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expat2001
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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 Posted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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| bogey666 wrote: |
hi guys, appreciate the feedback
no I really haven't tried much manipulation YET.. but I will if this "sticking point" holds of course.
I was trying to elicit feedback in order to decide what kind of manipulation should take place, that's all.
and don't worry caniff, I appreciate sharkey's input but I'm quite old school when it comes to lifting.. (Arnold's Encyclopedia remains the Bible)
so I will definitely try more weight, less reps, the TRADITIONAL approach over his unconventional one.
and yeah.. I will tinker with the diet again. |
you cant beat 5x5.
Prior to te steroid era , the old timers did alot of triples ,doubles and singles.
They were strong and natural.
Arnolds....bible??? are you serious
Try DINASOUR TRAINING. Their isnt a better book on the market. |
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cdninkorea
Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:34 am Post subject: |
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| expat2001 wrote: |
| Try DINASOUR TRAINING. Their isnt a better book on the market. |
Tell us about it, please. |
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Temporary
Joined: 13 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:49 am Post subject: |
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Bogey
You obviously haven't worked out very much to make a claim that supplements do nothing. You haven't done any real research about nutrients. If you were serious about lifting you wouldn't be asking a bunch of ESLers which on the most part are some of the unhealthy people I have ever known. If you want good solid advice go to bodybuilding.com or t-nation.com lots of great articles there and a forum dedicated to lifters. Sorry but you reek of lazyness becuase all it would have taken is google to give you the answer you seek.
Sharkey is just an ignorant ignoranus when it comes to working out.
I can testify that Tons of reps at low weight DOES NOTHING TO BUILD substential strength. It doesn't mean there is no use for high rep excercises. |
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semphoon
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: Where Nowon is
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:11 am Post subject: |
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This is just from my experience.
I had been lifting 3 or 4 times a week and thought I was being intense enough. I would do 10-12 reps maybe 3 sets or more. One day I started talking to a guy from my work and I mentioned that I dont seem to change much. He suggested that I just try one warm up set and then go as heavy as possible (maybe its called stripping). If I can do 3 reps, then I have to increase the weight until I cant even do 1 rep. After I have found my 1 rep, I take of some weight and and try to force out 2. I do this until I can do 5 reps.
Also, I started taking creatine. I had tried it once before and didnt see any difference. The same guy at work gave me about a weeks supply, and that, coupled with the heavier lifting programme has really changed me. It might be just psychological, but the creatine has made me - more intense, more focused, rest between sets shorter, stronger, want to stay in the gym and work longer, recover quicker and given me bigger size.
I dont care what other people say, I KNOW this has worked for me for the two reasons that I have stated above. I have spent the hours, endured the pains etc and I know the results. I might be different from most - I also thought protein shakes didnt work very well for me until I started this heavy lifting programme. |
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DrOctagon
Joined: 11 Jun 2008
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:52 am Post subject: |
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http://www.stronglifts.com
This works best for me, and you only have to workout 3 days a week. |
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expat2001
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:53 am Post subject: |
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| cdninkorea wrote: |
| expat2001 wrote: |
| Try DINASOUR TRAINING. Their isnt a better book on the market. |
Tell us about it, please. |
Im not trying to be an as@ ,but Im really surprised none of you have heard of it.
Dinosaur Training is written by Brooks Kubik.
http://www.brookskubik.com
The book is about how wrestlers ,weightlifters and carnival strong men use to train before the era of steroids and supplements.
Brooks maintains that the best way to train is to keep it really basic -SQUATS ,DEADLIFTS ,SNATCHES ,CLEANS ,BENCH PRESSES ,STANDING MILITARY PRESSES just to name a few
I ve seen this book on U TORRENT .
Another real good book is PRACTICAL PROGRAMMING for Strength Training-written by Mark Ripptoe and lon kilgore.
Ripptoe is the guy who started CROSSFIT.
This boook will teach you how to develop a program and why.
I think I bought it at IRONMIND.COM
Another good book is " Only the strong shall survive" by bill starr.
Many of todays strenght coaches ,at one time or another ,studied under STARR. |
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bogey666
Joined: 17 Mar 2008
Location: Korea, the ass free zone
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:21 am Post subject: |
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| Temporary wrote: |
Bogey
You obviously haven't worked out very much to make a claim that supplements do nothing. You haven't done any real research about nutrients. If you were serious about lifting you wouldn't be asking a bunch of ESLers which on the most part are some of the unhealthy people I have ever known. If you want good solid advice go to bodybuilding.com or t-nation.com lots of great articles there and a forum dedicated to lifters. Sorry but you reek of lazyness becuase all it would have taken is google to give you the answer you seek.
