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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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 Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 4:26 am Post subject: |
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| This involves a great deal of money because we're talking about hundreds of South Africans. The South Africans involved have been talking about these fees and showing other teachers the contracts they have with their "agency" for many months. Half of the foreign teachers in Korea probably know all about this, by now. That's why the blanket denials were ridiculed. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 6:30 am Post subject: |
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Hey, blonde reasearcher, my podcast was never meant to be an answer to all of your immigration questions -- I'd suggest that you give immigration a call with your questions. I never billed it as the perfect interview created to answer all questions, so please don't think of it as such. Actually, I never expected anyone would even assume that -- apparently you did?? It was merely a sit-down discussion about some issues facing teachers today.
I'm glad you thought so highly of the podcast in general, though -- your compliments are greatly appreciated!
As far as Andrew Ahn...
Seems to me that what's going on here is no different than a lot of companies are doing around the world. The CELTA does essentially the same thing as this Andrew Ahn guy does. Same with TEFL International.
So what's new here?
How is this different than what is going on in much of the rest of the world as far as TEFL, ESL, and other things are concerned? So those South Africans paid for a TEFL course. They took a culture course.
No, you don't need these things to teach in Korea, but then again, you don't need a tour guide to take you on a tour of South Korea if you come here to vacation, either. You can attempt to do it yourself, but your experience may not be the same.
Just what is your motive here, gentlemen?
By the way, thank you for driving several hundred people to my podcast!  |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 6:40 am Post subject: |
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| wylies99 wrote: |
| This involves a great deal of money because we're talking about hundreds of South Africans. The South Africans involved have been talking about these fees and showing other teachers the contracts they have with their "agency" for many months. Half of the foreign teachers in Korea probably know all about this, by now. That's why the blanket denials were ridiculed. |
And from what I've heard, you seem to be attempting to make this out to be a lot bigger thing than it is. It's a few disgruntled teachers running a smear campaign rather than hundreds of upset South Africans.
Again, everyone is welcome to listen to the podcast and hear what Korvia's side of the issue is. Listen for yourself, rather than assuming what's posted here is the whole story. A few upset people (a very few) won't let this go, as you can tell.
The next question you have to ask yourself is... what's their motive? |
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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 8:53 am Post subject: |
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I'm not "disgruntled."  I'm only defending my good name.
At this point, bassexpander, the facts speak for themselves.
Besides, YOU raised the issue during the podcast. If you wanted the issue to "go away", then why bring it up, again, during the podcast? |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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| wylies99 wrote: |
I'm not "disgruntled." I'm only defending my good name.
At this point, bassexpander, the facts speak for themselves.
Besides, YOU raised the issue during the podcast. If you wanted the issue to "go away", then why bring it up, again, during the podcast? |
Keep repeating yourself. People can listen for themselves and hear all they need to hear.
I'm not complaining. You seem to be the one with the vendetta. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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| comingsoon wrote: |
| What happened to the comments section on your website? |
I don't know... maybe ISP blocked you for posting pornographic material?
It's there. You just don't get to see it. |
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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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| bassexpander wrote: |
| wylies99 wrote: |
I'm not "disgruntled." I'm only defending my good name.
At this point, bassexpander, the facts speak for themselves.
Besides, YOU raised the issue during the podcast. If you wanted the issue to "go away", then why bring it up, again, during the podcast? |
Keep repeating yourself. People can listen for themselves and hear all they need to hear.
I'm not complaining. You seem to be the one with the vendetta. |
bassexpander, you brought up this issue of recruiters' fees in the podcast. It hadn't been discussed on Dave's for weeks. I have nothing personally against anyone in this matter, but stop calling everyone who disagrees with you a liar for posting what thousands of people in South Korea already know.
Why make me out to be a "bad guy" when I'm not the one making big money here? Just calm down and you'll be fine. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| wylies99 wrote: |
| bassexpander wrote: |
| wylies99 wrote: |
I'm not "disgruntled." I'm only defending my good name.
At this point, bassexpander, the facts speak for themselves.
Besides, YOU raised the issue during the podcast. If you wanted the issue to "go away", then why bring it up, again, during the podcast? |
Keep repeating yourself. People can listen for themselves and hear all they need to hear.
I'm not complaining. You seem to be the one with the vendetta. |
bassexpander, you brought up this issue of recruiters' fees in the podcast. It hadn't been discussed on Dave's for weeks. I have nothing personally against anyone in this matter, but stop calling everyone who disagrees with you a liar for posting what thousands of people in South Korea already know.
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Wow, do you see "liar" anywhere in what you quoted?
Kind of sounds like the issue you have is a fart in a blanket if thousands of people "know" about it, yet you and a buddy seem to be the only ones going on about it. It's all addressed in the podcast.
And as I mentioned before, Andrew Ahn is doing no different than many ESL businesses are doing -- providing courses, which include a TEFL course, followed by employment overseas. He was also allowing people to pay off the cost of the course on a monthly basis after they began working. Ann and Korvia were quite clear as to their involvement with that. All one needs to do is listen to the podcast.
The practice of providing a TEFL course followed by employment nothing new in the ESL industry, and is the practice of many employers, recruiters, and TEFL certificate companies. If someone does not want to get involved with a recruiter that provides them with a TEFL course followed by employment, then all they need to do is do their homework and find another deal.
Some might consider a TEFL certification and a culture course good things to take before coming to teach here.
Thanks for bumping my podcast link!
