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Scotticus
Joined: 18 Mar 2007
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 Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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| New Balance wrote: |
p.s. I did a spot check and my shoes are off my feet. Ahhh...I'm Korean!!@ |
Maybe pkang is the reason why so many Koreans are under the impression that all westerners wear their shoes in the house? |
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Ilsanman
Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Location: Bucheon, Korea
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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| A 7 game series between US and KOrea will never happen. Korea isn't worth their time. |
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pkang0202
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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| MissSeoul wrote: |
| pkang0202 wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Anthony Kim is American. Although Koreans would like to take credit for him. |
I'd say half and half. I bet you when he goes to mommy and daddy's house, he takes his shoes off, eats kimchee, and says "요" after every sentence.
I'm pretty sure inside his house, he's a Korean. Outside his house, he's an American. |
He is more American than Korean because he is BORN in America. |
Being a Korean citizen, and being a Korean culturally are not the same thing.
Anthony Kim maybe born and raised American, but I can say with certainty that he has been exposed to Korean values/culture through his parents and that he can relate to Native Koreans BETTER than your average American.
So, I'd say he's half-half. American AND Korean due to his cultural background.
As for taking your shoes off, I never said Koreans are the only ones to take their shoes off. I just know that 99.9999% of Koreans DO take their shoes off in the house.
Does anyone know any Korean who wears their shoes in the house all day, only to take them off when going to bed?
[/b] |
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NaD00D00
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Gimpo
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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I don't understand why people keep using such subjective arguments.
The bottom line is that Korea won and America didn't.
If us Americans want to talk about how great our baseball playing is and that we're the best in the world, we need to send our players to competitions like the Olympics and the Classic to prove it.
Don't compare stats, either, because we all know that stats don't always equate to wins or losses.
If you want to say that we're the best statistically, ok that's fine. Just pull up the numbers to prove it. If you want to say that we're the best against other countries, we need to prove it.
It's like people saying that the Patriots were the best team in the NFL last year, even though they lost the Super Bowl...
How does that make sense? |
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jkelly80
Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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| NaD00D00 wrote: |
I don't understand why people keep using such subjective arguments.
The bottom line is that Korea won and America didn't.
If us Americans want to talk about how great our baseball playing is and that we're the best in the world, we need to send our players to competitions like the Olympics and the Classic to prove it.
Don't compare stats, either, because we all know that stats don't always equate to wins or losses.
If you want to say that we're the best statistically, ok that's fine. Just pull up the numbers to prove it. If you want to say that we're the best against other countries, we need to prove it.
It's like people saying that the Patriots were the best team in the NFL last year, even though they lost the Super Bowl...
How does that make sense? |
Actually, stats do equate to wins and losses , over a sufficient period of time. It's called a sample size, and 162 games is more than enough to determine a quality team based on runs, runs allowed, equivalent runs, eq. runs allowed, adjusted equivalent runs, ad. eq. runs allowed. The deviation on AEQ and AEQA is something like 2.1%, which is accurate enough to determine if the Koreans and Japanese are better than the Americans, which they're not. The Americans don't care about proving we're better at baseball than the Koreans for the same reason the Russians don't care about proving they're better than Indonesians at drinking vodka--it's a fait accompli. |
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NaD00D00
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Gimpo
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| jkelly80 wrote: |
Actually, stats do equate to wins and losses , over a sufficient period of time. It's called a sample size, and 162 games is more than enough to determine a quality team based on runs, runs allowed, equivalent runs, eq. runs allowed, adjusted equivalent runs, ad. eq. runs allowed. The deviation on AEQ and AEQA is something like 2.1%, which is accurate enough to determine if the Koreans and Japanese are better than the Americans, which they're not. The Americans don't care about proving we're better at baseball than the Koreans for the same reason the Russians don't care about proving they're better than Indonesians at drinking vodka--it's a fait accompli. |
People play sports to compete. People compete to win. I don't care how good your stats are, if you blow the big game, you ARE NOT the best. That's what championships are all about, aren't they? To prove the best team of that season?
