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rusty1983
Joined: 30 Jan 2007
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 Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 4:19 am Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
| mises wrote: |
Iceland is part of Europe. Culturally, historically, economically and politically.
Turkey is part of the muslim world.
Final answer. Full stop. I have a better chance of being admitted as a new EU state than does Turkey. |
You could be right. Although it looks as if at least a few Europeans are opposed to both Icelandic and Turkish membership...
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| Already Christian Democrats in the Netherlands, the party of the prime minister, are coupling their hostility with Turkey's membership of the EU to criticism of Iceland's ambitions. |
I guess another question I'd have is why now. Is it just because Iceland suddenly finds itself in the economic toilet, and wants a new currency and whatever freebies the EU is handing out? I haven't heard anything about previous Icelandic requests for membership. |
Im guessing that's right, they need it now cos they are totally fucked. However, it would be beneficial to the EU as they can impose laws on the fishing that will ultimately be of benefit to the EU.
Anyone else get the feeling the UK may be changing its currency soon? |
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ontheway
Joined: 24 Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere under the rainbow...
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 7:09 am Post subject: |
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| Anyone else get the feeling the UK may be changing its currency soon? |
They sold all the gold that used to back the pound, and now it's falling rapidly. Soon they'll be calling it the ounce. |
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bigverne
Joined: 12 May 2004
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 7:35 am Post subject: |
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| Turkey still has the death penalty, which by itself disqualifies them from EU membership. Then there's Cyprus, their horrible animal abuse traditions, the Kurdish situation, their refusal to acknowledge the Armenian Genocide, and their downright scary nationalist parties. There are TONS of reasons why Turkey is not a viable EU candidate, and religion is as big of a red herring as they come. |
All of those reasons are excuses, and even if Turkey meets all its conditions for entry, new ones will be cooked up to prohibit its accession. Turkey will not be allowed into the EU because it is too large and most importantly, too Muslim. Western Europe is already having problems with its Muslim immigrant population and does not fancy tens of millions more being allowed entry. Of course, no politician will come out and say this, but that is why the majority of Europeans are opposed to Turkish accession. |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:35 am Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
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| Turkey still has the death penalty, which by itself disqualifies them from EU membership. Then there's Cyprus, their horrible animal abuse traditions, the Kurdish situation, their refusal to acknowledge the Armenian Genocide, and their downright scary nationalist parties. There are TONS of reasons why Turkey is not a viable EU candidate, and religion is as big of a red herring as they come. |
All of those reasons are excuses, and even if Turkey meets all its conditions for entry, new ones will be cooked up to prohibit its accession. Turkey will not be allowed into the EU because it is too large and most importantly, too Muslim. Western Europe is already having problems with its Muslim immigrant population and does not fancy tens of millions more being allowed entry. Of course, no politician will come out and say this, but that is why the majority of Europeans are opposed to Turkish accession. |
Yup. |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:48 am Post subject: |
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| D-Man wrote: |
| mithridates wrote: |
Plus Turkey borders on Iraq/Syria/Iran etc., Iceland sits between Greenland and the UK; Iceland has a total of a bit over 300,000; Sweden and Denmark are already members and have a ton of treaties with Iceland that have kept it in pretty close step with the union, etc. etc.
I hope to see Turkey in the EU one day but I seriously doubt anyone will be annoyed if Iceland gets in first. It's like Switzerland deciding it wants to join. |
Why would anyone want to see Turkey in the E.U?
Apart from a tiny sliver of the country,it's Asia,not Europe, with muslim culture and traditions.
Canada or Australia should be considered for E.U membership before Turkey.Both countries have have strong European backgrounds and were developed by people from the motherland.
