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wayfarer
Joined: 05 Jun 2007
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 Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:08 pm Post subject: Grammar question |
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One of my co-teachers just told me that "I have gone to ~" is ungrammatical. She said that she was taught that the first and second person singular only use "I have been to America", and that "gone to" is only for the third person ("He has gone to America, etc).
This was bizarre to me and I told her that it is untrue. Whether to use "has" or "have" as the auxiliary verb depends on the subject of the verb, but not the choice of verb itself. Why should it be? Ridiculous.
Has anyone ever even heard of this absurd rule? She said the school even has it on the exam next month................ |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:16 pm Post subject: Re: Grammar question |
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| wayfarer wrote: |
One of my co-teachers just told me that "I have gone to ~" is ungrammatical. She said that she was taught that the first and second person singular only use "I have been to America", and that "gone to" is only for the third person ("He has gone to America, etc).
This was bizarre to me and I told her that it is untrue. Whether to use "has" or "have" as the auxiliary verb depends on the subject of the verb, but not the choice of verb itself. Why should it be? Ridiculous.
Has anyone ever even heard of this absurd rule? She said the school even has it on the exam next month................ |
It's the present perfect of to go. To go and to have can be used more or less interchangeably in this case. As her if the same applies to 'I had gone / been' or 'I will have gone / been' (where the meaning can differ slightly). |
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IncognitoHFX
Joined: 06 May 2007
Location: Yeongtong, Suwon
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:19 pm Post subject: Re: Grammar question |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
It's the present perfect of to go. |
I'm confused. Wouldn't that be past perfect? |
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wayfarer
Joined: 05 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:24 pm Post subject: Re: Grammar question |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| wayfarer wrote: |
One of my co-teachers just told me that "I have gone to ~" is ungrammatical. She said that she was taught that the first and second person singular only use "I have been to America", and that "gone to" is only for the third person ("He has gone to America, etc).
This was bizarre to me and I told her that it is untrue. Whether to use "has" or "have" as the auxiliary verb depends on the subject of the verb, but not the choice of verb itself. Why should it be? Ridiculous.
Has anyone ever even heard of this absurd rule? She said the school even has it on the exam next month................ |
It's the present perfect of to go. To go and to have can be used more or less interchangeably in this case. As her if the same applies to 'I had gone / been' or 'I will have gone / been' (where the meaning can differ slightly). |
Quite. But what makes her point completely nonsensical is that she's saying a different main verb is used depending on the pronoun. Where do they get this stuff? The choice of verb depends on context and meaning, but doesn't change for different pronouns. The conjugation of the verb changes but not the verb itself. I'd like to see a single instance where that's true.
| IncognitoHFX wrote: |
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
It's the present perfect of to go. |
I'm confused. Wouldn't that be past perfect? |
No, past perfect is had gone... but you're distracting me from my purpose, which wasn't to demonstrate my grammar geekhood, but rather the absurdity of Korean English teachers who are convinced they know what they're talking about!
I've heard people say that Korean teachers know the grammar better than us because they've studied it directly (granted, I have studied it directly too), but I haven't seen any evidence. |
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nate2008
Joined: 10 Apr 2008
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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Personally, I think that "I have gone to America" and "He has gone to America" both sound awkward. However, I cannot find any grammatical fault with using either of them.
Maybe this is how your co-teacher is thinking:
If somebody asks, "Where is your father?" You might say, "He has gone to America."
But if somebody asks, "Where are you?" You wouldn't say "I have gone to America." You would say "I am in America," or "I went to America."
I'm not saying your teacher is right, just theorizing as to their thinking. |
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Tobias
Joined: 02 Jun 2008
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:43 pm Post subject: There is no theorizing |
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[quote="nate2008"]....just theorizing as to their thinking.[/quote]
No need for theory. The Korean is spouting some home-grown rule that doesn't apply outside of SK, if it even applies here. Gone is used as the past participle no matter the subject noun/pronoun.
The present perfect is used to emphasize present status/experience/condition.
The Korean is wrong.
'Nuff said. |
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pandapanda
Joined: 22 Sep 2007
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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What? How about goodbye notes?
I'm sorry. You will never see me again. I have gone to America. Drinking soju every day was too much for me. |
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semphoon
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: Where Nowon is
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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'I have gone' means that you have gone to somewhere and not returned yet. For example a good bye note.
'I have been' means that you have gone and come back. Talking about experience.
You can use both perfectly to fit the context. I think your co-teacher is wrong. |
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jay-shi
Joined: 09 May 2004
Location: On tour
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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| semphoon wrote: |
'I have gone' means that you have gone to somewhere and not returned yet. For example a good bye note.
'I have been' means that you have gone and come back. Talking about experience.
You can use both perfectly to fit the context. I think your co-teacher is wrong. |
^^ What he said. |
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Kwangjuchicken
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Location: I was abducted by aliens on my way to Korea and forced to be an EFL teacher on this crazy planet.
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| Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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I aint here no more.
He aint here no more.
Both work well. I mean good.
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jadarite
Joined: 01 Sep 2007
Location: Andong, Yeongyang, Seoul, now Pyeongtaek
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| Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:23 am Post subject: |
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"I've gone to America." does sound strange, but "I've gone there (before)." doesn't when referring to a restaurant. I think it's ok in cases where a majority of the people could frequently go somewhere as opposed to going somewhere that is less likely to be visited by all members of a common group (ex. "I've gone to the bathroom."  ) |
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Kiwi Tart
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:20 am Post subject: |
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| Kwangjuchicken wrote: |
I aint here no more.
He aint here no more.
Both work well. I mean good.
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I snorted.   |
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Kwangjuchicken
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Location: I was abducted by aliens on my way to Korea and forced to be an EFL teacher on this crazy planet.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:11 am Post subject: |
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| Kiwi Tart wrote: |
| Kwangjuchicken wrote: |
I aint here no more.
He aint here no more.
Both work well. I mean good.
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I snorted. |
 My pleasure. |
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