Sharkey is just an ignorant ignoranus when it comes to working out.
I can testify that Tons of reps at low weight DOES NOTHING TO BUILD substential strength. It doesn't mean there is no use for high rep excercises. |
I've used Creatine.. and several years ago, Xenadrine.
Xenadrine definitely worked.
I found when I lifted again withhout creatine, it was pretty much the same. though I do think it helps recovery.
I've tried other stuff when younger.
when really young, tried roids once.. I can guarantee you THOSE work, but I don't feel/see the need to take them.
I think protein powder PROBABLY works a bit - I will try it, but I am fairly convinced that what they really do is create a placebo effect more than anthing else (and that placebo effect is actually a good thing, because you are driven to work out harder)
but most supplements?SCAM , imo.
you are free to feel otherwise of course.
I asked people her for personal experiences with things they tried (there are some lifters here) that's all. I know the "conventional wisdom".
btw.. re stripping
been doing that for years. Pyramiding is for morons. Learned this when still in college, I went to a Lance Dreher seminar at a local gym, he was friends with the owner.
Dreher made the following point - you want to work the muscle as hard as you can... so by pyramiding you waste time and energy and never push the muscle the way it should be pushed.
ergo - I warm up.
once warmed up. I do the MAX weight I can do b/w 6-8 rep level. Obviously this means my first set is heaviest and I DESCEND from there.
I do that for everything. It's eminently LOGICAL. |
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Guri Guy
Joined: 07 Sep 2003
Location: Bamboo Island
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:32 pm Post subject: |
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| to be honest on the nutrition part, I dont diet or eat properly. I eat what I want, when i want, even its complete garbage for me. I dont really follow meals, proteins or any of that stuff. I find, if I go to the gym consistently i dont need to eat properly. Im sure it would be better for me , and i admit this. But, I am not serious about lifting, i go 5 times a week, and i follow no routine, i dont write sets down.. etc etc.. i dont even try to get that much stronger. I just go , have fun, and get the results i want. I think the main reason i dont care about nutrition is because last winter i broke my foot playing hoops, sat on my ass in front of my computer screen for about a month, ate like complete shit (pizza, ice cream, chips, whatever really) and dropped 10 pounds. I just have one of those lucky metabolisms. |
How old are you exactly? Judging by your advice, I'd say not very old. Furthermore, you can get away with eating a garbage diet when you are younger but when you get older your metabolism will slow down and your body will turn into crap. Everyone thinks they are invincible when they are younger. Do what you want with your life but don't give crap advice to other people. |
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expat2001
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:37 am Post subject: |
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| bogey666 wrote: |
| Temporary wrote: |
Bogey
You obviously haven't worked out very much to make a claim that supplements do nothing. You haven't done any real research about nutrients. If you were serious about lifting you wouldn't be asking a bunch of ESLers which on the most part are some of the unhealthy people I have ever known. If you want good solid advice go to bodybuilding.com or t-nation.com lots of great articles there and a forum dedicated to lifters. Sorry but you reek of lazyness becuase all it would have taken is google to give you the answer you seek.
Sharkey is just an ignorant ignoranus when it comes to working out.
I can testify that Tons of reps at low weight DOES NOTHING TO BUILD substential strength. It doesn't mean there is no use for high rep excercises. |
I've used Creatine.. and several years ago, Xenadrine.
Xenadrine definitely worked.
I found when I lifted again withhout creatine, it was pretty much the same. though I do think it helps recovery.
I've tried other stuff when younger.
when really young, tried roids once.. I can guarantee you THOSE work, but I don't feel/see the need to take them.
I think protein powder PROBABLY works a bit - I will try it, but I am fairly convinced that what they really do is create a placebo effect more than anthing else (and that placebo effect is actually a good thing, because you are driven to work out harder)
but most supplements?SCAM , imo.
you are free to feel otherwise of course.
I asked people her for personal experiences with things they tried (there are some lifters here) that's all. I know the "conventional wisdom".
btw.. re stripping
been doing that for years. Pyramiding is for morons. Learned this when still in college, I went to a Lance Dreher seminar at a local gym, he was friends with the owner.
Dreher made the following point - you want to work the muscle as hard as you can... so by pyramiding you waste time and energy and never push the muscle the way it should be pushed.
ergo - I warm up.
once warmed up. I do the MAX weight I can do b/w 6-8 rep level. Obviously this means my first set is heaviest and I DESCEND from there.
I do that for everything. It's eminently LOGICAL. |
I use to train using this method. For the first year , it worked really well. Then I hit a plateau .At about the same time , I had read an article written by Lee Labrada , he too was using a reverse pyramid , but noticed a plateau after a few years. After which he used a more traditional pyramid system and a form of periodazation.