Turkey in the E.U would spell the final days of Europe. |
Depends on which Turkey you're talking about. Are you talking about the Turkey of 2009, or a EU membership-compliant Turkey with all these chapters closed, not to mention a recognition of a united Cyprus? If a union has a list of conditions to meet to join it strict enough that it results in a change to the country itself making the application, then we're talking about a different country than the one first making the application. And if Turkey isn't able to meet the conditions then it doesn't get in. Seems fairly simple to me. If the willpower to enter the EU is there then they'll change to fit it, and if it's not then they won't and they'll give up. |
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Chuvok
Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Location: Russia
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 11:04 am Post subject: |
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Wanna bet Israel starts lobbying for EU membership!?!  |
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blade
Joined: 30 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 6:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Chuvok wrote: |
| Wanna bet Israel starts lobbying for EU membership!?! |
Isn't Israel already America's 51st state? |
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mises
Joined: 05 Nov 2007
Location: retired
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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| blade wrote: |
| Chuvok wrote: |
| Wanna bet Israel starts lobbying for EU membership!?! |
Isn't Israel already America's 51st state? |
I thought the story is that America is a state (or vassal/client state) of Israel. I can't keep it all straight. |
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michaelambling
Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Location: Paradise
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| ontheway wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Anyone else get the feeling the UK may be changing its currency soon? |
They sold all the gold that used to back the pound, and now it's falling rapidly. Soon they'll be calling it the ounce. |
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michaelambling
Joined: 31 Dec 2008
Location: Paradise
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:35 pm Post subject: |
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| bigverne wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Turkey still has the death penalty, which by itself disqualifies them from EU membership. Then there's Cyprus, their horrible animal abuse traditions, the Kurdish situation, their refusal to acknowledge the Armenian Genocide, and their downright scary nationalist parties. There are TONS of reasons why Turkey is not a viable EU candidate, and religion is as big of a red herring as they come. |
All of those reasons are excuses, and even if Turkey meets all its conditions for entry, new ones will be cooked up to prohibit its accession. Turkey will not be allowed into the EU because it is too large and most importantly, too Muslim. Western Europe is already having problems with its Muslim immigrant population and does not fancy tens of millions more being allowed entry. Of course, no politician will come out and say this, but that is why the majority of Europeans are opposed to Turkish accession. |
Adjust your tinfoil hat. Excluding a country because it fails to meet the requirements for inclusion is not a pretense--Turkey simply disqualifies itself for MANY reasons (the ones I have above). If you got rid of those, then Turkey could be considered. Would the majority of the west be against their application because it's a Muslim country? Probably. Will Turkey fail to meet EU standards because of its cultural background? Obviously. |
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RJjr
Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: Turning on a Lamp
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| Posted: Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:02 pm Post subject: Re: Iceland to get EU membership |
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| blade wrote: |
Iceland to be fast-tracked into the EU
Plan for cash-strapped state to become member by 2011 |
2011? Will the Euro even last that long? Maybe Iceland should consider asking Turkey if they can join up in a new Byzantine or Ottoman Empire.  |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 6:44 am Post subject: |
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| Would the majority of the west be against their application because it's a Muslim country? Probably. Will Turkey fail to meet EU standards because of its cultural background? Obviously. |
I think this is about correct. It's likely true that there are a lot of Europeans who are breathing a sigh of relief that Turkey disqualifies itself on political grounds, because they don't want to come right out and admit that they're against a Muslim-majority country entering the EU. Doesn't change the fact that Turkey has several strikes against it, things which would also apply to a Christian-majority country trying to gain entry.
Mind you, can anyone show an example of a Christian-majority country that violates EU regulations in some way, but is still allowed in? I'm taken to understand that several countries(eg. Ireland) have restrictive abortion laws. Does this violate the EU code? If so, it might be evidence of a double standard, though I'd still say that Turkey's recent history of the military threatening coups places it in a somewhat distinct category. |
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blade
Joined: 30 Jun 2007
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| Posted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 3:57 pm Post subject: |
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| On the other hand wrote: |
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| Would the majority of the west be against their application because it's a Muslim country? Probably. Will Turkey fail to meet EU standards because of its cultural background? Obviously. |
I think this is about correct. It's likely true that there are a lot of Europeans who are breathing a sigh of relief that Turkey disqualifies itself on political grounds, because they don't want to come right out and admit that they're against a Muslim-majority country entering the EU. |
It doesn't bother me in the slightest that Turkey is a Muslim country. I like many other people I know feel that Turkey is just too big and undeveloped to be adsorbed even by the EU. Turkey's human rights record also leaves a lot to be desired but in time I am sure that this issue can be overcome.
| Quote: |
Mind you, can anyone show an example of a Christian-majority country that violates EU regulations in some way, but is still allowed in? I'm taken to understand that several countries(eg. Ireland) have restrictive abortion laws.Does this violate the EU code? If so, it might be evidence of a double standard |
Ireland allows woman the right to travel outside of it's borders to seek an abortion if they so choose hence Ireland is not in violation of any EU law. |
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rusty1983
Joined: 30 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Abortion is illegal in Italy too |
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On the other hand
Joined: 19 Apr 2003
Location: I walk along the avenue
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| Posted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 11:15 pm Post subject: |
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| rusty1983 wrote: |
| Abortion is illegal in Italy too |
I don't think to quite the same exent that it is illegal in Ireland.
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| In May 1978, Italian women were granted the right to terminate a pregnancy upon request during the first trimester. The law stipulates that induced abortion be confined to women whose physical and psychological health may be at risk. Although a proposal to repeal the law was considered in a 1981 national referendum, it was rejected by nearly 80% of voters. |
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| In 1993, approximately 140,000 induced abortions were performed in Italy. |
http://tinyurl.com/bz56sw |
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