| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
ardis
Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Location: Seoul
|
 Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 3:42 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| crusher_of_heads wrote: |
Tell said coteacher that as long as you're doing the roll call, they get English names |
I never understood why it was so important to take on another name while studying a language. We had to choose names in Spanish class in high school, but that definitely didn't happen in university (our professors thought it was really silly). Honestly, I think it's kind of lame that you have to re-label someone just because you don't want to pronounce their name. How times have people here whined about Koreans saying their name funny? My name comes out pretty weird here, but I'd rather be called by that name than have a Korean person say, "Uh, no...I won't call you that. I'll call you...Minsu!"
I DO think it's weird/unnecessary to do the roll call. I've never seen my co-teachers do one--they just do what someone else suggested (ask who the missing students are at the start of the class). |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Smee
Joined: 24 Dec 2004
Location: Jeollanam-do
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 3:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ardis wrote: |
| crusher_of_heads wrote: |
Tell said coteacher that as long as you're doing the roll call, they get English names |
I never understood why it was so important to take on another name while studying a language. We had to choose names in Spanish class in high school, but that definitely didn't happen in university (our professors thought it was really silly). Honestly, I think it's kind of lame that you have to re-label someone just because you don't want to pronounce their name. How times have people here whined about Koreans saying their name funny? My name comes out pretty weird here, but I'd rather be called by that name than have a Korean person say, "Uh, no...I won't call you that. I'll call you...Minsu!"
I DO think it's weird/unnecessary to do the roll call. I've never seen my co-teachers do one--they just do what someone else suggested (ask who the missing students are at the start of the class). |
I agree. I don't do English names, either. They're awkward, impersonal, and kind of offensive. "No, don't use my real name, that's a little too close, call me by something I took off the TV. I will, though, continue to say 'Hi Brian' and wave like a goofy f--k and encourage the students to do the same." Plus, kids and adults change them all the time anyway. One of my colleagues went from "Sally" (groan) to "Rachel" a few weeks ago. I'm like you can't change your name.
A few weeks ago one of the substitute teachers came up to me and said "who are you?" I answered, and asked her name and she said "Call me Silver." Um, no, so I asked her real name. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jinks
Joined: 27 Oct 2004
Location: Formerly: Lower North Island
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| sojourner1 wrote: |
I don't care about nonnative speakers of English mispronouncing when they're trying to speak English as I usually can understand a million variations. That's the beautiful feature of English that makes it a great global language. Other languages are usually not this flexible though English might once had been a very rigidly spoken language hundreds of years ago in England.
It's really a culture thing on how rigid speakers of a language are about it's pronunciation, syntax, and logic. Koreans need to lighten up a bit if they're going to do this globalization and liberalization thing.
. |
You are right when you say tolerance of NNS's pronunciation is a culture thing, but it is wrong to say that English (or any language) is more or less flexible in its phonology than other languages. There is no morphological rule in English that allows a speaker to say 'pain' tree, rather than 'pine' tree, but if the same speaker says 'main' instead of 'mine' then most people (native or fluent speakers) will make the link and get the point, especially when there is strong contextual support. I think that English speakers are tolerant of various pronunciations because English is a global language. I don't think English is a global language because its morphology is more flexible and its speakers are more tolerant of pronunciation differences.
In my experience, the mockers often have the worst English pronunciation. Your co-teacher may be power tripping you in order to level the score between her own perceived failings in English and your easy fluency. I would call her on it, especially as she is joining in with the tittering. It might be a good idea to strike while the iron is hot and sort it out now, but don't do it in front of the students. There's nothing to stop you letting her know that if she continues to mock your pronunciation you will constantly correct her errors (in a loving and non-mocking way) in front of the class.
You could also ask the department head to make some time to coach you in Korean name pronunciation - take along wads and wads of attendance print outs - because you didn't realise it was your job to take attendance in class. The HoD might take the hint and ream the co-teacher for delegating her work to someone else. Alternatively balls up the attendance and deliberately mark students absent when they are not. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Easter Clark
Joined: 18 Nov 2007
Location: Hiding from Yie Eun-woong
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Call each student's name, but do it in a way that shows you are having great difficulty pronouncing it:
"Pak-M....min? Minjuh? No? Um...How do you say that? Oh! Min Jih! Sorry--Min Ji! Min Ji! Pak Min Ji? Shouldn't that be Park? Park Min Ji. Right...You're here. OK. Good. Next...let's see. Oh, here we are. Il Su...Huh? What is it? Il Sun Hee? Hey! Hee? Really? Because that looks like Hoi. Ok." etc.