What Im trying to say ,is that most routines or systems will work ,however they will only do so for a short time. |
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sharkey
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:20 am Post subject: |
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| Guri Guy wrote: |
| Quote: |
| to be honest on the nutrition part, I dont diet or eat properly. I eat what I want, when i want, even its complete garbage for me. I dont really follow meals, proteins or any of that stuff. I find, if I go to the gym consistently i dont need to eat properly. Im sure it would be better for me , and i admit this. But, I am not serious about lifting, i go 5 times a week, and i follow no routine, i dont write sets down.. etc etc.. i dont even try to get that much stronger. I just go , have fun, and get the results i want. I think the main reason i dont care about nutrition is because last winter i broke my foot playing hoops, sat on my ass in front of my computer screen for about a month, ate like complete shit (pizza, ice cream, chips, whatever really) and dropped 10 pounds. I just have one of those lucky metabolisms. |
How old are you exactly? Judging by your advice, I'd say not very old. Furthermore, you can get away with eating a garbage diet when you are younger but when you get older your metabolism will slow down and your body will turn into crap. Everyone thinks they are invincible when they are younger. Do what you want with your life but don't give crap advice to other people. |
not me sorry. maybe you. i can eat mcdonalds my whole life and still be shredded .. got lucky i guess...
how was my advice crap.. ? your post is completely wrong anyways.. i was just answering a question with the citation you quoted.. there is not one shred of advice in that piece you have quoted and attacked me for some stupid reason . chill out fatty ... dont hate the playaaaaaa hate daa gamme |
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Pink Freud
Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Location: Daegu
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| Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:25 am Post subject: |
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Personally, I have had great results with Hypertrophy-Specific Training (HST).
Also key is ignoring advice found on internet forums. At least some of it. ^^. |
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Guri Guy
Joined: 07 Sep 2003
Location: Bamboo Island
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| Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:31 am Post subject: |
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not me sorry. maybe you. i can eat mcdonalds my whole life and still be shredded .. got lucky i guess...
how was my advice crap.. ? your post is completely wrong anyways.. i was just answering a question with the citation you quoted.. there is not one shred of advice in that piece you have quoted and attacked me for some stupid reason . chill out fatty ... dont hate the playaaaaaa hate daa gamme |
I'm not a fatty. I eat a balanced diet and I exercise regularly. Suppose you are genetically gifted and you can eat a garbage diet. Good for you. However, you certainly aren't mentally gifted and that has been made abundantly obvious. Your views on training a muscle everyday without giving it time to recover are asinine at best.  |
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bogey666
Joined: 17 Mar 2008
Location: Korea, the ass free zone
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| Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:26 am Post subject: |
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guriguy I've cracked ff....fff....ffff......
sorry, just can't bring myself to say it. It's very painful and I start getting the heaves.
(was trying to tell you my age 
PERSONALLY, I have found this metabolism slowdown theory with age to be FAR overblown and a convenient excuse for people as soon as they hit their thirties to blow up like seals, whales and balloons.
oh I'm sure it exists but not nearly to the extent of the attention it gets.
also, I think the fact old(er) people move their asses LESS is at least half of this issue/problem.
also, as always, there are individual genetics, etc involved.
btw give Koreans credit.. you see a lot of adjosshi types around here who don't have any effing Michelin tires around their stomachs and I'd bet they are drinking as much if not more beer and soju and eating more than whey they were younger. |
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sharkey
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
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| Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Guri Guy wrote: |
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not me sorry. maybe you. i can eat mcdonalds my whole life and still be shredded .. got lucky i guess...
how was my advice crap.. ? your post is completely wrong anyways.. i was just answering a question with the citation you quoted.. there is not one shred of advice in that piece you have quoted and attacked me for some stupid reason . chill out fatty ... dont hate the playaaaaaa hate daa gamme |
I'm not a fatty. I eat a balanced diet and I exercise regularly. Suppose you are genetically gifted and you can eat a garbage diet. Good for you. However, you certainly aren't mentally gifted and that has been made abundantly obvious. Your views on training a muscle everyday without giving it time to recover are asinine at best. |
the more often you run , the further you will be able to run .. the more you work chest the more you will be able to bench , plain and simple. Maybe not everyday, but 3 times a week if you want to build it. |
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Guri Guy
Joined: 07 Sep 2003
Location: Bamboo Island
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| Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| the more often you run , the further you will be able to run .. the more you work chest the more you will be able to bench , plain and simple. Maybe not everyday, but 3 times a week if you want to build it. |
Three times a week is fine. Much more sensible advice. Recovery time is very important when building muscle. Just as proper nutrition and getting enough sleep is. Do what works for you I guess. Cheers. |
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