Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Taiwantroll]

I know this is way off topic here but I don't post threads anywhere else so....

Apparently there are many people in many countries, including heads of state, and at the UN, who are protesting Israeli attacks in the Gaza strip. I hear terms being used like 'illegal' and 'inhumane'. Over the last two days, I have watched countless interviews on CNN by both parties and I have to tell you I just don't understand the Arab position.

Israel has every right to take steps to protect it's citizens. This particular incident began because Hamas fired rockets into Israel. This was clearly an aggressive act if not a declaration of war. Israel not only had a right but an obligation to retaliate. And yet it seems that everyone is crying foul.

Let's look at this in another light. Let us say, for example, that Cuba sent rockets into the U.S. and killed U.S. citizens. Would the U.S. not have an obligation to retaliate or to at least neutralize the threat?

There are claims though that Israel is attacking innocent civilians. But innocent civilians are casualties of war. More blame should be placed on Hamas for having its base of operations in civilian centers.

Unfortunately it seems there is no solution. Many Arabs are unable to see clearly on this issue. Israel has made every effort to make peace. Let us not forget that the Gaza strip was taken after an aggressive attack on Israel in the Six Day War, in an effort to prevent further aggression. And when Israel gave Gaza its independence the first thing they did was elect Hamas to power; an terrorist organization which refuses to recognize Israel and openly advocates violence against Israel. Every time Israel makes a peaceful gesture, it is met with aggression.

Is everyone so blind? I just don't understand.

[moosehead]

[Taiwantroll]

How?

[woodstock]

The next time you're on youtube punch in John Pilger. He's made some of the most courageous documentaries going. He does an informative one on the beating that the Palistinians have received for decades. I'd also recommend you look at 'informationclearinghouse.com'. It posts up news articles on various topics that don't see the light of day on main stream media. Happy reading.

[madoka]

I remember reading about a sermon by a Muslim cleric that explained that in the end, Isreal would lose because they loved life whereas Muslims loved death. Can't envy what Israel has to deal with. Here's the closest quote I could google:

"Israel is surrounded by neighbors willing to kill themselves in order to destroy it," Spengler writes. He notes that Muslims teach, "As much as you love life, we love death" - a formula found in a Palestinian Authority textbook for second graders as well.

[roknroll]

If they love death so much, why do they wail in the streets and chant slogans about taking revenge? Shouldn't they be thanking the Israelis?

On another note, the response taken by Israel is not a 'measured' one in that they protect themselves only as much as is necessary. It's no secret that if one Israeli gets killed, they kill 3,4,10 etc Arabs to send a message. (the deterence factor that never really seems to help).

[cangel]

I'm not a ME expert but from what I've read, the current peace agreement between the 2 was set to expire when Hamas decided to start lobbing mortars and home-made rockets into Israel. I think Israel's response should send a message that any aggression will be met with massive retaliation. Isn't this simple psychology? Maybe, and I doubt it, Palestinians will police themselves and uproot Hamas so as to avoid this type of retaliation. The Jews just can't find peace wherever they are throughout history. Bad luck, I guess.

[moosehead]

[oldtactics]

Just as a discussion point, I think the issue for a lot of people is that 20 Israelis have died in the last 8 years because of rockets, and Israel has killed, either directly or indirectly, thousands of people in response. The issue isn't that they have a right to defend themselves, the problem is that they're being the bully in the situation and killing indiscriminately.

My personal problem with the Israeli government is that in the middle of this 'war', they've also decided to commit genocide on the people in the Strip, through starvation/lack of supplies/lack of heat. Explain to me how the schoolchildren and the every day Palestinians who have nothing to do with Hamas deserve to be obliterated because of a war that they have nothing to do with.

That's why I'm opposed to Israeli aggression. If this was a fair fight based on legitimate states fighting legitimate states, then I'd agree with your 'casualties of war' assessment. The problem is that this isn't a fair fight, has never been, and what it is is an Israeli state on the offensive, trying to extinguish life in the Gaza Strip rather than recognize that Hamas is a terrorist group and does not speak/act for the entire area.

In my opinion.

[cangel]

Based on what I wrote in my response, what "facts" am I not up on? And yes, I know, and that's why I wrote what I did, that I am not a ME expert so please, try not to be so condescending when enlightening an ignorant fool. And, subsequently, I guess you didn't get my sarcasm (last line of my previous post)...

[Sapa]

I think Israel gets away with a lot of crap against the Palestinians. the force they use is totally disproportionate, they have a long record of killing kids who are firing sling shots at tanks, blowing up red cross vans, killing journalists, etc. How anyone can justify the killings of many civilians over the last few days is beyond me.

[aka Dave]

Reality check:

How many of you people castigating Isreal *honestly* think Palestinians want to share the land with Israel and live in harmony (haha).

And then. Calculate the number of Isralies who want live in peace with Palestinians.

Okay. [Mod edit] The PROPER calculation is about 10 to 1. Israelis want peace. Palestinians want war (the arabs simply don't accept the existence of Israel). If You can't accept this you're dishonest and fooling yourself.

[Sapa]

yes cause all Arabs are warmongering jihadists!

[aka Dave]

No. They just dont accept Israel as a viable state. It's not complicated.

[manofwar]

Isreal is going to vote for their prime minister and other leadership position soon and hammering the Pals. is a sure way for the hard core conservative Isreali government to hold their power.