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Easter Clark
Joined: 18 Nov 2007
Location: Hiding from Yie Eun-woong
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 Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 5:32 pm Post subject: Do your students speak Banmal to you? |
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| I don't tolerate it if I catch it. How about you? |
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poet13
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Location: Just over there....throwing lemons.
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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| No way. The other students correct them. |
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jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Depends on the student. Often, if the K-teacher is there, then the K-teacher will correct the student. But that happens maybe 60% of the time. Personally, I don't really care, since it's english I'm teaching them and supposedly in the last 30 or so years, Koreans have gotten less formal. I can see in another 30 or so years there will only be 2 levels. Formal and Informal. |
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I_Am_The_Kiwi
Joined: 10 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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| excuse my ignorance but wtf is Banmal |
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Easter Clark
Joined: 18 Nov 2007
Location: Hiding from Yie Eun-woong
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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| banmal and joen-dae mal :: Language and politeness is very important in the Korean language, as it is in Japanese. There are strict hierarchies of what form of speech to use, depending on one�s relationship to the conversation partner. Banmal is informal speech � not necessarily rude, but familiar. Used only with those close to you, or younger (i.e. to a teenager or younger) � but when used between one adult to another, even if it�s older to younger, banmal may be seen as rude if sufficient familiarity has not been achieved. Joen-dae mal, then, is the polite form of speech. |
http://www.dramabeans.com/about/glossary/ |
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yingwenlaoshi
Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Location: ... location, location!
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| I'd rather they don't speak Korean to me at all. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Most of mine don't. Obviously it's much closer to broken Korean/English than Jondaemal and I do get the odd 'ani-not work-um not fix' kind of phrases from generally respectful students. If I do get a wae / mullah / upso from kids I usually either ignore it or glare at them (sometimes it's hard to tell if they're saying it to their classmates or teacher), but for something like a 'wae!!!' right in my face my students have found themselves kneeling outside the classroom a few times. |
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I_Am_The_Kiwi
Joined: 10 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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Whys it such a big deal if theyre using it in class.......Obviously better no Korean at all....but to punish them for it.
Man thats harsh. |
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jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:23 pm Post subject: |
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| I_Am_The_Kiwi wrote: |
Whys it such a big deal if theyre using it in class.......Obviously better no Korean at all....but to punish them for it.
Man thats harsh. |
It's kind of the equivalent of swearing at a teacher. But with foreigners, they seem to think english has no formal/informal divide. So, they think foreigners don't mind if they speak at a lower level. |
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poet13
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Location: Just over there....throwing lemons.
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Because students will do whatever we let them get away with. By insisting that they dialogue with us the way they would dialogue with any other teacher is a natural and easily understandable limit on familiarity. Thought about another way, if there was one set of rules for talking to Koreans, and another set of rules for talking to foreigners, I thinik it's likely that it creates more and varied confusion later on. |
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Easter Clark
Joined: 18 Nov 2007
Location: Hiding from Yie Eun-woong
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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When a student speaks banmal to a teacher, it displays a complete lack of respect, at least in my book. I'm friendly but I'm not their friend.
Yu_Bum_suk--that was the problem. I asked her to change seats and she shouted "왜!?" She's lucky she only got a stern look and a minute of me and my co-teacher berating her. The other day a student was reading one of the posters and asked a question about it. I said "Where?" She muttered something so I pointed and said "There?" To which she replied (quite loudly) "저기봐!" Again, I didn't punish her, but I made sure she and her classmates knew my feelings towards speaking to their teacher like that. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| I_Am_The_Kiwi wrote: |
Whys it such a big deal if theyre using it in class.......Obviously better no Korean at all....but to punish them for it.
Man thats harsh. |
If the kids at a New Zealand school said 'Good morning sir' to Kiwi teachers but said 'Yo Dude!' to a native-speaking Japanese teacher would you not find that a bit rude and / or racist?
Or as a more precise example, if the kids at a school in Montreal said 'vous' to all their white teachers but 'tu' to Asian teachers it would be pretty clear evidence of a lack of respect, don't you think? |
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jvalmer
Joined: 06 Jun 2003
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
If the kids at a New Zealand school said 'Good morning sir' to Kiwi teachers but said 'Yo Dude!' to a native-speaking Japanese teacher would you not find that a bit rude and / or racist?
Or as a more precise example, if the kids at a school in Montreal said 'vous' to all their white teachers but 'tu' to Asian teachers it would be pretty clear evidence of a lack of respect, don't you think? |
Sad thing is that these days, from what I hear, in Canada, the 'Yo' thing is becoming more common. |
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cruisemonkey
Joined: 04 Jul 2005
Location: Hopefully, the same place as my luggage.
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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My students know that if they want to use informal speech with me it had better be English. For the most part, it seems to work.  |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Easter Clark wrote: |
When a student speaks banmal to a teacher, it displays a complete lack of respect, at least in my book. I'm friendly but I'm not their friend.
Yu_Bum_suk--that was the problem. I asked her to change seats and she shouted "왜!?" She's lucky she only got a stern look and a minute of me and my co-teacher berating her. The other day a student was reading one of the posters and asked a question about it. I said "Where?" She muttered something so I pointed and said "There?" To which she replied (quite loudly) "저기봐!" Again, I didn't punish her, but I made sure she and her classmates knew my feelings towards speaking to their teacher like that. |
Sometimes they're just testing the waters in a kind of flirtacious way of being less formal. Instead of getting angry about it next time give her a sharp flick of you finger to her arm or ear. If she says '왜' again keep doing it until she clues in, then tell her 'I'm your teacher, not your boyfriend' in a way that keeps the atmosphere light but suggests it's not worth her doing again. |
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