Also, in my post I said stats don't always equate to wins or losses. I am well aware that they oftentimes do. |
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i4NI
Joined: 17 May 2008
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Whirlwind wrote: |
| It ain't an excuse if it's true. Americans do not give a rat's ass about the World Baseball Classic. If Korea does, good for them, but don't expect people in the US to be wowed by what Korea did. And most of the players in MLB are American, sprinkled with other nationalities. If America truly took this "classic" seriously, they would be getting their best players together and training them TOGETHER for months before. Do you really think the Koreans would stand a chance? They'd get squashed. But Korea can continue to get their little baseball titles and plant their flags on the pitcher's mound. They can do this ONLY because the US doesn't give a shit about the "classic". The only classic that the US cares about is the World Series. I love how all the apologists/gyopos come running out of the woodwork to defend Korea's baseball success. Koreans are only successful when they have a clear advantage. See the 2002 World Cup.refs bought out. Watch the Spain/Korea game for evidence of this). Baseball in the Olympics(Korea sends its best players and they train together well before). I'll give credit to Korea if they beat a US team(one that has had an equal amount of training together) in a seven game series. Sure anyone can lucky in one game, but if Korea could do it in seven then I would say that they could make a case. If not, it's all just pissing in the wind. |
Having the best talent doesn't mean you will win. Look at the Yankees roster almost every year, they have the best talent on paper, but it does't mean they win the world series. As a Dodgers fan, I also remember years back when they spent a crapload of money to acquire great talent and they didn't even make the playoffs. If you want another sports example, look at what happened to the patriots in the superbowl. |
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jkelly80
Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:28 pm Post subject: |
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| NaD00D00 wrote: |
| jkelly80 wrote: |
Actually, stats do equate to wins and losses , over a sufficient period of time. It's called a sample size, and 162 games is more than enough to determine a quality team based on runs, runs allowed, equivalent runs, eq. runs allowed, adjusted equivalent runs, ad. eq. runs allowed. The deviation on AEQ and AEQA is something like 2.1%, which is accurate enough to determine if the Koreans and Japanese are better than the Americans, which they're not. The Americans don't care about proving we're better at baseball than the Koreans for the same reason the Russians don't care about proving they're better than Indonesians at drinking vodka--it's a fait accompli. |
People play sports to compete. People compete to win. I don't care how good your stats are, if you blow the big game, you ARE NOT the best. That's what championships are all about, aren't they? To prove the best team of that season?
Also, in my post I said stats don't always equate to wins or losses. I am well aware that they oftentimes do. |
If you play the same teams for 162 games a year, 40 man roster to 40 man roster, and THEN blow the big game after a full 8 months of head to head competition, then yes you're right. Otherwise you're just getting lucky.
The MLB has a full season and much higher stakes than anyone in Korea or Japan. They have millions of dollars at stake and a longer season with much tougher competition. Next time, bring the Korean and Japanese teams into the MLB for a 162 game, 1200 inning season and THEN see if they even QUALIFY to earn a spot in the post season. Also, put their ownership on the hook for the money that the MLB could potentially win or lose. See how quickly the Doosan Bears organziation put the squeeze on down to their trainers and coaches to influence the pitching staff, or middle infielders, to beg off playing in the tournament.
Then, do it for another five years and see how quickly their lack of talent is made evident. Or better yet, just look at the 4 or 5 Korean players who've made it to the MLB and see how they've done. Pretty unimpressive. |
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The Grumpy Senator
Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Location: Up and down the 6 line
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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| jkelly80 wrote: |
| NaD00D00 wrote: |
| jkelly80 wrote: |
Actually, stats do equate to wins and losses , over a sufficient period of time. It's called a sample size, and 162 games is more than enough to determine a quality team based on runs, runs allowed, equivalent runs, eq. runs allowed, adjusted equivalent runs, ad. eq. runs allowed. The deviation on AEQ and AEQA is something like 2.1%, which is accurate enough to determine if the Koreans and Japanese are better than the Americans, which they're not. The Americans don't care about proving we're better at baseball than the Koreans for the same reason the Russians don't care about proving they're better than Indonesians at drinking vodka--it's a fait accompli. |
People play sports to compete. People compete to win. I don't care how good your stats are, if you blow the big game, you ARE NOT the best. That's what championships are all about, aren't they? To prove the best team of that season?
Also, in my post I said stats don't always equate to wins or losses. I am well aware that they oftentimes do. |
If you play the same teams for 162 games a year, 40 man roster to 40 man roster, and THEN blow the big game after a full 8 months of head to head competition, then yes you're right. Otherwise you're just getting lucky.
