Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Easter Clark]

^

Yeah, interview these hagwon owners / recruiters and ask them why they'll take anyone with a pulse. Then ask them why they think FTs get such a bad rap.

[bassexpander]

I understand your side of things, guys, and wanting me to talk about the negative. I feel we get enough of that as it is. I just want to be a positive voice (not entirely, but sometimes, at least).

I ran across this today, and thought I'd share it:

[i4NI]

Not just the negative per say, but the fact us teachers also acknowledge there are plenty of bad teachers. Korean people need to blame the hagwons and recruiters for bringing them in in the first place.

But a podcast with some highly qualified teachers would be good too, the only thing is the expats in Korea would probably be the only ones who'd listen to it. Then I guess the same for us acknowledging bad teachers would be pointless too right? Especially because I doubt the netizens from Daum would even bother trying to translate it, they like focus only on the negative.

Your podcasts are good so far, so I'll just trust your judgment for the next podcast.

[bassexpander]

Well, my work computer got nailed by a nasty root-kit virus this week, so it's being overhauled. I have had plans to record a show with a gentleman from Canada who left Korea a number of years back, and now works at a college there. He may have some interesting details to add about "life after teaching." I may have to reschedule, given my computer issues. I'll decide that tomorrow.

I also have an idea to interview one or two Korean teachers who work with foreigners as co-teachers. I can just about bet that these teachers will skew toward the "friendly" type, but I'd like to ask them some questions about what it's like from their end. We get just one side of it on Dave's.

Ultimately, I'd like to see my site grow into something frequented by more than just foreigners. I'd like to see it as a place, following in the idea of Galbijim, where foreigner and Koreans can exchange thought (or in my site's case, hear thought from both sides).

Just musings, at this time.

[R-Seoul]

[Cheonmunka]

Let's not put ourselves down Unposter.

[TheUrbanMyth]

[Unposter]

Cheonmunka,

Generally love your posts!

Have you seen the movie Teachers?

Of course, it is fiction but it is a pretty good movie as fiction goes.

Nick Nolte plays this teacher who used to care but now he doesn't. The school he teaches at is being sued by a former student who was graduated even though he is illiterate. JoBeth Williams plays the lawyer defending the illiterate graduate. She is also a former graduate of the same school and used to really like Nick Nolte as a teacher. When she returns to the school, she cannot believe how much has changed. It used to be a good school but now it is run down.

There are a number of bad teachers there. There is this guy named "Ditto" who just runs off worksheets and hands them to the kids. One day he dies in class and nobody notices. They just keep passing out the worksheets and filling them out. An insane guy accidentally answers a phone and is called in as a substitute teacher (not for Ditto). He totally turns the bored kids onto history by getting them to play act history. He proves to be the best teacher the students have had until he finally gets caught. The gym teacher ends up impregnating a student. She has no one to turn to so she asks Nick Nolte for help. He ends up driving her to a hospital for an abortion.

JoBeth Williams keeps pushing Nick Nolte to start caring again, eventually wearing him down and slowly he begins to change. She wants him to testify at the trial even though the Principle and the school's lawyer has pressed everyone not to. Eventually, he testifies. Before that there is a discussion between Nick Nolte and the principle about what education used to be like before all the social problems and laws and regulations changed things.

There is a great scene where a scared kid brings in a gun "to protect himself." He is shot by a police officer who is "checking" everyone's locker.

As a reward for helping the girl (but really because he testified), Nick Notle is fired, where as the gym teacher who impregnated her is just moved to another school. Hyprocracy continues...I think he does get reinstated but I cannot remember.

All this is from memory and it is a little sketchy as it is a 1980s film. Very good. It touches on a number of issues of American education. It may not be as good for a non-American audience I am not sure. I hear public schools can be different in non-American schools and teachers have different reputations.

Anyway, even if you are from New Zealand you may want to check out the movie. It is pretty good.

[Fishead soup]

Every profession has its slackers, oddballs and it's alcoholics. I don't see why EFL has to be singled out.

[ardis]

Well, I never gave the working world in the US a chance--came here promptly after graduation. So I think that kind of prevents anyone from giving a, "...so why are you HERE?" type of question.

That being said, there are definitely some questionable folk teaching here in Korea. My use of the word "questionable" is very kind.

[Yu_Bum_suk]

[Thiuda]

Bass, thanks for putting together a podcast for ESL teachers. It's great to see motivated people doing creative things.

How about doing a piece on people who became relatively successful because of their background in ESL/EFL? I'm thinking of people like David Nunan, who, I believe, also worked in Korea for a short time, Andrew Finch, Head of the English Dep't at Kyungpook NU, our very own Pragic, or, of course, Dave Sperling.

Another possible topic might be people who have completed their graduate degrees while in Korea. Did they do it online? Has it helped them? Did they do graduate work at a Korean brick-and-mortar university? How was it received in the West?

Anyway, thanks for the hard work.

[SpedEd]

Certain countries are more prone to attract losers than others. Korea has long been a fairly big loser magnet because of its generous offerings to lure teachers over there, ie., free airfare and housing. To a legitimate loser, things like these are a godsend.
However, ever since the Chris Paul Neil scandal last Fall, the powers that be in Korea have tightened the requirements to work there, thus fewer losers can obtain legal work and currently situated losers pack up for offerings elsewhere, if they can find anything.
Other countries, notably China, are picking up the slack thou. I have been unfortuante enough to work here and have come across a record number of REAL losers far outnumbering the losers I encountered while working in Korea. Drunks, junkies, and perverts everywhere over here it seems.
It's worth mentioning that not everyone is a loser in the ESL industry. Some bright attractive NORMAL people work as ESL teachers but its a largely unregulated industry that allows some of mankind's worst representations to showcase themselves in front of oblivious ESL students.

[justaguy]

I have met many drunk US soldiers who tell everyone they meet, especially the Koreans, that they are Canadian English teachers.

They believe that by pretending to be an English teacher they can have better luck trying to score with the girls and reduce their chances of getting beat up by the locals.

There is a very good chance the loser you heard about wasn't even a teacher.

[PRagic]

This topic has been floating around like a turn since I got here 15 years ago. Here's what I've learned:

1. A majority of the people coming over are right out of or recently out of university. They haven't had any experience with a general workforce, be it in education or corporateville. They meet people here who are still in college drinking mode, and who aren't necessarily motivated to settle into a career just yet. So they must be 'losers'.

Fact is, you'd meet the same type of people in any industry in your home country. It's youth, and it's character, it's not the ESL industry here per say.

2. Some people have done the corporate shuffle in their home countries and want to try something new, maybe living overseas, maybe teaching, maybe a combination of both. Some are more serious about what they do than others, which is pretty much what you'll find when people attempt to change careers in their home countries.

3. Some people indeed can't find work in their home countries; whether it's the type of degree they earned or the experience they don't have, there just isn't an employment niche for them. They want to work, so they come here because they can work and save. The vast majority of people just slug it out in their home economies and have a tough time of it, gathering a lump of debt along the way. How can you hold it against someone for wanting to bank some coin?

4. Most of the people I know who really make a successful go of it here make the choice to be here long term. They put away the 'I'm-not-going-to-be-here-much-longer' mindset and get to work becoming successful here. For some this means fewer hours, money in the bank, and time to travel, while for others this can mean income pure and simple.

All for now...