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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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 Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 10:00 am Post subject: Scientists dismiss detox myth |
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Let's try again:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7808348.stm
Again the money shot quote
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Tom Wells, a chemist who took part in the research, said: "The minimum sellers of detox products should be able to offer is a clear understanding of what detox is and proof that their product actually works.
"The people we contacted could do neither." |
More on this report plus the spank down of a woman selling a "detox in a box" product and lying on the BBC and being caught:
http://www.theness.com/neurologicablog/?p=452
The money shot from that site:
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| The wonderful Ben Goldacre went up against these slicksters also. Ben read some of the absurd claims straight from their website. He was briefly taken aback when Nas AmirAhmadi from detoxinabox tried to counter him by simply lying - flat out denying that what Ben was reading was from their website (listen to the audio on Ben�s site). Fortunately, the BBC Radio4 interviewer checked the website later and did verify that Ben Goldacre was correct - which Ben confirmed quickly on his website as well. |
For those who can't grasp the obvious, when I, the BBC, and Dr. Novella use "detox" we do not refer to detox as one might use in the context of the Betty Ford. Detox is not referring to clinically established methods for helping substance abusers.
Detox in this context refers to the notion that otherwise normal healthy people in a modern environment are accumulating "toxins" from their food and environment, the detox system mammals have evolved (ie the liver) over millions of years is no longer sufficient to deal with environmental toxins, and we need to buy special products or follow special regimes to cleanse our body of these toxins.
It is this notion that is not supported by science. Sellers of products and regimes make claims not supported by good evidence. People are paying good money for what appears to be little more than the placebo effect.
Put another way:
Companies are selling a class of products that not only don't work, the sellers themselves can't seem to back their claims.
That is the central point of this post, and it does not matter if the product in question is a grapefruit pill that promises to detox and return you to the vim and vigor of a 20 year old or a computer device being widely sold at Yongsan that doesn't work as advertised.
In short, wow, look at this widespread rip off. |
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JMO
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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| hey ..just got a pm saying a flame war had been removed..hadn't been back since i played on a certain poster's habit of accusing every one of being an item of clothing commonly worn on the foot. What happened? |
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RACETRAITOR
Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Superstitious people got offended when they realised how much money they'd lost on ripoffs. |
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itaewonguy
Joined: 25 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:44 pm Post subject: |
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is there some reason why we have two threads on the same topic?
wow someone didnt take there meds this morning!! |
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greedy_bones
Joined: 01 Jul 2007
Location: not quite sure anymore
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| Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 8:56 pm Post subject: |
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| itaewonguy wrote: |
is there some reason why we have two threads on the same topic?
wow someone didnt take there meds this morning!! |
The other thread was deleted unlike the other "Atheists want God stricken from inaugural oath" thread which is still up. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:53 am Post subject: |
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| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
| Superstitious people got offended when they realised how much money they'd lost on ripoffs. |
I think one user was prompted to testing the lack of the swear filter. I think she got confused about the definition of detox and thought it meant people in legit hospitals and clinics trying to break an addiction.
Hmmm. I wonder where the detox CAM crowd got the term? |
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greedy_bones
Joined: 01 Jul 2007
Location: not quite sure anymore
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:56 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
| Superstitious people got offended when they realised how much money they'd lost on ripoffs. |
I think one user was prompted to testing the lack of the swear filter. I think she got confused about the definition of detox and thought it meant people in legit hospitals and clinics trying to break an addiction.
Hmmm. I wonder where the detox CAM crowd got the term? |
I think I was part of that. I just read the previous person's post which was riddled with profanity which wouldn't be suitable for network television and couldn't believe that in another topic, my use of a term describing a woman of ill repute, which would get by censors for any station other than the disney channel was blocked. |
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itaewonguy
Joined: 25 Mar 2003
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| greedy_bones wrote: |
| itaewonguy wrote: |
is there some reason why we have two threads on the same topic?
wow someone didnt take there meds this morning!! |
The other thread was deleted unlike the other "Atheists want God stricken from inaugural oath" thread which is still up. |
you mean this deleted thread?
http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=143913
wow how did I do that??
A MIRACLE!!  |
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Bramble
Joined: 26 Jan 2007
Location: National treasures need homes
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 12:08 am Post subject: |
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| itaewonguy wrote: |
| greedy_bones wrote: |
| itaewonguy wrote: |
is there some reason why we have two threads on the same topic?
wow someone didnt take there meds this morning!! |
The other thread was deleted unlike the other "Atheists want God stricken from inaugural oath" thread which is still up. |
you mean this deleted thread?
http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=143913
wow how did I do that??
A MIRACLE!! |
Thanks. "Detox products" don't work, and no one ever said they did. Why did the BBC even feel the need to cover this story? Do people really need to be warned about the dangers of grapefruit pills? What next, a story about spam from Nigeria?
Furthermore, everyone who's ever heard the name Betty Ford knows that detox is a reality. The extreme cases go to the Betty Ford clinic; many other seemingly healthy people are in the process of making themselves sick. I find it absurd that MM2 would deny such a thing.
So let's pat the BBC on the back for pointing out the obvious, and then ask why they chose such a ridiculous and misleading headline for their article. |
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greedy_bones
Joined: 01 Jul 2007
Location: not quite sure anymore
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:57 am Post subject: |
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| Bramble wrote: |
| itaewonguy wrote: |
| greedy_bones wrote: |
| itaewonguy wrote: |
is there some reason why we have two threads on the same topic?
wow someone didnt take there meds this morning!! |
The other thread was deleted unlike the other "Atheists want God stricken from inaugural oath" thread which is still up. |
you mean this deleted thread?
http://forums.eslcafe.com/korea/viewtopic.php?t=143913
wow how did I do that??
A MIRACLE!! |
Thanks. "Detox products" don't work, and no one ever said they did. Why did the BBC even feel the need to cover this story? Do people really need to be warned about the dangers of grapefruit pills? What next, a story about spam from Nigeria?
Furthermore, everyone who's ever heard the name Betty Ford knows that detox is a reality. The extreme cases go to the Betty Ford clinic; many other seemingly healthy people are in the process of making themselves sick. I find it absurd that MM2 would deny such a thing.
So let's pat the BBC on the back for pointing out the obvious, and then ask why they chose such a ridiculous and misleading headline for their article. |
I don't think anyone else thought that the article was about the Betty Ford variety of detox. Should stores with signs in their parking lots that say "If you are patronizing insert different store name here please do not park here" have a disclaimer that says they mean being a patron not being condescending? |
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Bramble
Joined: 26 Jan 2007
Location: National treasures need homes
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:04 am Post subject: |
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^WTF
The article had nothing to do with detox; it dealt with fraudulent claims about products. MM2 is making it into something it's not. |
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Underwaterbob
Joined: 08 Jan 2005
Location: In Cognito
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:15 am Post subject: |
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| Holy misunderstandings Batman! |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:49 am Post subject: |
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| Bramble wrote: |
^WTF
The article had nothing to do with detox; it dealt with fraudulent claims about products. MM2 is making it into something it's not. |
Could you define detox for us.
And yes healthy many people are buying these evidence free products and following these prescribed regimes (some without any evidence of not only their effectiveness but their safety). Just yesterday a doctor I know in Korea was giddy about the detox program (as in detox as I defined it in the OP) she was about to start and the large amounts of money she thought she was going to be making. |
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