The MLB has a full season and much higher stakes than anyone in Korea or Japan. They have millions of dollars at stake and a longer season with much tougher competition. Next time, bring the Korean and Japanese teams into the MLB for a 162 game, 1200 inning season and THEN see if they even QUALIFY to earn a spot in the post season. Also, put their ownership on the hook for the money that the MLB could potentially win or lose. See how quickly the Doosan Bears organziation put the squeeze on down to their trainers and coaches to influence the pitching staff, or middle infielders, to beg off playing in the tournament.
Then, do it for another five years and see how quickly their lack of talent is made evident. Or better yet, just look at the 4 or 5 Korean players who've made it to the MLB and see how they've done. Pretty unimpressive. |
What in the hell does this have to do with Korea winning the gold medal??? It is pretty obvious that MLB is the best baseball league in the world, no one is disputing that. You are comparing apples and oranges. The World Baseball Classic and the Olympics are tournaments, not 162 game leagues.
We do not know what would happen if MLB shut down and sent their best players. However, we do know what happened when they did not. |
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jkelly80
Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| What does this have to do with Korea wining a gold medal? |
Are you being willfully ignorant, or is this normal? |
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The Grumpy Senator
Joined: 13 Jan 2008
Location: Up and down the 6 line
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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What you do not get is that, nobody is saying that Korea is the best baseball nation in the world.
You are the one who got on this "Korea could not beat the US in a 162 game season" or whatever then went on to babble about Dosan paying their trainers or whatever. |
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jkelly80
Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:34 pm Post subject: |
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I'm talking about which country is better, the US or Korea, and why that is so.
It's relevant to the OP, wondering how Korea got a gold medal. They got it for the reasons I stated--the US did not put all of its resources into the Olympics or the WBC, and the fact that a 1 or 2 game tournament simply doesn't reflect which team is better. |
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NaD00D00
Joined: 10 Oct 2008
Location: Gimpo
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| jkelly80 wrote: |
If you play the same teams for 162 games a year, 40 man roster to 40 man roster, and THEN blow the big game after a full 8 months of head to head competition, then yes you're right. Otherwise you're just getting lucky.
The MLB has a full season and much higher stakes than anyone in Korea or Japan. They have millions of dollars at stake and a longer season with much tougher competition. Next time, bring the Korean and Japanese teams into the MLB for a 162 game, 1200 inning season and THEN see if they even QUALIFY to earn a spot in the post season. Also, put their ownership on the hook for the money that the MLB could potentially win or lose. See how quickly the Doosan Bears organziation put the squeeze on down to their trainers and coaches to influence the pitching staff, or middle infielders, to beg off playing in the tournament.
Then, do it for another five years and see how quickly their lack of talent is made evident. Or better yet, just look at the 4 or 5 Korean players who've made it to the MLB and see how they've done. Pretty unimpressive. |
So you mean to tell me that when an underdog wins a championship, they're just getting lucky?
And I don't understand why you keep bringing up the MLB. We're not talking about Major League Baseball. We're talking about the Olympics and the World Baseball Classic. I see where you're coming from with you statements regarding all of the games, all of the stats, and all of the money. But all of that is irrelevant when nations come to play eachother in these special sporting events.
It's like you're saying MLB is baseball. It's not. Just because it's the most competitive league in the world, which happens to be played in America, doesn't make "American baseball" the best in the world.
You're arguments totally do away with the meaning of winning and losing. It's not difficult: we lost, amidst all of the excuses.
You can come up with all of these hypothetical situations and argue about logistics and the differences between leagues all day. That's not gonna get anything anywhere. That's why we have events like the Olympics and the WBC. And if America never competes with their best, or doesn't compete to their full potential, who are we to talk crap about other countries winning it all? |
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jkelly80
Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Location: you boys like mexico?
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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When an underdog wins a championship against a team it's played once, you cannot say that's the best team around. If that underdog endured a full seaon against their competition, made a playoff and then won, it would be a different story.
These events are all about branding and advertising. |
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reactionary
Joined: 22 Oct 2006
Location: korreia
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| Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 12:51 am Post subject: |
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I remember in the 06 world baseball classic, the san diego padres beat team korea in an exhibition game...yeah, it was an exhibition game, but like another poster said, even our individual teams are often better than those of entire countries.
still it's a shame they're taking baseball out of the olympics. it's popular in the americas and in asia..shouldn't be taken out just because it isn't too hot in europe. |
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