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I do not think legal analyses can settle such questions. What constitutes "life?" When does life begin? Do we have the right to intervene in its processes?
These remain religious and philosophical questions. Best to keep the state entirely out of them. Leave it to individuals and their friends and families to deal with them their own way -- provided they respect Roe vs. Wade's guidelines, of course. |
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