Last edited by bassexpander on Sat Jul 26, 2008 5:25 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| comingsoon wrote: |
| Did Korvia approach you about conducting an interview? |
Nope. I decided to start a podcast on my own. I called them. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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| comingsoon wrote: |
| bassexpander wrote: |
| comingsoon wrote: |
| Did Korvia approach you about conducting an interview? |
Nope. I decided to start a podcast on my own. I called them. |
If there was nothing written on Dave's ESL Cafe about about Korvia would you have called them? |
Sure. They are one of the top recruiters in South Korea. They hire people for public school jobs, and are one of the gov't approved recruiters who are allowed to do so. I was interested in their experiences in hiring teachers since the big visa changes this past year. We talked about that. They also have had many people say good things about their experiences with them (posted on here, in fact).
Why not? |
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wylies99
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 8:53 pm Post subject: |
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| bassexpander wrote: |
And from what I've heard, you seem to be attempting to make this out to be a lot bigger thing than it is. It's a few disgruntled teachers running a smear campaign rather than hundreds of upset South Africans.
The next question you have to ask yourself is... what's their motive? |
"What you've heard"? Huh? Everything I've had to say on this subject has been said, BY ME, on Dave's ESL.
"Motive"- How about doing the right thing? Is that a strange "motive"?
Speaking of "motive"-Why are YOU, bassexpander, blindly defending Korvia in this thread? Do you work for Korvia? |
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hagwonnewbie
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Location: Asia
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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| You have a nerdy voice, however the podcast seems very professional, and you speak well. You should try to create a makeshift studio space with foam and egg cartons or something to get rid that echo effect. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 11:49 pm Post subject: |
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| wylies99 wrote: |
| bassexpander wrote: |
And from what I've heard, you seem to be attempting to make this out to be a lot bigger thing than it is. It's a few disgruntled teachers running a smear campaign rather than hundreds of upset South Africans.
The next question you have to ask yourself is... what's their motive? |
"What you've heard"? Huh? Everything I've had to say on this subject has been said, BY ME, on Dave's ESL.
"Motive"- How about doing the right thing? Is that a strange "motive"?
Speaking of "motive"-Why are YOU, bassexpander, blindly defending Korvia in this thread? Do you work for Korvia? |
I think I have made it very clear that I do not.
I merely gave them the opportunity to air their side of the argument, and that seems to really upset you. I'm sorry for that.
Wylie99, what do you consider to be "the right thing?" Do you expect all recruiters to work for free? Will that satisfy you? Recruiters are in the business of recruiting to make a profit. Period.
LET ME SAY THAT AGAIN -- RECRUITERS AREN'T IN BUSINESS TO PROVIDE JOBS FOR FREE.
If one recruiter from one company (Andrew Ahn from AOCET, for example) starts a business plan where he charges teachers money for his services as part of what he's doing, and that pisses you off, then why don't you start another business plan hiring teachers for less? And if Korean companies decide to work with an individual/company like AOCET who can provide them with X number of qualified applicants and providing them a way to make money, do you expect them to turn that down just because it's "unfair" that they would make a profit along the way?
This is business, Wylee99, and on a smaller scale, it's no different than when someone buys an airline ticket from a travel agent -- assuming AOCET is the travel agent and a recruiter contracting with them in South Korea is the airline.
It's entirely up to the individual teacher to CHOOSE A BETTER DEAL IF THEY SO DESIRE. If said South Africans had bothered to do some research, they could have worked with Korvia, Footprints, or any of several others directly and not had to pay a fee. But they didn't.
Like it or not, it's called business.
It's like going to buy a car -- you should do your research and choose the car that is the best deal for you. If certain South Africans are too lazy to find a job without the help of a recruiter that charges them because they didn't do their research, then that's their own sad fate. I feel about as sorry for them as I do for the sucker who paid $31,000 for the car that they could have purchased down the street for $30,000 if they'd just gotten up off of their ass and did some googling.
The fees for Andrew Ahn's services (and a remind that Andrew Ahn is NOT Korvia) are spelled out very clearly on his site. Insofar as I can tell, the TEFL course is NOT a requirement to get a job here. Again -- people need to do their research, and I don't feel sorry for them if they don't.
http://www.aoect.com/jnk/fee_structure.html
| Quote: |
Registration Fee: R 500
- Referring the applicant�s CV for evaluation
Administration Fee: R 1500
- Assist the applicant to apply to the Immigration office in Korea (Courier fee is not included)
- Assist the applicant to apply for a work permit from the Korean Embassy in Pretoria
(Visa application fee is not included)
- Inform and assist the applicant to settle down in Korea
- An overview of the procedure in finding a teaching post in Korea
- Liaising with government schools or private institutions
- Following up the applications
- Basic orientation for Korea, Korean schools and culture. |
Personally, I would never work with the guy because even as a newbee, I would get up off my ass and find out what else is out there. This is VERY EASY TO DO by picking up any local computer and investing a little time and effort.
As for Korvia's involvement with Andrew Ahn, everyone is welcome to listen to what they have to say about it. It's all on the podcast. |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:22 am Post subject: |
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| hagwonnewbie wrote: |
| You have a nerdy voice, however the podcast seems very professional, and you speak well. You should try to create a makeshift studio space with foam and egg cartons or something to get rid that echo effect. |
The Korean ladies like my voice. Oops.. don't tell my wife I made that joke.
Oh, and it's a ways back, but I mentioned that I was playing around with a certain mic setting -- that's why it came out with the echo effect. I'm working on another way for the next podcast. It should sound much better.
Thanks for the compliments and hints! |
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bassexpander
Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Location: Someplace you'd rather be.
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:51 am Post subject: |
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And by the way, Wylee99, I do respect why you are upset about Andrew Ahn and the AOCET company business plan. Korea has a desperate need for teachers, however, and I imagine recruiting efforts like his will become more commonplace as others seek to profit off of it.
I have little sympathy past saying, "I'm sorry" and offering advice to those who fail to do their research or ask questions when signing a bad hagwon contract.
I feel much the same for those who fail to research contracts with recruiters such as Andrew Ahn and AOCET. |
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