If it takes you 20 minutes or more to call the roll, you won't have to do it for long.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jellobean
Joined: 14 Mar 2006
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 5:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| OiGirl wrote: |
| Do university teachers call roll? |
I've been here long enough that I don't mangle the names (or most of them anyway) if I have them in Korean. I tell the students up front to correct me if I pronounce it wrong and they are usually very mature about it.
Alternatively, when I want them to identify themselves (like when they haven't done the homework), I usually ask for numbers because they are faster to find on the attendance list since I'm can't alphabetize Korean quickly. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
gangpae
Joined: 03 Sep 2007
Location: Busan
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 8:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Learn Hangeul and do it! Free Korean lessons. Humble pie for 2 weeks and then your Korean level will improve dramatically. You can do it. A native English speaker has all the phonetic skills to pronounce Korean properly, just a little work weeding out the interference from your English and you'll sound like a native. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
OiGirl
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Location: Hoke-y-gun
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:02 am Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks! I was starting to feel like some kind of an idiot for calling roll in Korean every day.
| jellobean wrote: |
| OiGirl wrote: |
| Do university teachers call roll? |
I've been here long enough that I don't mangle the names (or most of them anyway) if I have them in Korean. I tell the students up front to correct me if I pronounce it wrong and they are usually very mature about it.
Alternatively, when I want them to identify themselves (like when they haven't done the homework), I usually ask for numbers because they are faster to find on the attendance list since I'm can't alphabetize Korean quickly. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
crusher_of_heads
Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Location: kimbop and kimchi for kimberly!!!!
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:31 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Hank the Iconoclast wrote: |
| I'd walk out of the class if my co-teacher started to laugh at me with the kids. Unbelievable. |
Who will think of the children?
Seriously people, toughen up and get over the PC nonsense you absorbed in your uni days.
I only use it as a classroom AND coteacher management tool.
1) I don't have students asking to take pictures of me only to end up alongside CPN.
2) I don't have coteachers interrupting my class to tell me about a hike 2.5 weeks away
3) I don't have last minute happy surprises
4) I had coteacher once tell others I was going to sing and play guitar at an open stage thing before telling me-that won't happen again.
5) Because of all that, I don't have coteachers foolish enough to ask me about taking the roll.
6) I do make the students write their Korean names in English, and I ask them politely to correct me if I am pronouncing it wrong. I have never had a student mock me for it, and I've had 3 students choose to have an English name alongside their Korean name. One3rd grade gal was taking her sweet time getting started and had only written "Jo" and that is now her name.
But, the soft touch always works-I'm just lucky I haven't had my photo taken inappropriately, lucky I haven't had a coteacher interrupt my class about hikes and other such nonsense.
It's true, certain unmentionable by username Floridian poster, it's damn true. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
elavndrc
Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Location: Korea
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:31 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I've never been asked to take attendance. I assume that my co-teacher does it.
I did pick students by reading that Korean name sheet though, the first time I did it the students are all clapping and screaming. My co-teacher likes to stress that I can read and write in Korean, I guess because I also know what it is is like to learn a foreign language? The more I did it they started mimicking me so I just laugh embarrassingly. I'm not really good that the whole discipline thing, I laugh along with the kids. >.<
A month into teaching, I've realized that it's better just to call out the numbers so they can hear it.
If you HAVE to take attendance then I'd advise making a student do it. In Korean universities the professor gets a student to do it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
CentralCali
Joined: 17 May 2007
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| elavndrc wrote: |
| If you HAVE to take attendance then I'd advise making a student do it. In Korean universities the professor gets a student to do it. |
If I were teaching at a university here, I would follow that system. I would add one thing to it, though. The student I assign to take attendance would get an automatic zero for the day if I catch him writing anyone down as present when they're absent. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nobbyken
Joined: 07 Jun 2006
Location: Yongin ^^
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Many elementary kids have nicknames based loosely around there real names and some Korean word.
This is great hilarity to them, and they even laugh when the Korean teacher takes the roll.
Romanization of names doesn't help you pronounce them properly, because many will be written as their passport names. These romanizations will be wrong as they are based a system they chose a long time ago. If you spell a students name with phonetically correct use of the English alphabet, the said student will tell you it's wrong and not their name even if it sounds perfect. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
