|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
 Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:54 pm Post subject: Weisberg declares libertarianism dead |
 |
|
Most pre-mature deathknell ever.
| Quote: |
| The worst thing you can say about libertarians is that they are intellectually immature, frozen in the worldview many of them absorbed from reading Ayn Rand novels in high school. Like other ideologues, libertarians react to the world's failing to conform to their model by asking where the world went wrong. Their heroic view of capitalism makes it difficult for them to accept that markets can be irrational, misunderstand risk, and misallocate resources or that financial systems without vigorous government oversight and the capacity for pragmatic intervention constitute a recipe for disaster. They are bankrupt, and this time, there will be no bailout. |
A strawman worthy of this board.
I've always loathed Jacob Weisberg, now I know why.
Just to remind Jacob, Libertarians have been long complaining about the GOP's fiscal gluttony. Apparently, Jacob supports the bailout as well, which goes to show that he's for corporate welfare. Is there anything the gov't can't do, Jacob? Because, apparently it can't keep natioanlized investment banks from giving high discretionary bonuses to its financial traders.
I also want to remind Jacob who it was that signed the Commodities Modernization Futures Act in 2000: Bill Clinton.
Lastly, who predicted this crisis years in advance? Wasn't it libertarians? I seem to remember Ron Paul ranting at Greenspan and Bernanke to this effect.
All in all, even though I've been gravitating more centrist of late, I came out of this article thinking more highly of libertarianism and how liberalism has its healthy share of obnoxious douchebags. Please tell me how I'm wrong and Weisberg is the most genius prophet of all time. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Jacob Weisberg is my new-found hero 
I've always wondered if Ayn Rand hung out with L. Ron Hubbard. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I've always hated the world 'libertarianism'. It just sounds so damn pretentious. I prefer classical liberal.
Anyways, I read this article today and was indifferent. Just a guy writing what he hopes to be true.
The so-called Austrian school of economics is emerging very strong now. I know of several well preforming investment houses in Asia that have adopted the Austrian approach to calculating money supply and given the monetary nature of this crises, and the fact that the Austrians are the leading critics of our system as it stands, it is probably the case that a kind of libertarianism will be replaced with another. But the general idea that people ought to be as free as possible will not go away because of a fiat created financial crises.
Anyways, the economy is about as free now as the general public will allow. Us classical liberals ought to focus more on issues relating to drugs, gays, civil liberties, torture, war and the rest. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Ya-ta Boy wrote: |
Jacob Weisberg is my new-found hero
I've always wondered if Ayn Rand hung out with L. Ron Hubbard. |
I knew you would like him. He's also hair-trigger with conflating anything more left-wing than Bill Clinton with racism. The two of you should go bowling.
| mises wrote: |
But the general idea that people ought to be as free as possible will not go away because of a fiat created financial crises.
Anyways, the economy is about as free now as the general public will allow. Us classical liberals ought to focus more on issues relating to drugs, gays, civil liberties, torture, war and the rest. |
I don't think 'modern' liberals, lefties, whatever you want to call them will quite acknowledge the differences between libertarianism and other right-wing ideologies. Accordingly, insofar as drugs, civil liberties, torture, etc, these are all leftist positions and leftist positions alone.
I still wondering how Obama's going to deal with everything. Because FDR didn't come into power with a year's worth of GDP of debt. In that sense Hoover was much more gracious than Bush. But in another sense, Hoover was more leftist than Obama:
| Hoover's wikipedia entry wrote: |
| Hoover agreed to one of the largest tax increases in American history. The Revenue Act of 1932 raised income tax on the highest incomes from 25% to 63%. |
Here's an interesting perspective on Hoover v George Bush:
| Quote: |
When the stock market "crashed" in October 1929, no one thought that much about it. I once went back and read Wall Street Journal from that era, and no one said "Hey, this could be the start of a Great Depression." It was a market correction; everyone knew that stock prices were in a bubble, just like the Internet bubble that burst in 2001. Herbert Hoover did not burst the stock market bubble of 1929. George W. Bush did not burst the Internet bubble; he just happened to be President when enough people realized the party was over.
1930 was not a particularly bad year for the economy, just an ordinary recession year. So neither Hoover nor Congress did anything extraordinary. In the Congressional elections in the Fall of 1930 the Democratic Party did well, partly because of the recession and partly because the Republican Party had been in power for such a long time. The Democrats gained control of the House of Representatives, but the Republicans held on to the U. S. Senate.
As the economy worsened in 1931, Hoover tried to do more, including various kinds of aid for the unemployed and new public works projects, but Congress was not cooperating. Remember that they still did not know they were in anything but an ordinary recession. The Democrats in Congress were not New Deal Democrats. Many were segregationists from the South; many represented conservative business interests. The Democrats had little reason to cooperate with Hoover, and the most conservative Republicans, who saw Hoover as a flaming liberal, did not want to spend any taxpayer money on relief for those suffering from the recession.
In early 1932 the Reconstruction Finance Corporation was formed, but Congress underfunded it. It would later become the cornerstone of the New Deal. |
I think our greatest enemy is fear itself, and worship of the day to day undulations of the market. The gov't needs to focus more on decreasing its debt and balancing its budget and less on immediate market performance. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 8:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Kuros wrote: |
I think our greatest enemy is fear itself, and worship of the day to day undulations of the market. The gov't needs to focus more on decreasing its debt and balancing its budget and less on immediate market performance. |
Not to get all 'financial planning' tonight, but Warren Buffett says he won't buy any stock that he wouldn't feel comfortable about holding for 20 years while away from access to market information on a deserted island. Refreshing finance.google.com all day is a sure sign of someone who will one day be broke.
| Quote: |
| Accordingly, insofar as drugs, civil liberties, torture, etc, these are all leftist positions and leftist positions alone. |
Milton Friedman would try to get lefty audiences to warm to him by first explaining the libertarian argument against the war on drugs. But anyways, I don't care who is pushing the issue as long as some kind of discussion is eventually had. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2008 1:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Here's Peter Schiff two years ago telling Laffer that things are going to be bad. Peter Schiff was Ron Paul's advisor. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
|
| Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2008 8:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I just ordered his latest book. Crash Proof is excellent.
A libertarian (hardcore too) Berkley grad. Go figure. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
